The Lucy turbo build, and testing



shade

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I took a few min and did a compression test.
150-155-160-160...

The stock suzuki spec is 190-230psi. Last compression test I did, all my readings were 170-180. Low, but consistent, and that’s what it’s been since I bought the bike. Thats why I always say she’s wore out. Also worth mentioning that there was no blow by out of the crankcase breather, and no coolant in the oil. But tons of e85 in the oil. So much it raised the oil level a little.

I’m a bit puzzled by the compression test readings. Yes lower, but all within an acceptable range of one another. Makes me wonder if the rods are bent a little. Sometimes a compression test won’t always show a bad head gasket though.

I did notice that the radiator cap doesn’t seem like it’s not seated well. If the cooling system isn’t pressurized properly that can cause coolant to boil over. It be funny if this was just a rad cap issue. But the engine is still going to come out as I want to investigate a few things.
How does e85 get in the oil?
 

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Everyone is gonna freak out when you pull it apart and the parts look minty fresh! Gotta love ethonal for that!
Yes, it does an exceptional job of cleaning the insides of engines. The last time I had the pan off to put the fitting in for the oil return I took a look inside and the engine had that gold/brown tarnished color. Not anymore.
1612788
 

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How does e85 get in the oil?
In normal circumstances you’ll get fuel in the oil.

This is bad on my part as I usually change the oil before I even hit 1k miles. But I don’t think I’ve changed the oil since I put the turbo on. Oops.

E85 and cold starts don’t get along well, specially in cool weather like we’ve been having down here. So the last 2 weeks I’ve been messing with the cold start tune trying to perfect it. Many times cranking it several times trying to get to start until the battery dies. That puts a lot of fuel in the oil. Then the times I did get it started I usually didn’t let it get up to operating temp. E85 is good as sucking up water, so this didn’t help things much either.

On another note, it will be a few weeks for the rods to come in. In the meantime I’ve reached out to APE to see if they wanted to get on board with the project. I’ve decided to make this the kick off project for my YouTube build series. “500hp for $1500”. One thing I think would be a smart idea is to add a set of tool steel wrist pins to the build sheet. The walls on the factory pins are very this. A set of aftermarket pins is only $90. Cheap insurance I think.

im very excited to test this set up. 90% of guys normally don’t go past the limits of a stage 2 kit. So if this set up proves to be reliable to 500hp, 400hp would be a breeze specially knowing that stock pistons have been used for 400hp set ups for years.
 

Mathewrussell52

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In normal circumstances you’ll get fuel in the oil.

This is bad on my part as I usually change the oil before I even hit 1k miles. But I don’t think I’ve changed the oil since I put the turbo on. Oops.

E85 and cold starts don’t get along well, specially in cool weather like we’ve been having down here. So the last 2 weeks I’ve been messing with the cold start tune trying to perfect it. Many times cranking it several times trying to get to start until the battery dies. That puts a lot of fuel in the oil. Then the times I did get it started I usually didn’t let it get up to operating temp. E85 is good as sucking up water, so this didn’t help things much either.

On another note, it will be a few weeks for the rods to come in. In the meantime I’ve reached out to APE to see if they wanted to get on board with the project. I’ve decided to make this the kick off project for my YouTube build series. “500hp for $1500”. One thing I think would be a smart idea is to add a set of tool steel wrist pins to the build sheet. The walls on the factory pins are very this. A set of aftermarket pins is only $90. Cheap insurance I think.

im very excited to test this set up. 90% of guys normally don’t go past the limits of a stage 2 kit. So if this set up proves to be reliable to 500hp, 400hp would be a breeze specially knowing that stock pistons have been used for 400hp set ups for years.
In this post you say E85. Have you been testing with E85? Everything I read is E98.
 

Mathewrussell52

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Yes x98, but I’ve been generalizing. Any ethanol fuel will strip oil away if you don’t keep up on maintenance, or let it sit for too long.
Why did you choose E98 for all your test. I know pump E85 varies and it’s not everywhere. I live in Iowa so E85 is almost everywhere. Is their big gains from E98?
 

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Why did you choose E98 for all your test. I know pump E85 varies and it’s not everywhere. I live in Iowa so E85 is almost everywhere. Is their big gains from E98?
I use VP X98. It has 10% methanol added to it which helps keep things even cooler.

Out of the pump around here we usually get about E70-75. I still see close to the same gains as the x98, but the x98 is good for another 8-10hp over pump.

Another reason I use it is because sometimes customers sometimes skip drum e85 or 98, and fill up at the pump. Since these bikes can’t adjust for varying ethanol content, it’s almost like a failsafe. If the bikes tuned on x98, and say you put some E80 in it, the bike will run richer because there’s more gasoline in it. The reverse is true too. If it’s tuned on pump e70, and put e85 in, it will run leaner. Generally a swing of plus or minus 10% in ethanol content is fine. Once you go more then that the bike will run too rich, or worse, too lean.
 

shade

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Doing my best to learn from all the prior material....without bigger case studs I've read limits are like 430hp.
I dont recall if your build was going to use larger bolts or not

So do you think this is still conservative?

Rereading you are going to do main studs because they dont retorque right. Are you using aftermarket or stock.

Ultimate question is will virgin stock main bolts hold 500hp
 

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Doing my best to learn from all the prior material....without bigger case studs I've read limits are like 430hp.
I dont recall if your build was going to use larger bolts or not

So do you think this is still conservative?

Rereading you are going to do main studs because they dont retorque right. Are you using aftermarket or stock.

Ultimate question is will virgin stock main bolts hold 500hp
I’ve reused main bolts a few times. Honestly if the engine has never been apart, they seem fine to reuse like if you have a stock engine and you’re just splitting the cases to get the trans back cut. If you’re making power, it’s definitely worth just doing studs as it adds to the rigidity to the engine. I’ll touch on that in a second.

The mains and head bolts act the same way when they’re stretching and about to snap. Usually on the third step for final torque, you’ll feel the torque wrench get right before the point you know it should click, but the bolt keeps turning for several more degrees. That means the bolts well on its way to snapping. You’ll also see if you’re torquing the mains to check for your oil clearance, the journals on either side of that bolt in question usually end up being too loose because it’s not torqued properly.

I feel like oem main bolts would survive 500hp, but not reliable. Here’s what I was talking about with rigidity. If you look at stock head and main bolts, you’ll notice that just underneath the head of the bolt is thicker in diameter. Then maybe an 1/8” down, the bolt gets thinner all the way down to the threads where the diameter increases again. So for most of the distance through the cases, there’s a large gap between the bolt and the bolt hole.

APE main, and head studs are the same diameter the whole length of the stud, and fit relatively snug through the case. When you’re turning high rpm, making a lot of power, or at peak torque the cases, cylinders, head will naturally try to move around. The studs help minimize that moving around. I think that using stock main bolts and making 500hp, we would likely see the main bearings wear abnormally fast. That’s why I said they could probably do it, just not reliably.

For what it’s worth, I’d like to add in that the ARP main and head studs are not the same diameter all the way down like the APE bolts are. They are more similarly dimensioned to the OEM bolts. That’s why I usually roll my eyes when I see someone say the APE head studs are only good for 400, but the ARP bolts can hold more. I know the composition of the metal can make a difference because science and stuff, but all things similar, more mass is usually stronger.

And at the end of the day, APE main studs are actually cheaper then buying new TTY oem bolts. So it’s a no brainer.
 

shade

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I’ve reused main bolts a few times. Honestly if the engine has never been apart, they seem fine to reuse like if you have a stock engine and you’re just splitting the cases to get the trans back cut. If you’re making power, it’s definitely worth just doing studs as it adds to the rigidity to the engine. I’ll touch on that in a second.

The mains and head bolts act the same way when they’re stretching and about to snap. Usually on the third step for final torque, you’ll feel the torque wrench get right before the point you know it should click, but the bolt keeps turning for several more degrees. That means the bolts well on its way to snapping. You’ll also see if you’re torquing the mains to check for your oil clearance, the journals on either side of that bolt in question usually end up being too loose because it’s not torqued properly.

I feel like oem main bolts would survive 500hp, but not reliable. Here’s what I was talking about with rigidity. If you look at stock head and main bolts, you’ll notice that just underneath the head of the bolt is thicker in diameter. Then maybe an 1/8” down, the bolt gets thinner all the way down to the threads where the diameter increases again. So for most of the distance through the cases, there’s a large gap between the bolt and the bolt hole.

APE main, and head studs are the same diameter the whole length of the stud, and fit relatively snug through the case. When you’re turning high rpm, making a lot of power, or at peak torque the cases, cylinders, head will naturally try to move around. The studs help minimize that moving around. I think that using stock main bolts and making 500hp, we would likely see the main bearings wear abnormally fast. That’s why I said they could probably do it, just not reliably.

For what it’s worth, I’d like to add in that the ARP main and head studs are not the same diameter all the way down like the APE bolts are. They are more similarly dimensioned to the OEM bolts. That’s why I usually roll my eyes when I see someone say the APE head studs are only good for 400, but the ARP bolts can hold more. I know the composition of the metal can make a difference because science and stuff, but all things similar, more mass is usually stronger.

And at the end of the day, APE main studs are actually cheaper then buying new TTY oem bolts. So it’s a no brainer.

Awesome info. Main studs require the cases to be drilled right?
 


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