Self defense or murder?

[GNBRETT]

too little information to guess. a blurry pitch black video camera tells me nothing.

 

[Flicka]

There is not enough information in the video to make a reasonably informed decision. The video we see here begins in the middle of the events, and does not tell the whole story. To make a judgement based on on this video alone would be nothing more than conjecture.

Either way, it doesn't look good.

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

the man did in no way act threatening...attempted to reason ...begged for help...said he was scared...but did not back down from where he was LEGALLY allowed to be and documenting the law breakers...all while standing up to his RIGHT to be where he was allowed to be and defend his action of video tapeing the scenero in the hopes of ENDING the lack of respect these folks had and LACK of positive police enforcement of legitimate requests and thier obvious unwillingness to be respectfull. he only stated he would defend himself...not aggressively attack them... then ..... they rushed him OBVIOUSLY... they became the aggressor and with promise of "getting something equal" its a fair assumption they wanted to do him serious harm.... BACKING DOWN and crying wolf to the police enabling the government to be our ONLY defense is exactly why this country has become a nation of DIS - RESPECTERS. nobody and i mean nobody has a right to touch me because they feel they are big and bad. just like him.... give multiple warnings to defend yourself..after that...all they want is the rush of aggression... you do not have to be a VICTIM/MARTYR at that point for others MISGUIDED beliefs of pacification!!

He did all that while standing there confronting them. This case is almost same as Zimmerman in sense that initial wrong acts may have resulted in right acts happening. Meaning Zim should not have gotten out but once he did it seems it became a matter of self defense. This guy should not have stayed around after they backed down. 'there's fifteen of them here, they are gonna kill me, I'm scared for my life!' he says.
Well then turn around and go back inside your effin house you flipping idiot! But he didn't and initially it seems that even though I think he may be wrong in staying there they or someone rushed him and he shot em?

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

There is not enough information in the video to make a reasonably informed decision. The video we see here begins in the middle of the events, and does not tell the whole story. To make a judgement based on on this video alone would be nothing more than conjecture.

Either way, it doesn't look good.

The whole video will come out. CNN says its almost 20mins long.

 

[mrsBusawhipped]

Can't reason with DRUNK people. He should have called the cops after he asked them to quiet down.

 

[m_ridgeway]

Well then as a gun owner and one who's carried for over twenty years I would support another look at the law. I don't think a law should protect and enable one to stand in the street after coming there himself and brandish a gun threatening folks. He should have turned around and gone back inside his house and waited for the police. He should have realized he was dealing with drunks and there is no reasoning with them. I hope he goes to jail as an example and that this quells anyone else feeling so emboldened to walk down and kill someone.

I have loud parties. Sometimes the neighbors complain and sometimes the cops show up but the difference is we all remain calm. He started shouting and then they started shouting and within first minute it was already an arguement. It was bound to end badly.

That goes back to the same brandishing discussion we had the other day. I didn't read where he brandished or threatened them, I cant see that video though on my phone.

yep I agree fully on he shouldn't have been there in such a manner. This is exactly why normal people shouldn't be doing police work. i don't get wtf the point of video taping was in the first place, sounded like he went there looking for trouble, "grabbed video camera, flashlight, and gun."

I agree with your other post as this case is very similar to zimmerman, what if they guy approaching him would've got him on the ground like trayvon did, then would it be a good shoot. Personally id like to see more accountability for placing yourself in confrontations.

 

[m_ridgeway]

the man did in no way act threatening...attempted to reason ...begged for help...said he was scared...but did not back down from where he was LEGALLY allowed to be and documenting the law breakers...all while standing up to his RIGHT to be where he was allowed to be and defend his action of video tapeing the scenero in the hopes of ENDING the lack of respect these folks had and LACK of positive police enforcement of legitimate requests and thier obvious unwillingness to be respectfull. he only stated he would defend himself...not aggressively attack them... then ..... they rushed him OBVIOUSLY... they became the aggressor and with promise of "getting something equal" its a fair assumption they wanted to do him serious harm.... BACKING DOWN and crying wolf to the police enabling the government to be our ONLY defense is exactly why this country has become a nation of DIS - RESPECTERS. nobody and i mean nobody has a right to touch me because they feel they are big and bad. just like him.... give multiple warnings to defend yourself..after that...all they want is the rush of aggression... you do not have to be a VICTIM/MARTYR at that point for others MISGUIDED beliefs of pacification!!

This nation is become a bunch of gun toting vaginas imho. I remember when you got out of line someone busted your ass, now you cant touch anyone out of fear for a lawsuit or the a hole carrying a gun and letting it do the physical work his mouth got him into

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

That goes back to the same brandishing discussion we had the other day. I didn't read where he brandished or threatened them, I cant see that video though on my phone.

yep I agree fully on he shouldn't have been there in such a manner. This is exactly why normal people shouldn't be doing police work. i don't get wtf the point of video taping was in the first place, sounded like he went there looking for trouble, "grabbed video camera, flashlight, and gun."

I agree with your other post as this case is very similar to zimmerman, what if they guy approaching him would've got him on the ground like trayvon did, then would it be a good shoot. Personally id like to see more accountability for placing yourself in confrontations.

CNN played a portion of it where you can hear one of the partygoers say 'don't come over here flashing that gun!' and then that's when the guy says 'after I go in my house and come back I'm gonna be equal to you!'.

Then it just goes down hill. I really don't hear true fear in his voice. He's calmly (to me) standing there saying he's in fear of his life? Well most scared folks would make an effort to retreat and secure a better place for themselves. He stands there saying there's fifteen of them and he's gonna die? So he sticks around to see what happens? A case when a gun emboldened an idiot and I don't really care what his past profession was.

 

[chrisjp]

He did all that while standing there confronting them. This case is almost same as Zimmerman in sense that initial wrong acts may have resulted in right acts happening. Meaning Zim should not have gotten out but once he did it seems it became a matter of self defense. This guy should not have stayed around after they backed down. 'there's fifteen of them here, they are gonna kill me, I'm scared for my life!' he says.
Well then turn around and go back inside your effin house you flipping idiot! But he didn't and initially it seems that even though I think he may be wrong in staying there they or someone rushed him and he shot em?

saiid... again as i said...we have become a nation of being walked on by the minority. led around by our noses by those who speak and act out all for their selfish wants and needs, all so they can subvert our LIFE LIBERTY AND PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS all while NOT inferring on THEIR rights.and we are supposed to just observe and report and back away....NO NO NO we did not become the nation of the FREE AND THE BRAVE by cowering in a corner and dialing 911 in hopes the BIGGEST offender to our rights takes care of business!! ... no i take that back...WE are the biggest offender of our rights by being the weepy eyed back in a corner "please sir no more" population we have become and HANDING over our rights all in the name of our cowardliness!!!

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Chris the partiers had same right to happiness. Watch the video. From very first words out of both of their mouths they were yelling and confrontational. From the drunks I wound expect it but not from a sober retired fire fighter if that's supposed to mean something?
I wonder just wonder if he'd said 'hey neighbor/brother/friend the music is a bit loud can you turn it down a bit please?' what would have happened?
Heck my neighbors come over eat two lbs of fresh pork, drink three Heinekens and then on the way out say 'hey can you turn it down a bit?'

 

[m_ridgeway]

CNN played a portion of it where you can hear one of the partygoers say 'don't come over here flashing that gun!' and then that's when the guy says 'after I go in my house and come back I'm gonna be equal to you!'.

Then it just goes down hill. I really don't hear true fear in his voice. He's calmly (to me) standing there saying he's in fear of his life? Well most scared folks would make an effort to retreat and secure a better place for themselves. He stands there saying there's fifteen of them and he's gonna die? So he sticks around to see what happens? A case when a gun emboldened an idiot and I don't really care what his past profession was.

that article leaves that part out, I'm not sure if tx has open carry, I want to say they do, but maybe thats what that guy meant.

I couldn't agree more with the rest, while I feel he was wrong hell probably get off free sadly. A guy lost his life because he wants to play cop.

 

[chrisjp]

Chris the partiers had same right to happiness. Watch the video. From very first words out of both of their mouths they were yelling and confrontational. From the drunks I wound expect it but not from a sober retired fire fighter if that's supposed to mean something?
I wonder just wonder if he'd said 'hey neighbor/brother/friend the music is a bit loud can you turn it down a bit please?' what would have happened?
Heck my neighbors come over eat two lbs of fresh pork, drink three Heinekens and then on the way out say 'hey can you turn it down a bit?'

he may have.... but based on his tone throughout the entire video...he was not that worked up to sound agressive to me

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

he may have.... but based on his tone throughout the entire video...he was not that worked up to sound agressive to me

Nor does he sound too scared. Take the video out of it.
I played the video and didn't look at screen one time to let the audio portion of it stand out.
His tone as you say sounds calm. It doesn't sound like your typical 'omg help me' 911 call you hear on the tv.

 

[masterblaster]

Well the shooter was a ********, he should have called the cops and let them handle, the one guy he was video taping stated that he came over there flashing gun, that guy would have been within his rights to go to his house and shoot the camera guy dead if that was the case, you don't flash guns unless you plan yo use it, period. Now once the guy was attacked he shot someone. Yeah it seems to be a legal shoot but really, was this necessary? Just like George Z, the shooter in this case is a coward, the shooter could have easily and probably would have been shot if he came to my house flashing a gun and a camera no matter what the hell was going on. It actually sounds like he was setting up the neighbor to be able to shoot him.

 

[Busa1166]

Not sure

But if he left his own home and went to his neighbors and then "defended himself" over there, doesn't sound right.

 

[The Big Red One]

Well the shooter was a ********, he should have called the cops and let them handle, the one guy he was video taping stated that he came over there flashing gun, that guy would have been within his rights to go to his house and shoot the camera guy dead if that was the case, you don't flash guns unless you plan yo use it, period. Now once the guy was attacked he shot someone. Yeah it seems to be a legal shoot but really, was this necessary? Just like George Z, the shooter in this case is a coward, the shooter could have easily and probably would have been shot if he came to my house flashing a gun and a camera no matter what the hell was going on. It actually sounds like he was setting up the neighbor to be able to shoot him.

The shoooter knew exactly what he needed to do to try and make it a valid shoot. I'm sure he was sick and tired of these guys making drunken noise, and decided that he was going to take his camera, gun, and cell phone and go down there and make sure he covered his ass enough to possibly do a legal shoot. He did all the right things in the wrong place........we'll see if a jury thinks he planned well enough to get away with it or not.

 

[Rainbow7]

Just like George Z

Not at all comparable. Nice try though, liberal.

 

[masterblaster]

Both very comparable, stand your ground/ self defense law being used to shoot people that probably should have got an ass whooping or taken in/ talked to by the cops. Both shooters either were eager to shoot someone or were not man enough to back up their antagonizing of others. Both incidents could have easily been avoided by either party, neither initial infraction or nuisance was really worth someone dying over. George Z shoot was definitely legal here in Fla based on our law and he will walk, the politicians trying to do the legal lynching of him will probably be voted out of office in the next round of elections, as they should be. Texas, I dont know, this guy will get a jury trial, Texans from my experience living there twice are pretty level headed and this guy seems like he was setting up his neighbor for a legal shoot, which it might have been, if he did flash his gun as the guy in the video said he will be culpable in this incident.

Liberal, hehehe, first time someone ever called me that, if that suits your fancy, name call away junior.

Not at all comparable. Nice try though, liberal.

 

[skydivr]

Anyone wearing a hoodie?Problem is a CCW does not take the place of COMMON SENSE

 

[lankeeyankee]

Anyone wearing a hoodie?Problem is a CCW does not take the place of COMMON SENSE

Unfortunately we live in a country where one doesnt need common sense to get a CCW, drivers licence, and many other things that are not necessities which could harm or kill others.