Perhaps We Need To Start A Gen 3 Thread *

[Mythos]

The front on pic looks like two eyes, pretty slick but then I see the headlight and it looks like a nose above the eyes and then I can't focus...

The nose is the fender. The headlight is a forehead emblem. That helps for me.

Focus more on the fender! That is the nose, and think of the headlight as its warrior paint/helmut.

Tb3's got it.

Those artist concepts are deleting more and more bits

OK....I was hoping to find some reassurance this was not actually the real NEW BUSA! It's cool but not nearly as cool as the Gen1 and 2. Some nice styling ideas for the 1K but the busa has got to maintain that hump on the back to follow the lineage.

I'm likin it so far!!!!!
Especially the tail. Thats the only thing on my current hayabusa I'm not all that crazy about.

WHAT???!!! The tail stays!! I want a bigger hump, maybe even two! If they make it without a large hump, I'll put a Gen1 tail on it.

 

[RedBull]

What will the 3rd generation have in store for us *

 

[Mythos]

I guess I don't care about the tail. AS long as it's fast, that's all that matters. Smaller, lighter and same engine would do it for me but I can't believe they would update the styling without engine major engine changes.

 

[bigoltool]

If(!) I were a product planner at Suzuki I would be bench-marking the GT's out there right now. The KTM SuperDuke GT, Kawi H2SX etc. That starts with electronics. Not everyone wants to hear, or accept that but that's the state of the industry right now. Inertial Based Cornering ABS, Traction Control, Launch Control, Quick Shifters etc. are all the norm now. So thats the easy part the hard part is finding a competitive pricepoint for said Hayabusa. Current retail is 14.7K, the Kawi starts at 19.9 and the KTM in that same ballpark. Unless Suzuki seriously moves the bike from its current roll/market segment it cannot play at that price point, so I would imagine that the next gen Hayabusa (base model?) may come in around the 16k ballpark. They could then offer an upscale variant with better brakes, suspension, etc. all using current partsbin borrowing to keep costs low enough to be competitive.

To hit that target they will need to do a lot of value engineering. Borrowing parts from the new GSXR1000 and perhaps other models would be the logical first step. All of the suspension, wheels, brakes, dash, ECU, IMU etc. would bolt right on so that's a good start. Any expectation of significant weight loss might be a bridge too far for this platform. To meet the new Euro 4 (and perhaps even more stringent future) regulations they will also need to get greener. The VVT setup from the new GSXR also seems like a logical start, along with a more powerful ECU and a lump(!) of an exhaust system. The latter part might be the biggest hurdle of all. They have to get the bodywork aesthetically and functionally sleek enough to fulfill the Hayabusa Mission statement, as well as providing at least a marginal increase in power and torque. I am envisioning one of the now common "huge lumps" under the engine housing the Cat(s) baffling etc. and then two smaller mufflers in the traditional locations. I would guess that a conservative 220hp and 115 lb/ft should be a reasonable expectation.

Then I might look at option packages. A lot of people spend a lot of money making their bikes more comfortable, so a touring package might make sense. Heated Grips, Taller Screen, Tubular bars (from the GSX1000's) Cruise control, hard bags etc. would be awesome. Maybe a Supersport Package with the M50's and T-drive rotors and suspension from the 1000R. But that might erode some of what has made the Hayabusa so iconic, the potential aftermarket for all of the things I just mentioned, so they may not risk tooling up anything new in this regard, deferring to the aftermarket to do what they do best? Tough to tell.

I personally would be happy with a good sound starting point, no offense to anyone, but I like the fact that my bike doesn't look like everyone elses! Fun to postulate all of this in mid winter and hopefully see how much of it is close to the real deal when it finally drops.

 

[mabupa]

Looks nice from the side, besides the same ugly front fender and 1999 master cylinders. Headlight looks weird thought, maybe make the headlight bigger(?).

 

[mabupa]

https://www.bennetts.co.uk/bikesoci...y/2019_suzuki_gsx1400r_hayabusa?cid=sm_000004

View attachment 1578079

At least we won’t have to remove the tail section to get some ugly reflectors off the rear. LOL!!!

 

[ROADTOAD1340]

Even I'm getting excited now , I can almost taste that new bike freshness ... Not that I'm in the hunt for Gen 3 ... for now at least... Oh yeah , check what Bigotool posted , the GSXR1K parts bin would sure be good to raid if I was designing a lighter weight Gen 3 , check out the Brembo style floating rotors , and there's those forks again !
Where's Sixpack post about all this temptation ?? , we know he's been saving for some new wheelie weapon , that pictured Gen 3 might be just the ticket , and still provide all the previous Gens real world capabilities !? .
All you people planning on a Gen 3 , the day is coming you lucky bastards , so hang in there !!

 

[bigoltool]

I might add that for the Kawi H2SX your $20K (or $22K for the the SE) gets you Kawi branded calipers and low end KYB suspension! Not what I would expect for that kind of scratch.

 

[fallenarch]

If(!) I were a product planner at Suzuki I would be bench-marking the GT's out there right now. The KTM SuperDuke GT, Kawi H2SX etc. That starts with electronics. Not everyone wants to hear, or accept that but that's the state of the industry right now. Inertial Based Cornering ABS, Traction Control, Launch Control, Quick Shifters etc. are all the norm now. So thats the easy part the hard part is finding a competitive pricepoint for said Hayabusa. Current retail is 14.7K, the Kawi starts at 19.9 and the KTM in that same ballpark. Unless Suzuki seriously moves the bike from its current roll/market segment it cannot play at that price point, so I would imagine that the next gen Hayabusa (base model?) may come in around the 16k ballpark. They could then offer an upscale variant with better brakes, suspension, etc. all using current partsbin borrowing to keep costs low enough to be competitive.
View attachment 1578107

I looked very close at the KTM 1290 GT and the Hayabusa engine is already a superior engine to the KTM. It has more HP, similar torque and it has the benefit of not being a large displacement V-twin (the KTM maybe lighter). The 1340 cc Busa power plant doesn't need VVT or any other tricks, it is still one of the best motors ever made. When I was at the KTM dealer he was trying to tell me the 1290 is more powerful than the Busa. I stopped him and said, "look friend, I really am impressed with the KTM motor but it's no Hayabusa". He insisted so I pulled out my phone, went to the cloud and pulled up my dyno results - end of conversation. The difference for the KTM is riding position, electronics, and weight. In order to address this Suzuki would have to refocus the Hayabusa. I wish they would frankly, but I seriously doubt it.

Premium bikes run $23 to $30 K these days. The KTM outfitted properly is nearly $25K, which is why I didn't buy one! I don't see a truly great bike for $16K. No way modern electronics, LED lights and other goodies are going to happen for $2K over the current bike. And I'm just not buying another Suzuki with the least effective brakes in the class, I don't get why Suzuki doesn't realize how sick we are of sorry brakes. With the new generation of electronic bikes, you can't just buy Brembo calipers & MC's add SS lines and put a DIY fix on the stopping power. They are a part of the ABS, suspension systems and need proper integration to work properly.

The BFF forks on the GSXR1000RR will not really help the Busa - and they are pretty expensive. In the sport touring class it's about active suspension if you are looking to get in or near the front of the class. This is mainly due to the varied loading a sport touring bike gets. Suzuki needs to sub this out to Ohlins or Sachs. Just sub it out, get it done right and move on.

Suzuki can make a 1440 cc, Euro 4 compliant motor with 230 hp without breaking a sweat.

 

[04LE]

Mabupa glad someone else noticed the 1999 master cylinders. The swing arm looks like the b-kings. I'm loving it, just hope it's easy to tune for when the mods start coming.

 

[sixpack577]

Even I'm getting excited now , I can almost taste that new bike freshness ... Not that I'm in the hunt for Gen 3 ... for now at least... Oh yeah , check what Bigotool posted , the GSXR1K parts bin would sure be good to raid if I was designing a lighter weight Gen 3 , check out the Brembo style floating rotors , and there's those forks again !
Where's Sixpack post about all this temptation ?? , we know he's been saving for some new wheelie weapon , that pictured Gen 3 might be just the ticket , and still provide all the previous Gens real world capabilities !? .
All you people planning on a Gen 3 , the day is coming you lucky bastards , so hang in there !!

...lurking in the shadows...watching all the other fish get snagged by the shiny lure

 

[ROADTOAD1340]

But Six , can't be immune to the bait all the time ... such a vision of loveliness bro , go on what do ya think of this lure ...I mean pic this time !!

 

[ROADTOAD1340]

I think Arch is certainly right about the Gen 2 's brakes set up being 2nd rate for most of the run , as we know the calipers were finally addressed in '13 , but the master cylinder is still being used and again letting down the package . I am thinking Suzuki will use new m/cyl. at least for the new brake set up . The GSXR1K forks are going to be priced out on the Gen 3 , unless there is a multiple variant option for the new bike . Built to a competitive price sure is a killer restriction , I guess we wait and see what the next 'lure' information spin is , and debate that .

 

[fallenarch]

It was hard to find but Google says a 1999 Busa went for $10,499, which is $15,421 in today's dollars. The Blackbird was about $11K. For comparison a Toyota Camery was $17K and change in 1999, they are $28K+ now? That would put a comparative price for a Busa around $16K. So maybe $16K is the target. Here are some examples for reference:

2018 BMW K 1600 $25,000 (all K's come with premium package in USA, so that's more like $28K)
2018 Ducati MultiStrada - $23,000 (options get this to $25+)
2018 KTM 1290 GT - $22,000 (with Akro pipe $25+)
2017 Kawasaki Concours - $15,500
2018 ZX-14R ABS-SE $15,600
2918 Kawasaki H2 SX - $19,000 base and $22,000 for SE

Interesting thing is, add TC, cornering ABS and saddle bags and the current Busa is pretty competitive with most of these already except maybe the H2. So, maybe the new Busa doesn't have to be as radical as I was thinking.

 

[justintime2]

Interesting how excited everyone is getting over yet another artists rendering...

 

[Mythos]

Suzuki can make a 1440 cc, Euro 4 compliant motor with 230 hp without breaking a sweat.

Let's hope! I don't know if they will push it that far with the competition making a paltry 200 hp but 230 would certainly sell bikes!

Can you imagine the insurance??? I'd go liability from day 1. Did that on the 08 busa and ....sorta regretted it I guess. 2 driveway drops in a week.

 

[fallenarch]

From an insurance standpoint, a higher selling price will help. Weed out the young audience and the insurance rates go down dramatically. Besides, 230 hp. with TC, ABS, and great brakes is going to be much safer than the current bike IMHO. My insurance guy said he has never paid out a total on a Busa that was destroyed going over 100 mph (maybe those don't get reported for obvious reasons?)! Apparently most of the crashes happen in the less than 75 mph range and a 100 hp. Busa could do that. Always wondered why the speed limiters are always so easy to defeat - they are just there to stop idiots.

My insurance guy also said the days of sliding coverage are coming with bikes getting so fast. Basically if you are exceeding the speed limit by 20 mph (my arbitrary number) then your coverage reverts to liability only. Not sure of the legal issues on something like this but he said if the insurance companies can't get some sort of cover on these bikes the premiums will quickly exceed your loan payments!

This is interesting reading: file:///C:/Users/wccoo/AppData/Local/Microsoft/Windows/INetCache/IE/8L8591N1/810625.pdf

 

[Mythos]

Weed out the young audience and the insurance rates go down dramatically.

IDK?? The insurance already prices according to age. I think it's the insurance that weeds out the younger riders, not the bike. I thought the hyperbikes were more expensive on insurance because insurance companies perceive the higher hp to be more dangerous. I think the smaller bike is a lot more tempting to do stupid stuff on, myself but insurance companies might not look into the situation that hard. They have homes, lives, cars and all sorts of stuff to insure. I would certainly think they'd be looking at statistics since they compile so much info already. Of course, if they made 200 hp bikes cheaper to insure because they are safer, all the kids would be getting them and crashing at 170 instead of 70.

 

[sixpack577]

But Six , can't be immune to the bait all the time ... such a vision of loveliness bro , go on what do ya think of this lure ...I mean pic this time !!

I like it, but it looks too long.
Which has been my gripe with the Busa for several years now.
I think the tank is too long, making the bar reach too long, yet the pegs seem cramped. And I'm 5'10" with a 32" inseam, I can flat foot a gen 1 and 2 with a slightly bent knee.
I also have a 70" reach.
The "gen3" pictured has the unmistakable Busa styling, but to me, it seems to have a longer wheel base. Other than the distinct Busa front, it looks like a BMW K1200/1300.
I would expect the ergonomics of a new Busa to be similiar to the previous ones anyway.
I even put dirt bike bars on my 08.
I owened that one 3 1/2 years, and it just never seemed to fit me the way I wanted.
I'll go sit on a gen3, should it happen.
But, unless I fall in love with it, I think it's back to gsxr1ks for me.
I also think a new Busa's hype would cause them to sell for around retail, at least for a while.
Considering a gen2 retails for $14k+, I'm assuming a gen3 would be 2-3 grand more. More than I want to pay for a stock bike. Especially since it'll need several grand in mods too.
Used 1k is in my future.

I can nit pick imaginary bikes all day, lol.

 

[ROADTOAD1340]

If I was your size Six , I reakon I'd go for 1K also , because of my surrounding roads . But the Toad only fits Busa nowadays .... Well , we see what next pictures / info brings . Sure hope Suzuki don't keep luring me... , I do so like shiny things.... titanium , gloss paint and carbon fiber ... I am a known sucker for both pretty motorcycles and beautiful ladies ...