2024 Pashnit Touring on a Hayabusa

[pashnit]

2024 Pashnit Touring on a Gen3 Hayabusa

At the turn of the 2022-2023 ride season, I purchased a 2022 Gen3 Hayabusa from one of the H.org members for $15k, 1500 miles, and $3000 in mods. Hadn't even seen a Gen3 in person yet but it was nice to buy a near new bike. Promised myself that I would do minimal mods to the Gen3 and we had an awesome season of running organized motorcycle tours in California, plus it was my 20th anniversary of running the tour business. Quite a milestone.

Only mods I did for touring was a:
Givi Rack & 37L Givi Top case + spare fuel MSR canister
Plus added the Clearwater Darla Lights. I've been using the same set for the last 15 years.
Bagster Tank Cover & tankbag
T-Rex no-cut Sliders
Bike already came with:
Zero Gravity lite smoke Double Bubble
Quad Lock Charger for phone
Akrapovic carbon fiber full system
Oh, and the full h.org thread of Gen3 mods is here

Super fun season of touring and rode all over the state during 2023 - See the thousands of pics of the 2023 Pashnit Tour Season

It was a very wet 2023 spring in California, 60 feet of snow in the mountains, lots of flooding and closed roads.

 

[pashnit]

Only issues I've had with this bike is the Hot Start Issue became a random annoyance at first within 3000 miles of getting the bike, then a major issue by 7000 miles on the clock. We started the season in February and by July & 7000 miles in, the bike wouldn't start at all if it was hot, ie fuel stops, mid-day stop for lunch, etc. However this bike is easy to push start once warm and I pushed started the Gen3 for 5000 miles. Yes, you read that right. It would start in the morning zero issues like clockwork, but we're riding 8 in the morning to 5 at night on these tours. I only tour on this bike which is all day rides.

The Hot Start Issue was maddening. A brand new $20,000 motorcycle that won't start. Is there anything more maddening than that? You're seriously going to tell me Suzuki corporate didn't know they had a major issue with this new Gen3? I contacted every Gen3 owner who actually rode the bike & had a fair amount of miles accumulated. Does your bike do this? Response: Some do, some don't. Many do. And if you don't have it yet, once you get some miles on the bike, it's likely you will. Some Gen3s wouldn't start coming home from the dealer. That's crazy. I read every thread, watched every YT video on this issue (there's lots) and amongst the Gen3 owners it's just an on-going argument of what causes it while no one seems to know exactly what's wrong with this Gen3. Zero word from Suzuki Corporate. Instead we get a recall for the brake master cylinder and ABS Valve. I finally got my recall notice for my brake master cylinder the other day. My Vin wasn't in the original batch even though it does exactly what the recall describes. Months later the recall was expanded and I get the notice.

But the brake issue(s) pale in comparison to a brand new $20k motorcycle that won't start when it's warm. That just sounds crazy.

With Suzuki Corporate acting like there's zero issue, the Gen3 owners squabbled amongst themselves. Crack the throttle. Use the right octane fuel. Bigger battery cables. Try a bigger battery with more CCA.

I replaced the battery. Zero change.
I cracked the throttle while starting (per the owners manual). Zero change.
I tried every octane of fuel. Zero change.
I started throwing more money at the bike.
Replaced the Starter Clutch Assembly. Zero change.

The problem got progressively worse.

This is the Starter Clutch Assembly. It works perfect and has nothing to do with the Hot Start Issue. I replaced mine & zero change.

The Starter Clutch Assembly is a one way clutch and can only turn one direction.

I'm blessed with a lot of good biker buddies who take care of me, some are real gearheads. One of them took a special interest in solving the Hot Start Issue and finally concluded what's causing it is the Torque Limiter Assembly which is a small clutch, and the clutch is slipping when the engine is hot. That terrible noise you're hearing that sounds like a mangy old cat dying is the Torque Limiter Assembly clutch slipping.

Torque Limiter Assembly is the top gear that the starter engages. There's a clutch inside here.

See all the plates inside?

The original Gen1s didn't have a Torque Limiter Assembly and were known to have the starter bind or even sheer off all the teeth. My '00 did exactly this, sheered off all the teeth on the starter gear during a ride and I replaced the starter and no issues.

Starter on my 2000 Hayabusa when I sheered all the teeth off. This was a known issue.
Later models of the Gen1 solved this issue with a clutch that was added to the bike.

 

[pashnit]

I had zero issues with my both my Gen2s with starting. Only issue I ever had with both my Gen2s is if you ran a lot of electrical accessories, auxiliary lights, electric vest, etc, it would drain the battery faster than the bike could charge it. The Gen3 seems to have zero issues with this and I can run my Clearwater Lights, heated grips and even electric vest if I want and zero issues there.

I replaced the Torque Limiter Assembly like my gearhead buddy suggested and it was day and night - the bike fired right up every time on the next tour, hot or cold. I've only had the Gen3 not start two different times after the Torque Limiter Assembly was replaced, keep in mind, the battery is brand new, the Torque Limiter Assembly is brand new and the Starter Clutch Assembly is brand new. This makes me wonder if there are actually two separate issues Suzuki corporate won't admit to. One is the clutch is slipping in the Torque Limiter Assembly. Easily fixed if you know what part to replace. The second issue (answer this question) is what's different about the Gen3 compared to the Gen2? It's the same bike, right? The internals. Suzuki Corporate was quite proud of all the internal changes that made to the inside of the motor & touted them in all their promo material of the Gen3. Somewhere along the line, something inside this motor is different. Compression release? Valves? I dunno. I do know your brand new Gen3 won't start when its warm and the Hot Start Issue affects a large amount of Gen3s.

My gear head buddy requested the old Torque Converter Assembly and I mailed it to him. He promptly disassembled it to show the myriad of internal parts that are causing all the issues for Gen3 owners. Remember, brand new motorcycle, 10,000 miles on this part.

Plus I'm replacing with OEM parts. Think about that. Will the part fail again? It's the same OEM part that's defective from the factory. We shall see.

This is what's causing the Hot Start Issue in Gen3s. Clutch plates slipping that sound like a mangy old cat dying.

 

[pashnit]

In case you want to look up the part number on Partzilla.

Part no. STARTER IDLE LIMITER 12600-24F00

Partzilla Part Search

www.partzilla.com

Don't forget the gasket part number.

 

[pashnit]

So with the Hot Start Issue solved, time to move on. My 20th anniversary tour season ended, time for winter mods, and you can see the next evolution here:

This popped up in the FB feed and I finally threw the switch. No more black.

Yup. Swapped out the black for red. Winter Mods was taking the bike apart and putting it back together plus added a set of Front/Rear Galfer Wave Rotors.

I ordered two Zero Gravity clear windscreens in October and finally got them in February. I have to put that on yet.

I ordered a SuperSprox rear sprocket in October and five months later I still don't have it. 6 month wait for a sprocket?

 

[pashnit]

2024 Pashnit Tour Dates
Feb 16, 2024 - EL DORADO
Mar 08, 2024 - DEATH VALLEY
Mar 22, 2024 - SOUTHERN FOOTHILLS
Apr 05, 2024 - PARKFIELD
Apr 19, 2024 - SHASTA COAST
May 03, 2024 - THREE SISTERS
May 24, 2024 - SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA
June 07, 2024 - SIERRA NEVADA
July 12, 2024 - COAST RANGE
Aug 02, 2024 - SEQUOIA NP
Aug 16, 2024 - NORTHERN CALIFORNIA
Aug 30, 2024 - OREGON COAST RANGE
Sept 13, 2024 - NEVADA
Sept 20, 2024 - TRINITY ALPS
Oct 04, 2024 - YOSEMITE VALLEY
Oct 18, 2024 - CENTRAL PACIFIC COAST
Nov 01, 2024 - MARIN/SONOMA

Pashnit Motorcycle Tours in California | 2024 Pashnit Tour Season Booking Now

California Motorcycle Tours along Pacific Coast, NorCal, and Sierra Nevada Mountains from the author of Pashnit.com, Ride California & Oregon with PASHNIT guided organized tours.

www.pashnittours.com

Tour planning for the next tour season begins in July, by August/September I've got my dates figured out, plus planning 17 tours and filling 17 tours with bodies. I spend many months working on, designing, planning, writing tour descriptions and countless hours sitting with the mapping program figuring out our routes, plus with a 95%+ return rate, I've got come up with new tours for the troops. I'll book over 450 hotel rooms this year so lots & lots of planning with group coordinators at our hotels.

Our 21st ride season starts early in California. By mid-February, 60 degree temps are the norm. However, mid-February is gambling with the weather as I'm planning these tours so far out in advance. Last year in early 2023, we had 12 inches of rain in 3 weeks, that was crazy. This winter, tons of rain (which is good), but not when my tour date is approaching. After all that work on the bike all winter and all that anticipation of being back on the bike again, the tour date finally arrives. My wife even gave me a fresh haircut & trimmed 3 inches off the bottom of my beard.

The fellas, Mark & Gary, familiar faces

And the usual gaggle of bikes at the meet spot

 

[WuzzaCBXRider]

Is there an idea as to root cause? Metallurgy causing a part to fail ? Poorly designed parts? Poor design to begin with?

 

[pashnit]

Pre-ride a few days before the tour - found the snow line at 4400 ft.

Planning to ride the Sierra Nevada Foothills in February is risky. One year ago, we had 12 inches of rain in three weeks. But, this year, it’s been waves coming in off the Pacific Ocean for weeks on end. Overnight rain in the foothills, then sunny 50-degree days. By February, we’ve had nearly 10 waves like this across the Sierra Nevada Foothills. What no one tells you is ride in-between the waves and you will have perfect spring riding weather – in February. The weather gods smiled on us once more, heavy cloud cover, and a forecast that changed daily. Rain, no rain, rain, no rain. Bring a rain suit just in case & let's ride. The rolling hills that surround Placerville and Jackson are perfect riding areas, just stay below 3000 feet and you're below the snow line. This region of rolling hills between 2000-4000 ft known as the Sierra Foothills is brilliant green this time of year, before the heat of summer arrives. This area of California offers endless twisty roads, very little traffic and it's always a huge sense of relief to be back on the bike again and touring after the winter months. A few days before this ride, I set out to find the snow line and found it at 4400 ft outside Georgetown. At that elevation, the roads are plowed, but covered in ice. I promised myself to stay below 3000 with our group of Pashnit Tour Alumni.

The usual suspects

Luc showed up with a new Multi. This is the guy that has 7 bikes in the garage, all licensed and plated, and randomly picks a bike and rides a different bike for each tour.

Chad & his hippo hands. Chad has two KTMs, and seems to vacillate between the bikes.

Danny who showed up on a different bike every tour last season. He says he's trying to find the right one.
Thinks he's found it in BMW S1000R.

 

[pashnit]

Gary & Tom both have a Season Pass. That means they ride on almost every tour I offer this season.

Our goal is to be on the road at 8am. Right on time. Starting the 2024 ride season with:

 

[Skywalker]

So with the Hot Start Issue solved, time to move on. My 20th anniversary tour season ended, time for winter mods, and you can see the next evolution here:

This popped up in the FB feed and I finally threw the switch. No more black.
View attachment 1679186

Yup. Swapped out the black for red. Winter Mods was taking the bike apart and putting it back together plus added a set of Front/Rear Galfer Wave Rotors.

View attachment 1679187

I ordered two Zero Gravity clear windscreens in October and finally got them in February. I have to put that on yet.

I ordered a SuperSprox rear sprocket in October and five months later I still don't have it. 6 month wait for a sprocket?

View attachment 1679189

View attachment 1679188

Love the Red! Beautiful and lots of work on your behalf. Great job!

 

[pashnit]

Is there an idea as to root cause? Metallurgy causing a part to fail ? Poorly designed parts? Poor design to begin with?

Terry , the answer to this is well above my paygrade. I only have a lot of road miles, empirical and practical real-world experience to offer.

But take note the part number is the same for Gen2 and Gen3 for the Starter Torque Limiter Assembly. (STARTER IDLE LIMITER 12600-24F00) #1 in the diagram

So what changed? Gen 2 has zero issues. Both my Gen2s had zero issues starting hot or cold whether it was snowing out, or 110 degrees.

What changed with the Gen3- Just a small list:
cylinder coating, newly shaped pistons, crankshaft changes, oil passage changes, design of the cylinder head, new titanium valves, higher rate valve springs, camshaft changes

Same platform and same motor & Suzuki touts how many internal changes they've made to our motor. But the part number for the STARTER IDLE LIMITER 12600-24F00 (2008 - current) is the same. Something is different about this new motor & Suzuki Corporate won't admit they've got a serious issue with their flagship motorcycle that could be easily fixed.

Any sane person would have to say a brand new $20,000 motorcycle that won't start when the motor is hot is pretty ridiculous.

 

[WuzzaCBXRider]

Terry , the answer to this is well above my paygrade. I only have a lot of road miles, empirical and practical real-world experience to offer.

But take note the part number is the same for Gen2 and Gen3 for the Starter Torque Limiter Assembly. (STARTER IDLE LIMITER 12600-24F00) #1 in the diagram

So what changed? Gen 2 has zero issues. Both my Gen2s had zero issues starting hot or cold whether it was snowing out, or 110 degrees.

What changed with the Gen3- Just a small list:
cylinder coating, newly shaped pistons, crankshaft changes, oil passage changes, design of the cylinder head, new titanium valves, higher rate valve springs, camshaft changes

Same platform and same motor & Suzuki touts how many internal changes they've made to our motor. But the part number for the STARTER IDLE LIMITER 12600-24F00 (2008 - current) is the same. Something is different about this new motor & Suzuki Corporate won't admit they've got a serious issue with their flagship motorcycle that could be easily fixed.

Any sane person would have to say a brand new $20,000 motorcycle that won't start when the motor is hot is pretty ridiculous.

View attachment 1679237

That’s a shame. Sounds like your fix may very well be temporary. The worst shame is that like many other manufacturers, Suzuki is using us as their R&D people.

 

[pashnit]

For the last 20 years, our meet spots have typically been a couple hours away from me. There's a large pool of motorcyclists in and around the San Francisco Bay Area, so a lot of our motorcycle tours start on the edges of the Bay Area. Easy ride to the meet spot for those riders. Not unusual for me to be up at 3am and on the bike at 4am and ride to the meet spot on the Hayabusa 3 hours away to arrive at 7am to meet the tour group, then ride another 8 or 9 hours. Makes for a long 12-hour day on & off the bike. However, after 20 years of doing that, figured it was finally time for everyone to come to me, so this tour is special. El Dorado is the rolling foothill region due east of Sacramento steadily climbing up in elevation. So this ride is my backyard, these are the roads I've been riding for the last 20 years. When the kids were little, the wife and I lived in Pollock Pines & then Camino, both small mountain towns surrounded by super twisty mountain roads in every direction. Instead of up at 3am to meet the tour group somewhere, simply hop on the bike and zip over a couple minutes to the meet spot for this tour. What a treat.

South Shingle Rd leads into the Foothills

Doesn't take long to find no-center-line backroads

It's February and shorter days mean the sun isn't even up yet over the horizon yet.

 

[pashnit]

Brandon Rd is a fun backroad, twisty and not people. So green this time of year.

The green doesn't last, by summer, it's super hot out here, 90 plus every day is the norm. Note the cactus.

 

[pashnit]

This tiny shed has been here for as long as I can remember.

Same shed. Wrong setting on the camera.

 

[pashnit]

I think I've photographed every bike I've owned on this road. Zero people and no cars ever.

Same Shed. 20 years ago.

 

[pashnit]

20 years after 'discovering' this road, I'm leading groups of motorcyclist down this road. Didn't see that coming.

Old French Creek Rd

 

[pashnit]

Same curves

 

[pashnit]

Up for more single lane backroads?

Old Pedro Hill Rd parallels the main highway.

 

[pashnit]

Red Bike Parking only

Mark says the new color on the Gen3 matches his Shoei helmet. Kinda does!