Should guns be banned?

[Stilslo]

ar 15 sales are about to skyrocket

Yep. After hearing big O's speech yesterday, I bought 3 pmags today and a few hundred .40 bullets. Trying to find the best deal on .223 ammo now.

[jphilipson]

its obvious more guns in our country will solve our gun problem....

Well Duh. If all the teachers in the school had been armed, this could have been avoided. Same thing in CO, just one person with a gun in the audience could have prevented it. Because the average CCW carrying tactitool would have been able to take the shooter down in a smoke filled, dark theater with people scrambling and yelling.

[Argilbertson]

I really think you guys are actually arguing the wrong problem all together...this isnt really an argument over gun control so much as it is an argument over the state of our mental health system. I work with several licensed psychologists, and the general consensus in the field is that the policy of deinstitutionalization has a lot more to do with this problem than any gun control laws we have in place.

To sum up the situation, the state and federal government decided that it no longer wanted to fund mental health programs, and slashed it from the budget to fund other projects...what this meant for hospital administrators looking to maintain their profit margins is that it was no longer nearly as profitable to keep mental health patients in treatment, and as a result, they are now released much earlier than they previously would have. Slashing the budget also killed many of the post-hospitalization programs which were designed to monitor the condition of these people once they had been released from the hospital. There's a lot more to this, if you want more information on this issue, there's lots of stuff out there to look at.

While I think the ready access to firearms is something that should be considered, I think the question of why we allow these people who need help to be released back into the public without proper treatment and monitoring is of even larger concern.

[GNBRETT]

I have fingerprint safes that take appx 1 second to open if needed, and you can buy safes for far less than the firearms in them cost.

It has more to do with intelligence than it does money.

actually it has more to do with access then money. a gun safe wont stop straw sales, falsely reporting ur stolen gun and selling it or the many loop-holes we have they allow ppl access to guns from legal gun owners buying guns.

[fallenarch]

Yes, it is. And yes, it could cook off in a fire, but it's not like in the movies where bare ammunition shoots at people from a fire. It needs to be in the barrel of a gun to acheive velocity instead of just going "pop." In some cases, a loaded and chambered gun in a fire could be a problem, but not so much if you just have ammo alone.

Ok I didn't know that. Was not trying to be an azz I really didn't know.

[Flicka]

Well Duh. If all the teachers in the school had been armed, this could have been avoided. Same thing in CO, just one person with a gun in the audience could have prevented it. Because the average CCW carrying tactitool would have been able to take the shooter down in a smoke filled, dark theater with people scrambling and yelling.

The Aurora shooting was a very scary situation. The chance of successfully defending against an attack like that once it had begun was almost zero.

[fallenarch]

Not trying to be "that guy" but if the roles were reversed, "we" wouldn't be allowed to say that statement...

Privlidge of oppression my brother

You are right and I apologize to you guys. I was just thinking that there is a racial element to the arming of America. I am also at work and it's ridable weather today, so I'm kinda *****y.

[Stilslo]

So here's the elephant in the room: Why are these guys who do the mass murder thing usually white? There was the subway shootings and the DC sniper, but basically most of the crazy kill indescriminately sorts are conservative leaning, Christian, big-R, white people? Now we (black Americans) do our share of killing obviously (so we all have a share in the gun problem), but the crazed spray the room types are typically white people. And why aren't the police profiling them?

Clearly we need to ban all white people lol

[Flicka]

Ok I didn't know that. Was trying to be an azz I really didn't know.

It's cool, I didn't think you meant anything by it.

[1busa]

Either situation was bad..... just because you give someone a gun doesnt mean they are gonna use it in a hostile situation. Police and military train with and around guns on a regualr basis just for those kind of situations. The average person whether they own a gun or not might respond or might not once shots pop off and see people dying

[1busa]

Like i said contrary to popular opinion on this forum not everybody is John Rambo or Jason Bournes cousin...... shooting a paper target on the weekend with your buddies and staring down the barrel at a live person and pulling the trigger are worlds apart

[DevilDawg1]

It's true that not everyone can afford a large safe. However, the fact is that if you can afford enough firepower to need a safe this size, then you can afford the security as well. There are many less expensive and smaller options that can secure enough weapons for personal protection. I don't see any reason why someone should have a weapon in their home with no way to secure it. There's just no excuse for that.

Your second point goes back to what I said about having immediate control of unsecured weapons. If someone came in my house right now, the Glock on the table beside me is enough to handle that threat. If I go down the hall or to the garage, the gun goes with me. That's just being responsible. I understand that some people like to have guns staged in different parts of the home, but I don't agree with that from a security perspective. I feel much safer by having only a single gun out of the safe (or two if you include my wife's) and keeping it with me. Maybe that sounds like a hassle, but it's not. It's just something that you make yourself do until it becomes habit. I know it's unusual, but it's safe, secure, and effective.

My Gun Safe is my home. Weapons are not in a steel safe. But safe in my home. Some one wants them, they can ask or try to take them. Decision is theres to make. My weapons are for my personal protection and recreational use (hunting, rifle range, plinking).

I am not taking the time to open a steel door to get to my weapons if they are needed in a self defense situation.
You are never too far from a weapon in my house.

[Flicka]

Like i said contrary to popular opinion on this forum not everybody is John Rambo or Jason Bournes cousin...... shooting a paper target on the weekend with your buddies and staring down the barrel at a live person and pulling the trigger are worlds apart

I don't think that feeling is specific to this forum by any means, but I'd say you are more correct than many are willing to admit.

[DevilDawg1]

I have said it before and will say it again. Give every legal person a gun, and open carry. This would deter alot. And you ever notice how polite people are when you go to the rifle range, and everyone knows that everyone is armed.

[Flicka]

My Gun Safe is my home. Weapons are not in a steel safe. But safe in my home. Some one wants them, they can ask or try to take them. Decision is theres to make. My weapons are for my personal protection and recreational use (hunting, rifle range, plinking).

I am not taking the time to open a steel door to get to my weapons if they are needed in a self defense situation.
You are never too far from a weapon in my house.

I completely agree with that, which is why the only guns we regularly keep out of the safe are the ones that are with us at all times. I will never walk into my home and be faced with the muzzle of one of my own weapons.

[1busa]

Yeah its flat out ridiculous the way I hear people talk about what they would do and how they can do this and if he didnt have a gun he would construct a nuclear bomb out of pop rocks and styrofoam. I mean seriously people need to stop watching so much damn TV and wake up!!! You are not Jack Bauer and this isnt 24...... Any other war vets out there??? Anybody seen your friend or the soldier next to you go down in front of you? Anybody seen the aftermath of a cleared room once the shooting stops?? Takes a certain type of individual that is not crazy demented or insane to assess the situation and still function in a hostile enviorment.

[Argilbertson]

I have said it before and will say it again. Give every legal person a gun, and open carry. This would deter alot. And you ever notice how polite people are when you go to the rifle range, and everyone knows that everyone is armed.

This is faulty logic my friend, for a few reasons:

1. People are polite at the gun range because, for the most part, people who go to licensed gun ranges are those of us who are repectful of firearms and the people around us...not everyone (in fact generally a very small % of owners) is as respectful or goes to the licensed ranges...I've had several instances out at some no-monitored outdoor shooting sites of having to deal with some extremely disrespectful and dangerous owners.

2. Many of the people who commit these acts don't look at the world with the same logic as you or I... for several, I doubt they would consider retaliation before they did these things.

3. There are a lot of owners in public who posess firearms, yet lack the proper training to use them in a crisis scenario. Without the proper training to identify the threat, target and fire accurately, and consider surroundings and possible collateral damage, arming the general populace may turn out to be more dangerous than the inital gunman in certain situations.

In the end, it's not nearly so simple as "Give everyone a gun"; without the proper respect and skills to make that owner a responsible gun owner, it does nothing to create a truly acceptable solution.

[Poppy]

actually it has more to do with access then money. a gun safe wont stop straw sales, falsely reporting ur stolen gun and selling it or the many loop-holes we have they allow ppl access to guns from legal gun owners buying guns.

Exactly. My reply in here, post #76, touches on this. It mentions registration, private sales, etc....I agree the problem is responsible ownership, or lack of.

[1busa]

I have said it before and will say it again. Give every legal person a gun, and open carry. This would deter alot. And you ever notice how polite people are when you go to the rifle range, and everyone knows that everyone is armed.

In case you havent noticed this not everybody is intelligent or responsible. Everybody might like to think so but look at the current state of our country and you will see what I mean. You arm the idiots and all that is gonna lead to is more Trayvon Martin situations or worse. Could you imagine if everybody in that theatre in Colorado had a gun when that guy opened fire? Lets think about this intelligently for a minute............crowded dark room full of people that at best shoot once a month at the pistol range. Yeah right, screaming and muzzle flashes in all directions that would have been 10x's worse than if it was the original shooter by himslef. Not to mention how does law enforcement differentiate who's who? So cops arrive to a shooting and dozens of armed people running out of the theatre and how do you think that will go down?? Serioulsly you might wanna rethink that idea

[DevilDawg1]

This is faulty logic my friend, for a few reasons:

1. People are polite at the gun range because, for the most part, people who go to licensed gun ranges are those of us who are repectful of firearms and the people around us...not everyone (in fact generally a very small % of owners) is as respectful or goes to the licensed ranges...I've had several instances out at some no-monitored outdoor shooting sites of having to deal with some extremely disrespectful and dangerous owners.

2. Many of the people who commit these acts don't look at the world with the same logic as you or I... for several, I doubt they would consider retaliation before they did these things.

3. There are a lot of owners in public who posess firearms, yet lack the proper training to use them in a crisis scenario. Without the proper training to identify the threat, target and fire accurately, and consider surroundings and possible collateral damage, arming the general populace may turn out to be more dangerous than the inital gunman in certain situations.

In the end, it's not nearly so simple as "Give everyone a gun"; without the proper respect and skills to make that owner a responsible gun owner, it does nothing to create a truly acceptable solution.

You are probably correct in your statements, but looking at the world today, I would be willing to give it a try.