Indeed.
And they're buying up mom and pop dealerships.
REFUSING TO SERVICE 10-YEAR-OLD BIKES
- Thread starter Walris
- Start date
And they're buying up mom and pop dealerships.
+1
Berlin Germany
Registered
heaven
reading all your posts i come to the end
that the kind of mechanics they all seemingly have is, that mostely all of these "mechanics" (HA HA HA)
are only sellers of parts and never let alone journeymen with a graduation.
and if a shop thinks and handles like
no question will come up.
btw. if a shop change the tire and ignores for instance a completely worn brake disc ...
unseen issues / problems ? nearly impossible if the work is done by a skilled worker / journeyman with a proper (school) education - usually he is skilled also to look over the plate´s end and recognice issues.
thatby "unseen" shouldn´t be possible.
older than 10 years and no more service? damn - they just want to shirk their responsibility, becuase, as far as i understand, they "all" only have semi-skilled auxiliary workers,
that you can't really trust if they haven't been doing the job for over 10-15 years.
that´s all in my opinion.
dears that kind of buisiness is crap.
even me as a "private" wouldn´t give this bike ´n bad disc (e.g.) back to the owner to leave my garage riding such a bike - i even wouldn´t give him back the ign. keys till the disc is removed to better / new - damn.
if our german shops would handle it their way i suppose 90% of all german bike (car / truck) shops would go bankrupt next 6 months.
i guess the whole theme is grounded by the complete missing / not existing education at the american continent and in lots of european countries too
the mechanics get here in good old germany over 3 years.
reading all your posts i come to the end
that the kind of mechanics they all seemingly have is, that mostely all of these "mechanics" (HA HA HA)
are only sellers of parts and never let alone journeymen with a graduation.
and if a shop thinks and handles like
no question will come up.
btw. if a shop change the tire and ignores for instance a completely worn brake disc ...
unseen issues / problems ? nearly impossible if the work is done by a skilled worker / journeyman with a proper (school) education - usually he is skilled also to look over the plate´s end and recognice issues.
thatby "unseen" shouldn´t be possible.
older than 10 years and no more service? damn - they just want to shirk their responsibility, becuase, as far as i understand, they "all" only have semi-skilled auxiliary workers,
that you can't really trust if they haven't been doing the job for over 10-15 years.
that´s all in my opinion.
dears that kind of buisiness is crap.
even me as a "private" wouldn´t give this bike ´n bad disc (e.g.) back to the owner to leave my garage riding such a bike - i even wouldn´t give him back the ign. keys till the disc is removed to better / new - damn.
if our german shops would handle it their way i suppose 90% of all german bike (car / truck) shops would go bankrupt next 6 months.
i guess the whole theme is grounded by the complete missing / not existing education at the american continent and in lots of european countries too
the mechanics get here in good old germany over 3 years.
So you have. I am just telling you that the reasons for justifying their behavior are not rational.
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Makes perfect sense to me....like I said in my previous post, the shops must be getting too much business and need to turn some away. Imagine having a 10 yr old car and taking it in for service and the service center says "nope, won't fix it as it's 10 yrs old"
There'd be a fist fight right then and there....
But they can get away with this nonsense with a motorcycle?
Talk about economic suicide.
Berlin Germany
Registered
lool - fist fight on site
yes SO! close to that
yes SO! close to that
@hayabuser is SPOT ON,with all the explanations. Its not belief or opinion it is reality. The bottom line to his answers is yes,the true bottom line. Business is all about making money. There is no money working on old bikes + it is a servere pain in these asp.
You have to understand the motorcycle industry and its customers. Like alot of customers in all business's they can be jerks. @Berlin Germany wants to talk about sending bikes back out that are not 100%. Happens everyday because customers are cheap.They want there bike back on the road and can't/won't understand the whole situation. I have worked on alot of bikes for 40+ years. My best friend owns a shop that gets most of its work from other shops that turn these bikes away. He's a good guy and loves bikes. But he makes frick all for money and after 33 years in the same locale...he is going under. Customers are not all like @Walris they don't have deep pockets and the understanding that things cost money. They want their rolling turds back on the road for as cheap as possible.
Everybody has a friend who is an' expert on bikes. This expert doesn't offer to fix their bike but tells them what to tell the shop.
Customer walks in says his front brakes have failed.Expert buddy says he needs new fork seals. Yes he does. Well the fork seals are shot because the fork tubes are all rusty. But,he just wants new seals. A week later,his forks are leaking again...and guess what,its our fault. We reccomended new tubes,they cheaped out.
'Buser is right with book rates. "The Book" says you can only charge 2 hours for the clutch job. Cool...make money right...nope. Took 2 hours to get it apart. So what then? The shop just gets to eat the extra cost? How does the shop make money.
"Buser is right again on time. Around here at peak season shops are booking 3 months in advance. If the first bike of the day takes 3 times as long to complete...what does that do to the rest of your techs day? And the next day...the next week...Everybody who is in line for service has to now wait because the tech is tied up on some 20 year old turd.
What we face at my bro's shop. STORAGE. The cost of shop space in a decent locale is astronomical. As these turds roll in get taken apart,assesed and parts ordered...where do we store them while the parts take 3 months to arrive.
Parts...fun stuff. Yer half way thru a job and discover you need a part that is obsolete. Who has my answer to this one? Is it my fault my crystal ball was low on battery power and I could not forsee this occurance. Now the customers bike is apart...now what? What do you charge for the hours it took to take it apart? Now it has to be put back together in a rolling state for pick-up. "Here's yer bike and this box of parts,oh and I need 500 dollars shop time for that." I'll tell you what,they dont like it.
"My bike wont start"...oh,my fuggin' favorite. "Ya,my buddy says it just needs a new battery." Rubb says..."Well how long has it been sitting?"
"Four years"....and here we go again. "Well its gonna be 2 weeks to get a Yuasa for your bike." "Thats OK I bought this battery with me,got it from Amazon,it was only 60 bucks." Rubb installs but warns its krap. A week later customer returns with "You must have installed my battery wrong"
Rubb then attempts to stop from jumping over the counter and punching "valued customer" in the face.
We do our freakin' best. A customer last week..."My throttle cable broke and the dealer says its obsolete." Yup..a huh. Well guess what. We will stop what we are doing and build that cable from scratch. Handing the "valued customer" a brand new cable better that todays manufacturing standards.
"That will be 100 dollars,parts and labour." "Valued customer" freaks once again.
Tires: "I dont have much money and was hoping you had a used one." Where do these "valued customers" come from.
Last week I was helping out put back together this old Yamaha. Customer took it apart to paint it. Did the paint himself. Flat black out of a rattle can. Wanted us to "be careful" putting it back together.
Turns out,he bought it in boxes and has never had it running. Wiring harness all cut up...bent parts,missing parts...ETC. So there's the shop owner on the hydraulic press straightening out bent obsolete parts. The parts guy is sourcing used parts from around the world. The apprentice is chasing used parts in our inventory. I am the wrench. 4 guys. HOURS spent. This customer will bi7ch to no end when he gets the bill even thou my kind hearted buddy will probably charge 1 hour for every 4 worked. He's lucky he has me.I work for free. Imaging paying a tech for all the hours?
The headaches accociated with old bikes is unimagineable. Even newer bikes. When your counter man spends 2 hours sourcing a part and comes up empty...where do you get the funds to pay his wage? He didn't make any money. He lost you money.
Time=Money. Another customer last week. "I need front brakes" Rubb says OK,I'll take a look. Up on my lift she goes. Before I even start with one bolt I give her a look-see. Customer has been told by their all-knowing buddy/friend/neighbor all it needs is pads. Dont pay the shop any more than half an hour.
Not my first rodeo. I'm thinking it will be a miracle to get the screws out of the res intact. The brake line is 5 minutes from failing. The piston has rust on it and will destroy whats left of the seal when I push it back into the caliper bore. The master needs re-build,the return circuit is plugged. Half an' hour you say...fug you. So I report to the customer. Well thats too much they say. OK,take yer piece of krap and be gone. Customer doesn't pay for that diagnosis. Who does then? Lost TIME. Time = money.
People buy all sorts of great bikes from their ex brother in law. I could give you a list. Bikes that were made for 1 year. Bikes that changed major parts 10 times in a production run. There are no more parts.
Customer..."Well cant you just make the part?" Well sure says Rubb...let me just fire up my forge here and blast out some new pistons for you. Shouldn't take but a minute.
Some customers are cool. They hand over a credit card and say go to town. They want their 1960's thing turned back into its rolling glory. We can do that. But it isn't free. We are not a charity. We'd like to make a bit of money and maybe feed our families.
As 'Buser mentioned..."The tune-up" Qwik and easy right? Even on a new bike bad shi7 happens. Who pays when that first plug breaks off in the hole. Customer blames us. Now a cylinder head has to come off. The rest of the days jobs don't get done. People have no idea on costs these days. All the easily seen stuff sure (electricity,rent,up keep,tooling,but those 5000 gallons of used oil,filters,tires,coolant,batteries,busted parts...you cant just throw them in the dumpster (anymore)
. Everything takes time.
I'm sure there are shops out there where owners/management are jerks.
But there is the other side...
Reality.
Rubb.
You have to understand the motorcycle industry and its customers. Like alot of customers in all business's they can be jerks. @Berlin Germany wants to talk about sending bikes back out that are not 100%. Happens everyday because customers are cheap.They want there bike back on the road and can't/won't understand the whole situation. I have worked on alot of bikes for 40+ years. My best friend owns a shop that gets most of its work from other shops that turn these bikes away. He's a good guy and loves bikes. But he makes frick all for money and after 33 years in the same locale...he is going under. Customers are not all like @Walris they don't have deep pockets and the understanding that things cost money. They want their rolling turds back on the road for as cheap as possible.
Everybody has a friend who is an' expert on bikes. This expert doesn't offer to fix their bike but tells them what to tell the shop.
Customer walks in says his front brakes have failed.Expert buddy says he needs new fork seals. Yes he does. Well the fork seals are shot because the fork tubes are all rusty. But,he just wants new seals. A week later,his forks are leaking again...and guess what,its our fault. We reccomended new tubes,they cheaped out.
'Buser is right with book rates. "The Book" says you can only charge 2 hours for the clutch job. Cool...make money right...nope. Took 2 hours to get it apart. So what then? The shop just gets to eat the extra cost? How does the shop make money.
"Buser is right again on time. Around here at peak season shops are booking 3 months in advance. If the first bike of the day takes 3 times as long to complete...what does that do to the rest of your techs day? And the next day...the next week...Everybody who is in line for service has to now wait because the tech is tied up on some 20 year old turd.
What we face at my bro's shop. STORAGE. The cost of shop space in a decent locale is astronomical. As these turds roll in get taken apart,assesed and parts ordered...where do we store them while the parts take 3 months to arrive.
Parts...fun stuff. Yer half way thru a job and discover you need a part that is obsolete. Who has my answer to this one? Is it my fault my crystal ball was low on battery power and I could not forsee this occurance. Now the customers bike is apart...now what? What do you charge for the hours it took to take it apart? Now it has to be put back together in a rolling state for pick-up. "Here's yer bike and this box of parts,oh and I need 500 dollars shop time for that." I'll tell you what,they dont like it.
"My bike wont start"...oh,my fuggin' favorite. "Ya,my buddy says it just needs a new battery." Rubb says..."Well how long has it been sitting?"
"Four years"....and here we go again.
"Well its gonna be 2 weeks to get a Yuasa for your bike." "Thats OK I bought this battery with me,got it from Amazon,it was only 60 bucks." Rubb installs but warns its krap. A week later customer returns with "You must have installed my battery wrong"
Rubb then attempts to stop from jumping over the counter and punching "valued customer" in the face.
We do our freakin' best. A customer last week..."My throttle cable broke and the dealer says its obsolete." Yup..a huh. Well guess what. We will stop what we are doing and build that cable from scratch. Handing the "valued customer" a brand new cable better that todays manufacturing standards.
"That will be 100 dollars,parts and labour." "Valued customer" freaks once again.
Tires: "I dont have much money and was hoping you had a used one." Where do these "valued customers" come from.
Last week I was helping out put back together this old Yamaha. Customer took it apart to paint it. Did the paint himself. Flat black out of a rattle can. Wanted us to "be careful" putting it back together.
The headaches accociated with old bikes is unimagineable. Even newer bikes. When your counter man spends 2 hours sourcing a part and comes up empty...where do you get the funds to pay his wage? He didn't make any money. He lost you money.
Time=Money. Another customer last week. "I need front brakes" Rubb says OK,I'll take a look. Up on my lift she goes. Before I even start with one bolt I give her a look-see. Customer has been told by their all-knowing buddy/friend/neighbor all it needs is pads. Dont pay the shop any more than half an hour.
People buy all sorts of great bikes from their ex brother in law. I could give you a list. Bikes that were made for 1 year. Bikes that changed major parts 10 times in a production run. There are no more parts.
Customer..."Well cant you just make the part?" Well sure says Rubb...let me just fire up my forge here and blast out some new pistons for you. Shouldn't take but a minute.
Some customers are cool. They hand over a credit card and say go to town. They want their 1960's thing turned back into its rolling glory. We can do that. But it isn't free. We are not a charity. We'd like to make a bit of money and maybe feed our families.
As 'Buser mentioned..."The tune-up" Qwik and easy right? Even on a new bike bad shi7 happens. Who pays when that first plug breaks off in the hole. Customer blames us. Now a cylinder head has to come off. The rest of the days jobs don't get done. People have no idea on costs these days. All the easily seen stuff sure (electricity,rent,up keep,tooling,but those 5000 gallons of used oil,filters,tires,coolant,batteries,busted parts...you cant just throw them in the dumpster (anymore)
I'm sure there are shops out there where owners/management are jerks.
But there is the other side...
Reality.
Rubb.
Bottom line is a factory warranty doesn't last forever and once it's over and done, what is the difference between a 3 yr old bike off warranty and a 12 yr old bike at that point?? I say none at all. A 2008 Hayabusa has very few changes compared to a 2020 and although there are a few abused examples-these are more the exception than rule.
Most motorcycles are not ridden in salt covered roads, they are generally ridden in the warmer months and sometimes see rain. For the most part motorcycle riders take care of their rides-unlike many car drivers.
For any dealer to refuse to work on a bike just because it is over 10 yrs old is a crock of bull crap and there should be a higher power stepping in to stop that practice.
Thank goodness the bike shops around here welcome business and look after their customers regardless of what they ride.
Most motorcycles are not ridden in salt covered roads, they are generally ridden in the warmer months and sometimes see rain. For the most part motorcycle riders take care of their rides-unlike many car drivers.
For any dealer to refuse to work on a bike just because it is over 10 yrs old is a crock of bull crap and there should be a higher power stepping in to stop that practice.
Thank goodness the bike shops around here welcome business and look after their customers regardless of what they ride.
Somewhere,sometime ago 1 dealer came up with this idea. He didn't see the value in working on bikes 10+ years old or more.Many other dealers jumped on the bandwagon. It is what it is.
Some countries still believe in some things like "We reserve the right to refuse service" As a business owner it is your right. Its in place for many reasons. Bar owner: Refusing to serve a customer that walks in drunk. Good thing.
My friend who is a pharmacist gets yelled at daily because prescription drug addicts have already been given their month supply of dope and she can't/won't supply more. They yell at her,she asks them to leave and not come back...ever. Good thing.
A motorcycle shop's owner has decided the cost benefit of working on certain bikes no longer fits his personal business plan...that's his personal choice.
I would not like to have my business (any business) get handed Gub'ment legislation or other rules by an' outside agency that tell me I have to do this or that. That is not right. It is a business owners right (for now anyway) to run their personal private business as they see fit.
Back to bikes. If there is such a "Gold Mine" in fixing older bikes why isn't everybody doing it? As @hayabuser and I tried to explain...it is NOT a gold mine. It just isn't. I'm sorry if you think its just bike dealers going F-you for no reason then you will never understand. YES...some dealers appear to be jerks. Cool...pick another one. Its that easy right? Now if its not that easy to find all these magical repair shops that will work on anything,any age...don't you think there is a reason for that.
The "Good Ol' Day's" when you bought a bread toaster and that toaster broke down 10 years later,you didn't throw it out. You took it to the guy down the street who made a living fixing toasters. There is no money in fixing most anything these days.
Try and get a tech to come out to your house and work on a TV,stereo,oven,washer,dryer,etc...that is more than 5 MINUTES old. Good luck with that. Trades people are busy with NEW installs. Around here all the tradesman have work in new construction...electricians,plumbers,carpenters...they don't want to come to your house and fix old krap. They just don't. A plumbing company gets a contract to plumb 200 new homes in a new sub-division...
your plugged toilet is just not that high of a priority to them.
If you think there is good money in older bikes...try yer luck,open yer own shop. Become the cool guy in town that will work on anything. You will lose money.
There will always be that one guy out there who works out of the shop in his backyard who will put in 10 hours on your bike and charge you for two. Go find him,and try not to bi7ch about the 2 hour bill.
Maybe he even has a Unicorn out back for the kids to play on while you wait for him to manufacture obsolete parts and not break anything on re/re.
Some call bullshi7...I call "reality."
Rubb.
Some countries still believe in some things like "We reserve the right to refuse service" As a business owner it is your right. Its in place for many reasons. Bar owner: Refusing to serve a customer that walks in drunk. Good thing.
My friend who is a pharmacist gets yelled at daily because prescription drug addicts have already been given their month supply of dope and she can't/won't supply more. They yell at her,she asks them to leave and not come back...ever. Good thing. A motorcycle shop's owner has decided the cost benefit of working on certain bikes no longer fits his personal business plan...that's his personal choice.
I would not like to have my business (any business) get handed Gub'ment legislation or other rules by an' outside agency that tell me I have to do this or that. That is not right. It is a business owners right (for now anyway) to run their personal private business as they see fit.
Back to bikes. If there is such a "Gold Mine" in fixing older bikes why isn't everybody doing it? As @hayabuser and I tried to explain...it is NOT a gold mine. It just isn't. I'm sorry if you think its just bike dealers going F-you for no reason then you will never understand. YES...some dealers appear to be jerks. Cool...pick another one. Its that easy right? Now if its not that easy to find all these magical repair shops that will work on anything,any age...don't you think there is a reason for that.
The "Good Ol' Day's" when you bought a bread toaster and that toaster broke down 10 years later,you didn't throw it out. You took it to the guy down the street who made a living fixing toasters. There is no money in fixing most anything these days.
Try and get a tech to come out to your house and work on a TV,stereo,oven,washer,dryer,etc...that is more than 5 MINUTES old. Good luck with that. Trades people are busy with NEW installs. Around here all the tradesman have work in new construction...electricians,plumbers,carpenters...they don't want to come to your house and fix old krap. They just don't. A plumbing company gets a contract to plumb 200 new homes in a new sub-division...
your plugged toilet is just not that high of a priority to them.
If you think there is good money in older bikes...try yer luck,open yer own shop. Become the cool guy in town that will work on anything. You will lose money.
There will always be that one guy out there who works out of the shop in his backyard who will put in 10 hours on your bike and charge you for two. Go find him,and try not to bi7ch about the 2 hour bill.
Maybe he even has a Unicorn out back for the kids to play on while you wait for him to manufacture obsolete parts and not break anything on re/re.
Some call bullshi7...I call "reality."
Rubb.
Screw those guys. Go down there and give'em one of these in the parking lot!
...and with any luck, that dealership falls on it's face...I'll guarantee the manufacturers want their 10+ yr old bikes worked on as many of those customers probably own more than one bike and probably newer ones just like many on this forum do. If it were me, I'd be contacting the manufacturer and let them know one of their dealerships has such a business plan-you might not be welcome at this dealership in the future but it might help someone else in the long run.
Any dealership which has such a business plan doesn't deserve to be in the business of fixing bikes.
hayabuser
Registered
I can tell you live in Ontario where the riding season is short and has a definitive beginning and ending. Out here on the west coast, motorcycles are not merely toys but regular transportation for many folks and the machines are treated exactly as cars are. Ride hard, put away wet, repeat.
Because we do get near freezing at times and frost during the winter months is a semi-regular thing, the municipalities have brine trucks that go around spraying salt-water on the roads to keep them from icing up. That salt-water gets misted up EVERYWHERE in the nooks and crannies of a motorcycle and the resulting attack on the aluminum and steel parts of the bike is brutal. Not Eastern Ontario winter-beater with no floors or frame left brutal, but brutal nonetheless.
The people who care coat their rides in ACF-50 or similar before winter, but those folks are the exception and not the rule.
I used to think the exact same thing until I got a job as a tech at a motorcycle dealership. It's simply not true.
SSGT_B
Registered
Cadillac does that here. 10 yr old don’t even park on their lot. Stupid if ya ask me
Hayabusa Wannabe
Registered
This happened long ago with our primary vehicles my friend. All it takes is a repair quote of a $1,000 and consumers hand their car over to the dealership and sign for a new car payment. My opinion is that the consumer is not really forced but taking into consideration some of the above, that consumers are in fact cheap with repairs, that both parties reinforce each other's bad behavior. Also, the cash for clunkers program outright annihilated a massive number of inexpensive replacement parts and that has affected many repair decisions for older vehicles. But I digress.
When I got my first bike I very intentionally began visiting the only branded dealer in the area, which is family owned. I spent good money for frankenbolts and any piece missing or scratched. I never saw anyone smile in there. I patiently waited two weeks for any OEM part that I needed. They never said "thank you" when I handed them my money. When I inquired about a valve job the service manager indicated that they had no interest in doing anything more than easy routine maintenance. In the spring the parking lot is lined with weed whackers being prepared for sale. Yes, they certainly have their own priorities.
The attempted relationship was one-way, and gone now, to the internet and self-employed techs. And even my rock star independent techs are difficult to schedule with because the bike work does not support them, so they have their hand in many different pots.
Many of you are extremely inspiring to me. I think the magic of riding would go by the wayside if I had to do my own work. But there is always this little seed in my head that knows the above and that I could get forced into taking care of my own bikes, and also that I could get all of the guidance I would need right here, at least for the Hayabusa.
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Popie
Registered
It may not be happening everywhere. But I have 2 Harley Davidson dealers in town. Neither will work on any Harley older then 2000. Their excuse is Harley no longer supports the EVO motor. Hard to believe. The EVO motor is what pulled HD out of the crapper. Fortunately I do my own work. I found this out from a friend that went to both dealers and got turned away. All he wanted was a new drive belt installed and the primary chain adjusted. Nothing to do with their excuse about Harley not supporting the EVO motor...
JeffSyh
Registered
Hahahaha in my industry I wish we could turn away old units, I work on 20+ year old semis with well over 3-4 million miles. But we make huge money on older units but all my expensive training my company puts me through you'd think I'd only work on newer units. In my opinion thats just untrained and no common sense with problem solving a 10 year old bike is far easier to work on its a motorcycle they aren't that complicated.
@hayabuser is SPOT ON,with all the explanations. Its not belief or opinion it is reality. The bottom line to his answers is yes,the true bottom line. Business is all about making money. There is no money working on old bikes + it is a servere pain in these asp.
You have to understand the motorcycle industry and its customers. Like alot of customers in all business's they can be jerks. @Berlin Germany wants to talk about sending bikes back out that are not 100%. Happens everyday because customers are cheap.They want there bike back on the road and can't/won't understand the whole situation. I have worked on alot of bikes for 40+ years. My best friend owns a shop that gets most of its work from other shops that turn these bikes away. He's a good guy and loves bikes. But he makes frick all for money and after 33 years in the same locale...he is going under. Customers are not all like @Walris they don't have deep pockets and the understanding that things cost money. They want their rolling turds back on the road for as cheap as possible.
Everybody has a friend who is an' expert on bikes. This expert doesn't offer to fix their bike but tells them what to tell the shop.
Customer walks in says his front brakes have failed.Expert buddy says he needs new fork seals. Yes he does. Well the fork seals are shot because the fork tubes are all rusty. But,he just wants new seals. A week later,his forks are leaking again...and guess what,its our fault. We reccomended new tubes,they cheaped out.
'Buser is right with book rates. "The Book" says you can only charge 2 hours for the clutch job. Cool...make money right...nope. Took 2 hours to get it apart. So what then? The shop just gets to eat the extra cost? How does the shop make money.
"Buser is right again on time. Around here at peak season shops are booking 3 months in advance. If the first bike of the day takes 3 times as long to complete...what does that do to the rest of your techs day? And the next day...the next week...Everybody who is in line for service has to now wait because the tech is tied up on some 20 year old turd.
What we face at my bro's shop. STORAGE. The cost of shop space in a decent locale is astronomical. As these turds roll in get taken apart,assesed and parts ordered...where do we store them while the parts take 3 months to arrive.
Parts...fun stuff. Yer half way thru a job and discover you need a part that is obsolete. Who has my answer to this one? Is it my fault my crystal ball was low on battery power and I could not forsee this occurance. Now the customers bike is apart...now what? What do you charge for the hours it took to take it apart? Now it has to be put back together in a rolling state for pick-up. "Here's yer bike and this box of parts,oh and I need 500 dollars shop time for that." I'll tell you what,they dont like it.
"My bike wont start"...oh,my fuggin' favorite. "Ya,my buddy says it just needs a new battery." Rubb says..."Well how long has it been sitting?"
"Four years"....and here we go again.
Rubb then attempts to stop from jumping over the counter and punching "valued customer" in the face.
We do our freakin' best. A customer last week..."My throttle cable broke and the dealer says its obsolete." Yup..a huh. Well guess what. We will stop what we are doing and build that cable from scratch. Handing the "valued customer" a brand new cable better that todays manufacturing standards.
"That will be 100 dollars,parts and labour." "Valued customer" freaks once again.
Tires: "I dont have much money and was hoping you had a used one." Where do these "valued customers" come from.
Last week I was helping out put back together this old Yamaha. Customer took it apart to paint it. Did the paint himself. Flat black out of a rattle can. Wanted us to "be careful" putting it back together. View attachment 1627532 Turns out,he bought it in boxes and has never had it running. Wiring harness all cut up...bent parts,missing parts...ETC. So there's the shop owner on the hydraulic press straightening out bent obsolete parts. The parts guy is sourcing used parts from around the world. The apprentice is chasing used parts in our inventory. I am the wrench. 4 guys. HOURS spent. This customer will bi7ch to no end when he gets the bill even thou my kind hearted buddy will probably charge 1 hour for every 4 worked. He's lucky he has me.I work for free. Imaging paying a tech for all the hours?
The headaches accociated with old bikes is unimagineable. Even newer bikes. When your counter man spends 2 hours sourcing a part and comes up empty...where do you get the funds to pay his wage? He didn't make any money. He lost you money.
Time=Money. Another customer last week. "I need front brakes" Rubb says OK,I'll take a look. Up on my lift she goes. Before I even start with one bolt I give her a look-see. Customer has been told by their all-knowing buddy/friend/neighbor all it needs is pads. Dont pay the shop any more than half an hour. View attachment 1627532 Not my first rodeo. I'm thinking it will be a miracle to get the screws out of the res intact. The brake line is 5 minutes from failing. The piston has rust on it and will destroy whats left of the seal when I push it back into the caliper bore. The master needs re-build,the return circuit is plugged. Half an' hour you say...fug you. So I report to the customer. Well thats too much they say. OK,take yer piece of krap and be gone. Customer doesn't pay for that diagnosis. Who does then? Lost TIME. Time = money.
People buy all sorts of great bikes from their ex brother in law. I could give you a list. Bikes that were made for 1 year. Bikes that changed major parts 10 times in a production run. There are no more parts.
Customer..."Well cant you just make the part?" Well sure says Rubb...let me just fire up my forge here and blast out some new pistons for you. Shouldn't take but a minute. View attachment 1627532
Some customers are cool. They hand over a credit card and say go to town. They want their 1960's thing turned back into its rolling glory. We can do that. But it isn't free. We are not a charity. We'd like to make a bit of money and maybe feed our families.
As 'Buser mentioned..."The tune-up" Qwik and easy right? Even on a new bike bad shi7 happens. Who pays when that first plug breaks off in the hole. Customer blames us. Now a cylinder head has to come off. The rest of the days jobs don't get done. People have no idea on costs these days. All the easily seen stuff sure (electricity,rent,up keep,tooling,but those 5000 gallons of used oil,filters,tires,coolant,batteries,busted parts...you cant just throw them in the dumpster (anymore) View attachment 1627532. Everything takes time.
I'm sure there are shops out there where owners/management are jerks.
But there is the other side...
Reality.
Rubb.
Ruuubahh!!
I did not know Kanoooda joined the throw away society, LOL
I am lucky like you though, I fix my own toys and should anyone else come near them with a screwdriver, they will get slapped so hard, their snot will sit right around their head.
But you know, I use to train service techs and certify them for Mercedes and I have to say, if a tech cannot work on a 10 year old machine, there is no way I would trust him on a one year old machine. The complexity has increased quite a bit.
Life has become too good and there is a lot of incompetence in the automotive industry today. For someone who has to rely 100% on a stealership, the best advice I can give is drive the vehicle until the warranty expires and trade it in on a new one. Or buy a service agreement. In the motorcycle industry that won’t even work.
Me, I will work on anything no matter how old it is, but give the customer an estimate and let him know that it may increase if we find more problems. That is a pretty standard approach in the industry. If it is a big job, in the motorcycle industry the repair on an old bike may cost more than what the bike is worth and that is a decision the customer has to make.
There is a group labelling these dealers as “bad dealers” and they encourage everyone to list dealers who participate in this 10 year old rule.
Linky below
JeffSyh
Registered
c10
Registered
So many Techs have not even seen a carburetor or know what it is. However they are in the shop . Most shops here have that ten year deal for about the last 4 or 5 years now . However they will do tires / chains/ wheel bearings . After that though they say no to the rest .
This is where guys like me make some extra coin . Specializing in older bikes . All my customers are 15 plus years with me , and I build motors to carburetors for them . When a new customer is referred I ask them if they are really wanting to do this . Because many times its much more $$$ than they expect . If they can not leave $500 cash for parts or worry on a $1500 to 2K rebuild then I suggest they learn themselves or go elsewhere .
Youtube in many ways has killed the shops because you can just google the repair , and 9 out of 10 times you will find countless videos on X subject .
This is where guys like me make some extra coin . Specializing in older bikes . All my customers are 15 plus years with me , and I build motors to carburetors for them . When a new customer is referred I ask them if they are really wanting to do this . Because many times its much more $$$ than they expect . If they can not leave $500 cash for parts or worry on a $1500 to 2K rebuild then I suggest they learn themselves or go elsewhere .
Youtube in many ways has killed the shops because you can just google the repair , and 9 out of 10 times you will find countless videos on X subject .
rd99
Registered
plus they will probably tow off any "antiques" leaking oil in the parking lot
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