Riding technique

[MC MUSTANG]

Hey everyone -
So I was riding today and I noticed something that I hadn't really considered before. As a matter of introduction, contrary to what some of you saw at the spring Bash, I like to consider myself a decent rider; moderately skilled. Anyway, I noticed again today that I am less comfortable turning left than right - some people have observed that this could be because of the anticipation of crossing traffic. Anyway, in a sweeping left hander today I noticed something. In the left turn, I do not ush with my left hand to counter steer, I pull with my right. In the right handers, I push with my right... seems that proper technique would be to push in with the hand directed into the turn. Anyway, something I noticed... Iw ill be working on that to see if it makes my turn more fluid and more comfortable.

More later,
MCM

 

[omslaw]

Anyway, in a sweeping left hander today I noticed something. In the left turn, I do not ush with my left hand to counter steer, I pull with my right. In the right handers, I push with my right...

You're just practicing cuz you're wanting to have your left hand free so you can drag your fingers and wave to folks while in a turn...

 

[MC MUSTANG]

 

[Professor]

You are correct in that you should be pushing in both directions. You have more power and muscle control with a push therefore making more precise adjustments.

 

[fsusux]

Being dominant in one direction is pretty common. I am more confident in left handers.

 

[Projekt]

I've noticed that my left hand turns are as "BRONSON" as my right handers... Seems that I have to improve my technique also.

 

[WuzzaCBXRider]

Push or pull, whatever gets the job done. We all counter steer whether we realize or not. Practice the push/pull while going slow around corners and you'll see what I mean.

 

[dewie]

I'm better at left hand turns, I thought that was because I'm a NASCAR fan!! go fast and turn left!!
I need practice on the right handers. I find myself not leaning off the right side for some reason..

 

[MC MUSTANG]

I guess the reson that I am posting this is because I hadn't realized how dominantly I ride with my right arm... I was consciously trying to push instead of pull to allow the opposite arm to go somewhat loose.. it also facilitates sliding across the bike centerline; I found myself dropping into the turn more quickly when I focused on pushing using my "trail" arm for stabilization...

 

[VaBusa]

Counter steering is the bomb

 

[omslaw]

Counter steering is the bomb

I needed that! Thanks, Chelle!

 

[Projekt]

Counter steering is the bomb  

It's BRONSON too.

 

[Professor]

I guess the reson that I am posting this is because I hadn't realized how dominantly I ride with my right arm...  I was consciously trying to push instead of pull to allow the opposite arm to go somewhat loose.. it also facilitates sliding across the bike centerline; I found myself dropping into the turn more quickly when I focused on pushing using my "trail" arm for stabilization...

There is a reason it is now taught as "push steering" instead of "counter steering"!

 

[MC MUSTANG]

I guess the reson that I am posting this is because I hadn't realized how dominantly I ride with my right arm...  I was consciously trying to push instead of pull to allow the opposite arm to go somewhat loose.. it also facilitates sliding across the bike centerline; I found myself dropping into the turn more quickly when I focused on pushing using my "trail" arm for stabilization...

There is a reason it is now taught as "push steering" instead of "counter steering"!  

Ahhhhh, once again - "schooled" by the Professor! This place rocks!

 

[VaBusa]

Counter steering is the bomb

I needed that! Thanks, Chelle!

It's like when you first find belly lint

Sorry Shawn...I needed this too...

Did you ever take the MSF course? They did teach us the push method; prior to taking that class I too thought it was a pull...pretty cool when you figure it out and actually feel what it does to your riding

 

[LA Busa]

Interesting, and we know you can ride Shawn!

Ed Bargy covered this with us at the school I took up at Barber.

Since then I have tried to use the 'steer the opposite of the way you want the bike to go' technique and I am still a long way from that, let alone steering at an obstacle as a means of avoiding it!

That said, Bargy taught that you countersteer to make the bike 'fall into the turn' on entry and use your CG inputs (body position)1st and throttle 2nd to negotiate through the apex and on to the exit (commonly referred to in some circles as the 'slide area').

I think the hesitance to turn one way or the other is mental and probably tied to right and left innate dexterities - I am right handed and SUCK at turning left!

 

[BUSAFETT]

This year I really started focusing on this and WOW what a difference!

Now next riding season I'll have to learn all over again.

 

[VaBusa]

This year I really started focusing on this and WOW what a difference!

Now next riding season I'll have to learn all over again.

No you won't...it never goes away, you just learn to improve on it, get your rear off the seat some to feel the bike lean over a tad more...

 

[Professor]

Did you ever take the MSF course?  They did teach us the push method; prior to taking that class I too thought it was a pull...pretty cool when you figure it out and actually feel what it does to your riding  

I have found you have to be very careful introducing it in class. Some instructors really try to emphasize the dynamics of what is happening when you use the technique. I guess they like the shock value, but I find it really confuses the students. I have started really working on them in the earlier exercise involving small oval circle on the second part. I'm telling them they can control the exit of the curve by using more or less handgrip pressure in the direction they are turning. "more pressure"￾ leans the bike for a tighter turn, "less pressure"￾ starts standing the bike up therefore opening the turn. I never mention turning the handlebars only the handgrip press.

The word countersteering is not even mentioned until the second day. When it is explained, a few will look puzzled and can't figure out why/how. I remind them about the previous day and it is the same way we were doing it then. Blink, the light goes on!

A very experienced rider can employ a push or pull method as well as both together. However I find that same rider should be experienced with all of the other aspects, knee pressing into tank, weighting the correct peg, head position, butt position etc"¦.

The main reason push works so well is the amount of strength we have. Push someone away compared to pulling them toward you and see what results you have. The more strength we have usually corresponds to the amount of fine motor skills we have vs gross motor skills. In the above example of pushing them away and pulling them toward you, did you find yourself jerking in the pull steps? "¦"¦Food for thought!

 

[insane]

Some months ago, while re-reading "Sport Riding techniques", by Nick Ienatsch, I came across the pull-push recommendation again. I usally push ("jab") quite hard, so I started to practice pulling only, to get used to the feeling and improve coordination (it's harder!). The feeling when I revert to pull-push is of less effort and more control. And doing both somehow makes me more aware of my lazy peg weighting and body positioning.