Punishment for Capt of carrier deserved or not ?

[Blanca BusaLess]

lastly, notice how it came out days after DADT was repealed?? Coincidence? Doubt it.... Now that the Gay agenda has succeeded in beating the military, what better way to put the military "on notice" by immediately firing a guy for making fun of them...just sayin

Not just any guy.
The Capt of the USS Enterprise, most powerful ship on earth, arguably.
If what you say is true Skydivr than it is very scary how powerful that lobby has become.

 

[m_ridgeway]

What kills me is all these videos were shot before he was Captain of the ship, like four years before he was promoted to Executive officer! Are you kidding me!?!?!?!

he was executive officer when they were made, 3-4 years before he became capt.

one thing that makes me not like the way this is being handled is what skydiver said, right after DADT, kinda like they were waiting on this.

highers ups in command found out about this in 07 and just told him to stop producing/making these videos and that was all that was done. now its a big deal all of a sudden.

 

[nursebusa]

when his command found out about it in 07 then they should have done something then not wait years later when it come out in the news that the only thing i hate they(his command) could have said we handle it then and that would have been the end of it and not take away his ship in my own words what a(bunch of punkass)

 

[speedy21mb]

In the military, we try to handle situations at the lowest level possible. It seems that was being done (poorly IMO), but as soon as the media got wind of it, it blew up and was no longer at the lowest level. That is why they are making a big deal about it now, because now the public knows about it and therefore they have to make an example out of the guy.

 

[ogre]

Stevan LaVigne, on the “Dump Owen Honors” page, posted: “Gay bashing, hazing, rape and all the other things the old-boy network are getting away with must stop. Women are victimized constantly in the service and people like Honors just promote it.”

this is bs. all a female needs to do is mention the improper action of a male, and he ends up in a world of ****. i know a number of soldiers who WON'T socialize with female soldiers for fear of just that happening. even if it didn't happen, ucmj sides with the female, and the other soldier is tossed out of the service. not that all women are vindictive enough to do that, and ones who are genuinely harassed and victimized should take full advantage of the support offered. that being said, there are still abuses of the system that result in the discharge of good soldiers. more will come, mark my words.

 

[Big Bo]

Folks just want to have fun. The PC croud has killed fun in the USA.

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Somehow I don't really see it as much about the gay lobby waiting till now and then trying to remove him as much as it was just something that had been cooking for a couple of years and then boiled over into public spotlight. With it out in public and having caught wind it started to sail and unfortunately for him something had to be done. There may be folks higher up than him who are really distraught they had to remove a lifelong friend and Capt.
May not have wanted to do so but at risk of looking like they were trying to ignore it and cover it up they were forced to act and discipline him.
Kinda one of those 'We are very sorry but there is nothing we can do and until you go away this won't' things ?

 

[Troppo]

He deserved it.

A complete lack of judgement.

Command requires judgement and, above all, common sense.

He had neither.

 

[HT_USMC]

I'm sorry but I completely disagree with their decision. Ships still practice "shell backs" when crossing the equator. This is a ritual that has a few men dress as women, those crossing for the first time are typically stripped down to there skivvies for 24+ hours, and some moderate hazing ensues. Then an entry made in the sailor's or Marine's service record book. This means the service is well aware that this occurs.

Now as the XO, doing these kind of things while afloat can boost moral, make the officers seem more personable, and provide some fodder for conversation in an otherwise boring sea.

The simple fact that not a single formal complaint was filed speaks volumes about the way in which it was received by the intended audience.

Finally, the military mindset is not synonymous with that of the civilian mindset. For example, service men who are straight as an arrow can act very overtly homosexual just to get a laugh (and go no further than the laugh) and in the wrong context would be misunderstood.

They are wrong to handle this in this manner, if this is the whole story.

Sent from my Nexus One using Tapatalk

 

[Rainbow7]

Captain Honors is simply another victim of the homo lobby, who will do anything to destroy anyone who doesn't accept their perverted behaviour.
He is being used to set an example to other military personnel, warning them that they are not allowed to have an opinion about DADT.

In a sensible world, Captain Honors would never even have been questioned about this.

 

[UncleSteve]

It does not matter when he made the video(s). He made them. He owns them. The responsibility is on him. There is no King's X because stronger action was not taken earlier. The bill had to paid and the price was high. When his dirty laundry went public it was time to pay the tab. He used poor judgment, the Navy wanted to salvage the guy years ago. I am sure he and his superiors knew it would go public someday. That day came and now his career is history. Like it or not, it is what it is. It is no way for an officer to behave. He forgot, he is not one of the "sailors"
The level of forgiveness is directly related to the level of command. Not much forgiving goes on at his level. He was on borrowed time. Time ran out.

 

[busabeast]

the military is a different part of society and conduct themselves as such- i say let them do as they please:
no formal complaints from soldiers= no problem.
i dont think that the general public should have any say in what does or does not constitute acceptable behavior in conditions they know nothing about (on a ship in the middle of nowhere going into battle).
think its been blown way out of proportion...

 

[antonio1300]

I dont really make too many comments on here, but for this one I feel really compelled to. I am in the Army and maybe thats why I really dont understand how this would make this officer more personable. In the Army you want to be able to approach your officer with certain issues but I really wouldnt feel safe deploying to the areas I have deployed to if my LT or CO acts in such a manner. You want to be able to trust someone who carries high rank with your life and to make the tough decisions. I know that alot of the times those decisions are left to Non-Commissioned Officers, but ask anyone in the Army, the final decision will be made by a Officer whether right or wrong. This was obviously a wrong decision for this officer. I hate to see anyone lose there job for anything but you also have to weigh the consequences of your actions before you make them. That is something that we are always taught as servicemen and especially if you carry rank above that of a E-4. This is just my opinion.

 

[outlawbusa]

What's strange is it took a newspaper writing an article about it to bring attn to the matter?

Right or Wrong, the Navy pushed the issue aside and overlooked it for years. The media attention seems to be what brought it to the front of the attention list...

 

[skydivr]

I dont really make too many comments on here, but for this one I feel really compelled to. I am in the Army and maybe thats why I really dont understand how this would make this officer more personable. In the Army you want to be able to approach your officer with certain issues but I really wouldnt feel safe deploying to the areas I have deployed to if my LT or CO acts in such a manner. You want to be able to trust someone who carries high rank with your life and to make the tough decisions. I know that alot of the times those decisions are left to Non-Commissioned Officers, but ask anyone in the Army, the final decision will be made by a Officer whether right or wrong. This was obviously a wrong decision for this officer. I hate to see anyone lose there job for anything but you also have to weigh the consequences of your actions before you make them. That is something that we are always taught as servicemen and especially if you carry rank above that of a E-4. This is just my opinion.

Good post soldier. You and Uncle Steve are right. If this had been a LT (JG) he would have gotten away with a little azz-chewing. The higher you get in rank the more you have to be sensitive to "whatever I say/do/email is gonna be posted on the front page of the newspaper, so I'd better conduct myself accordingly".

I've been the XO of a military organization nearly the size of the Enterprise, so I have some perspective. The XO's job is what you make of it, and it's a GREAT job to have (depending on your boss). You have a lot of authority but not nearly the responsibility as the Commander. This warship was deployed on combat operations; that's 24/7, 12-on, 12-off, hot-bunking, no-mistakes, live bombs, fuel and flying aircraft - That's Death staring you in the face; one mistake, the ship blows up. That's what you call a 'high-stress' situation. From what I understand, most of the crew has stood up and said the XO was a great leader, and his 'movie night' was a great stress reliever and brought great humor to the crew. I strongly suspect that, if you got a chance to read his evals, that his actions to keep the crew's morale up are referenced positively and he may have even gotten a medal for his efforts (otherwise he wouldn't have been chosen for Captain). The Navy even KNEW about this WHEN they promoted him, so someone who is now NOT supporting him approved of it.

So, you gotta ask, "why now?" and the answer is the repeal of DADT and the press got ahold of it (and I question the timing and source). What better way to drive home the new PC policy than to fire a few high-ranking guys? Just 5 years ago when this happened, homosexuality was incompatible with military service (and still is IMHO). This guy is being used as a scapegoat, pure and simple. The Navy knew about it, and promoted this guy to Captain and gave him the Enterprise ANYWAY; the PREVIOUS Captain knew about it, and by default encouraged it because he didn't stop it. Either way this goes, the Navy loses and this Sailor loses. The only win is the Gay/Lesbian Agenda.

Having said that, if it were me, I'd have been more careful of the 'salty' language and used more innuendo rather than being overtly sexual. "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas" does not apply at that rank, unfortunately.

It's a shame that we develop real Warriors (which this guy is) to be agressive, brave, bold, audacious and decisive (and we the taxpayer spent MILLIONS on this guy): We NEED these kind of exceptional men and women to protect our shores yet we'd trash all that in the name of political correctness. This WARSHIP was TEN DAYS from deployment - for those who don't understand, a change in command this late in the game undoubtedly effects the ship and crew. Not a smart idea.

I am so glad my retirement certificate is signed George W. Bush and not Barak Hussein Obama.

"Dogs and Soldiers keep off the Grass"

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Good post Skydivr.
Taking him out this close to leaving will defintitely make for a somber atmosphere.


And again I do think it strange not a single formal complaint was filed when all this happened .

 

[Sous]

Hold an anonymous vote on the matter and only allow people who were on board at the time to vote yeah or nay. Then be done with it.

That is the problem with something like this Blanca, we do not have a voting voice in the military. We have the ability to suggest and at times present our opinions, but not so much vote to change a law or regulation.

I personally do not see a problem with the videos, but also think a man in his position should have known better. He was treading on very thin ice from the moment he first showed the video.

 

[rubbersidedown]

Did the Captain himself post the vids,or did someone else?

Maybe he was framed???

Another conspiracy theory.

Was he in the head,taking a shower or asleep when the vids were shown?

???

RSD.

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Did the Captain himself post the vids,or did someone else?

Maybe he was framed???

Another conspiracy theory.

Was he in the head,taking a shower or asleep when the vids were shown?

???

RSD.

He made em, starred in em, and personnally arranged to have them shown on the ships cc tv all week.

 

[HT_USMC]

I've got to be honest here, I'd rather have a CO/XO like this than some of the robotic and political CGs/COs/XOs that I had when I was in.

Simple reason? I know the man understands "human". Sure, we are Marines (or Sailors) but when bullets start flying it's training, instinct, experience, and each other. It's that "each other" part of the equation that makes the most difference in terms of keeping up the fight - the other three serve to get you through "situations"; where "each other" get you through the downtime, the letters from home, the boredom, and etc. A CO/XO that can understand downtime and the stupid/goofy things that are done to unwind is ACES in my book.

As the XO, it is one of his primary functions to keep the crew working as a well oiled machine and oil just isn't that dry. To keep morale up. He did that, in my opinion. People function better because they ENJOY doing their job for a leader like this - it becomes less of a job or deployment and more of a common mission.

The CO (Captain of a carrier in this case) is focused more on the big picture, like fleet or battle group operations. He's watching the moving parts and making sure he communicates up and down the chain what his capabilities are and what they need to be. He relies on the XO to handle a lot of the daily "crew" functions, issues, and life in general - among other things.

Simply put. The XO was doing his job. The Navy acknowledged that by giving him the Enterprise, the crew acknowledged that by going about business without filing complaint (and most likely enjoying the comradery), and what he did is in line with Navy tradition, frankly.