PING: TufBusa (confidence building)

Tufbusa

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Are you dragging your knee RandyMan? Without watching you, it's pretty tuf to make an assessment. If you are on your knee already and your body position is good to go, then all you can do is increase the speed slightly until you begin to push the front tire (Hopefully you have a little throttle on through the turn to unload the front) or spin the rear. At that point you know you have reached the limit of the tires.

Keep in mind, even though you have really good Street/track tires in the 002's you still aren't on genuine race tires so go at it very gently. Little baby steps is the key to staying on two wheels.

If you feel the need to chat, call me!

Aquaman

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To clarify things on my water crash. The reason I pitched it in the river was for the mere split second I was turning into this corner at 60 MPH, I just didn't feel like the tires were warm enough to hold. And I chopped the throttle. Looking back, they prolly were warm enough. This is why you dont want to second guess things...

Keith was behind me on that same road watching me drag my knee thru corners on the Busa with Marlene on back the day before.

Chit happens!

Honestly Randy, a smaller track bike and you will do a lot better my friend. I think one of yer problems is that you are afraid to drop your baby on the track. And I dont blame you. If it is your everyday streetbike who wants to destroy it. That is the very reason I got my 750 gixxer...
Dont worry, it will all come.:beerchug:

TruWrecks

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Steven has it absolutely right with the baby steps.

I found that using late apexs on the Busa allows me more time to brake. I can get on the brakes much later, and I have the torque needed to drive out much harder.
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LA Busa

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TURN

Stolen from LA Busa:beerchug:

Word that has saved my bacon MANY times! Some people at a WERA race class came up to me, grabbed my helmet with both hands and yelled:


When all else fails.......................TURN!

Randy, the Busa is pretty nimble to be so heavy, but you can trust it. Mine pushes the front as a bit of a warning that I am rolling back into the throttle too hard / early so look for that sign.
Braking later and carrying some brakes into the turn is where you'll make the most hay on your buds (and come closest to soiling yourself) - steel lines, good pads and bead blasted rotors help...
Dont worry about dragging a knee, that will come when all the little things are done.

Tufbusa is my spiritual (and phone based) track guide, use him before he runs and hides from us!

Mr Bogus

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Also the reason i was doing it so much was because the more you do it the more confidence it inspires. :thumbsup:
you looked totally at home believe me... you were pitching the bike left and right really well and the form looked great.. I was just hoping you knew when and where :)

I am no expert on what form is supposed to be mind you but it looked like you were tucked into the bike really well, head way forward and your knee was not stuck out there like a chicken wing. Some knee drags I have seen looked like they could do it from the upright position.. (bike not really leaned over very far). you were more on the verge of draggin hard parts ... :)

Mr Bogus

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Are you dragging your knee RandyMan? Without watching you, it's pretty tuf to make an assessment. If you are on your knee already and your body position is good to go, then all you can do is increase the speed slightly until you begin to push the front tire (Hopefully you have a little throttle on through the turn to unload the front) or spin the rear. At that point you know you have reached the limit of the tires.

Keep in mind, even though you have really good Street/track tires in the 002's you still aren't on genuine race tires so go at it very gently. Little baby steps is the key to staying on two wheels.

If you feel the need to chat, call me!
I am not draggin knee (but am not all that far off the deck with it (maybe 1 or 2 inches from the few photos I have been able to get).. I just know that something is not right with me (could be on the bike too much yet).. I know I am on the control riders azz an he is knee down with his hand on the pavement..
PM me your number...
To clarify things on my water crash. The reason I pitched it in the river was for the mere split second I was turning into this corner at 60 MPH, I just didn't feel like the tires were warm enough to hold. And I chopped the throttle. Looking back, they prolly were warm enough. This is why you dont want to second guess things...

Keith was behind me on that same road watching me drag my knee thru corners on the Busa with Marlene on back the day before.

Chit happens!

Honestly Randy, a smaller track bike and you will do a lot better my friend. I think one of yer problems is that you are afraid to drop your baby on the track. And I dont blame you. If it is your everyday streetbike who wants to destroy it. That is the very reason I got my 750 gixxer...
Dont worry, it will all come.:beerchug:
I would like to find a smaller bike for the track and may just do that if I stick with it.. I am still seeing if I am up to it physically yet.. It is pretty demanding to ride at that level when you on the AARP mailing list of "you will soon be eligible to join AARP" :rofl:

Word that has saved my bacon MANY times! Some people at a WERA race class came up to me, grabbed my helmet with both hands and yelled:


When all else fails.......................TURN!

Randy, the Busa is pretty nimble to be so heavy, but you can trust it. Mine pushes the front as a bit of a warning that I am rolling back into the throttle too hard / early so look for that sign.
Braking later and carrying some brakes into the turn is where you'll make the most hay on your buds (and come closest to soiling yourself) - steel lines, good pads and bead blasted rotors help...
Dont worry about dragging a knee, that will come when all the little things are done.

Tufbusa is my spiritual (and phone based) track guide, use him before he runs and hides from us!
I will burn that into my head... I have been trying to keep my corners really tight.. Control rider I was working with was dragging knee in front of me pointing right where he wanted the tire.. I was right on his butt and hit the line so I had to be pretty close to where I need to be.. I think maybe some good pics might help me suck it up a bit.. I am just still trying to keep my eyes ahead of my path an off the track right in front of me (has been pretty hard for me)

Hoping as my lap count goes up, my trust in the track and bike will too.. almost 40 years of street riding has left me with a yellow streak I guess :)


I at least have my stuff to work on here.. just be easier if I had some on site help I suppose.. (seems someone told me to go to the school and save this headache.. :laugh: ) (and yea I know who it was) Drag racing is tough but this is tougher in some respects.. it is certainly more demanding of the body than drag racing.. I am putting miles on my tennis shoes every day now dropping some weight and getting more strength in my legs.

skydivr

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Brendan was indeed tapping his knee on the Fontana run, with BusasMom on the back on top of it. And the tires were holding (I was kinda surprised a few times) so I know that intellectually mine should hold, but instinctively I don't BELIEVE yet, so I pull up/back off...

LA Busa, gonna see you in about 2 weeks and am hoping to glean some stuff off you down at Barber. Don't understand the "pushing the front" as a sign that we are getting close...? I talked to Tuf about moving up to intermediate he thought it would be ok, but I think you've got to safety wire everything and wear back brace which I don't have. So gonna have to talk to them. Baby steps. have touched the left puck but not the right one - yet.

Ok Jedei Master Tufbusa, it appears you have a large following, just don't ask me to drink the coolaide! Or, better yet "There is no spoon!"

Mr Bogus

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Yea I am with you... the only time I felt like I have been pushing the front end is with the BT021's and I did not like it one bit... The way the BT002 feels, I think by the time the front end pushes I am going to be in deep trouble (probably just my imagination) but the tires are not giving a hint of slipping after about 2 laps..

I guess I just got to get past the fear factor a bit further.. and this may be weird but I feel better with more weight on the bike digging deep into the corners.. could this be a sign of too much spring on the front? or just my imagination again?

macon454

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you looked totally at home believe me... you were pitching the bike left and right really well and the form looked great.. I was just hoping you knew when and where :)

I am no expert on what form is supposed to be mind you but it looked like you were tucked into the bike really well, head way forward and your knee was not stuck out there like a chicken wing. Some knee drags I have seen looked like they could do it from the upright position.. (bike not really leaned over very far). you were more on the verge of draggin hard parts ... :)

Thanks for the good words.:beerchug:

mike1180

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Hey Randy,
I can extrapolate my theories out to where I think you are.
What is it exactly that you are afraid of?
Crashing right? So…
Here is the alternate view: Crashing isn’t so bad, in fact it is Desirable.
One mans view in this article from Motor Cyclist April 2007.
If you believe in his view, then you could take your bike and keep pressing it until you crash, and that in itself is a victory…ergo no more fear.
No more fear and you can ride anyway you want.
(Now you might want to get another bike to try his theory and save yours.)
A true philosopher considers all arguments.
His is truly one way around the fear of crashing.
Cheers!

CRASH.jpg

Tufbusa

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Randy, Randy, Randy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You simply have a confidence problem, not a riding problem. Well, maybe just a little riding problem but I think it's mostly your confidence. Look at Macon, he has not been on the track yet (At least I think not) and he looks like a pro. It was more mental for him than physical. Although his background in racing dirt bikes gave him an edge. He set his mind to it and worked diligently on a daily basis and bingo, he is looking good. Macon knew he could do it so he quickly overcame his fear of falling over.

Some guys (An gals) catch on very quickly and some take longer. No different than any other sport. I've had guys who had their knee down on their very first school day and some who have half a dozen school days and still not quite there.

Hot tires (Especially your BT002's), stock suspension properly adjusted so it doesn't bottom out and your busa is plenty capable of dragging the plastics with proper throttle control and body position. Leaning your bike like GregBob does takes some getting use to and that takes time in the saddle with a goal in mind.

I wish I could go do a track day with you. I had a military guy as a student last Thursday and by days end he was ever so close to getting his knee on the deck. However, when he first hit the track he was sitting straight up on his bike and looked pretty awkward. The last session of the day I was following him on his GSXR750 and in turn two, which is a pretty fast turn, I could see his puck was almost touching. I found myself mumbling, poke your knee out just a little and you are there. Something happens once a rider has accomplished the knee down that gives a huge boost in confidence. It always makes me feel good to get a guys knee down for the first time.

When we returned to the pit, I was bragging on his good form and improved riding skills. I told him he would be dragging his knees, both sides, on the following day which was a track day only, no school. He told me he would not be at the track day due to lack of funds. So I go find Ms. Valerie (Sully's wife who handles all the funds for school and track days) and ask her to donate a track day to this soldier who was returning to Iraq in a couple weeks. She actually looked Jay up and gave him the following track day free. Damn, we have some good people in this country.

Anyway, to make a long story short, Jay got his knee down on the very first session of the following day and by days end had both pucks looking well used. He had a smile on his face like a wave on a slop bucket!

Give me a jingle Randy and we'll have a good confidence building chat! :beerchug:

SteveO: 360-456-4570

Aquaman

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I agree with tuf on getting your knee down is a great confidence builder. Again, as far as my crash goes, I didn't low side cause my tires let out on me. I chopped the throttle coming into the turn cause I second guessed my tires being warm. Before we left the crot at the gas station. Tuf reminded us about warming the tires a bit before getting too hot in the corners when we left. Somehow as I came into this turn, I felt they just wern't gunna hold for only being a couple of miles up the road. And that's when the bike stood up and I rolled onto the grass and when I hit the brakes! Whammo! Lowside into da river!:whistle:

skydivr

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Randy, Randy, Randy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You simply have a confidence problem, not a riding problem. Well, maybe just a little riding problem but I think it's mostly your confidence. Look at Macon, he has not been on the track yet (At least I think not) and he looks like a pro. It was more mental for him than physical. Although his background in racing dirt bikes gave him an edge. He set his mind to it and worked diligently on a daily basis and bingo, he is looking good. Macon knew he could do it so he quickly overcame his fear of falling over.

Some guys (An gals) catch on very quickly and some take longer. No different than any other sport. I've had guys who had their knee down on their very first school day and some who have half a dozen school days and still not quite there.

Hot tires (Especially your BT002's), stock suspension properly adjusted so it doesn't bottom out and your busa is plenty capable of dragging the plastics with proper throttle control and body position. Leaning your bike like GregBob does takes some getting use to and that takes time in the saddle with a goal in mind.

I wish I could go do a track day with you. I had a military guy as a student last Thursday and by days end he was ever so close to getting his knee on the deck. However, when he first hit the track he was sitting straight up on his bike and looked pretty awkward. The last session of the day I was following him on his GSXR750 and in turn two, which is a pretty fast turn, I could see his puck was almost touching. I found myself mumbling, poke your knee out just a little and you are there. Something happens once a rider has accomplished the knee down that gives a huge boost in confidence. It always makes me feel good to get a guys knee down for the first time.

When we returned to the pit, I was bragging on his good form and improved riding skills. I told him he would be dragging his knees, both sides, on the following day which was a track day only, no school. He told me he would not be at the track day due to lack of funds. So I go find Ms. Valerie (Sully's wife who handles all the funds for school and track days) and ask her to donate a track day to this soldier who was returning to Iraq in a couple weeks. She actually looked Jay up and gave him the following track day free. Damn, we have some good people in this country.

Anyway, to make a long story short, Jay got his knee down on the very first session of the following day and by days end had both pucks looking well used. He had a smile on his face like a wave on a slop bucket!

Give me a jingle Randy and we'll have a good confidence building chat! :beerchug:

SteveO: 360-456-4570

Very kind of them to do that for a redeploying soldier; you just gave him something else to look forward to coming home! Great thread!

Tufbusa

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I didn't low side cause my tires let out on me. I chopped the throttle coming into the turn cause I second guessed my tires being warm.:whistle:

Hey, the reason you crashed is da Aquaman is drawn to water like da spiderman is drawn to skyscrapers! :rofl:

No riding for you buddy along any waterways, beaches or toilet bowls! :moon:

ncfc3s

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Im guessing this would work with bikes as well as it did with me with cars.....find a better rider and talk him into letting you trail him picking up speed with every lap. If you have someone in front of you with a perfect line that you are shadowing, you can shave off alot of time at new tracks.

Mr Bogus

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Im guessing this would work with bikes as well as it did with me with cars.....find a better rider and talk him into letting you trail him picking up speed with every lap. If you have someone in front of you with a perfect line that you are shadowing, you can shave off alot of time at new tracks.
Yes, I am a firm believer of the "rabbit" theory..

But I do have to keep in mind that I have a weight problem with the busa and me.. figure at least 100lbs on the bike and I am at 240 right now myself.. I have to brake a bit earlier than the 600/liter bikes

the knee down thing is right there (I hear them behind me and see them in front of me) but my thing is I know that I am not over as far as I should be off the bike.. just mental and street habits..

Aquaman

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Dont worry, it will come Randy. And once you do it, you will always be able to do it. Make sure you are pivoting your ball of your foot around the end of the footpeg
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