PCV Good/Bad or Otherwise?

[FirstBusa2014]

You do realize that the PCV and the ECU flash do essentially the same thing, except that there are several other things you can do with the flash. Both of these things adjust the AFR maps. The PCV takes the maps from the ECU and applies a correction factor to them to get a the desired AFR map. The ECU flash just adjusts the maps stored in the ECU so they don't need to be adjusted by something like a PCV.

I'm not pushing ECU flashing, because I have a PCV and I'm very happy with it. The PCV is simple, reliable & lots of tuning options are out there. But ECU flashing eliminates the need for a PCV and gives you other performance tuning options, so it's a good option if you have access to tuners who know how to use it. The Bazzaz 1Busa is talking about is similar to a PCV as it also applies a correction factor to what comes out of the ECU, however the Bazzaz offers option like Traction Control so its a very cool product (thinking about going to that myself). It is also more expensive than the PCV by quite a bit.

If you are looking at modifications to the bike beyond the exhaust and minor cam work, the PCV has limitations. The PCV only controls the primary injectors so anything requiring more fuel than the primaries can pump will require you add a secondary fuel module to the PCV to control the secondary injectors. Also if you want to add a quick shifter you have to add the SFM so both injectors are cut when you shift. Also I dont think Dynojet offers a TC setup like the Bazzaz.

Also note that adding the V&H header to your bike is likely to push the AFRs out of normal. I would add the PCV (or whatever option you go with) with the header and tune. This is a significant change to the engine system and while it might not hurt the engine performance will suffer without a proper tune.

I am aware of the ECU Flash and PCV doing basically the same thing. The only reason I would have someone with the ECU Editor set up flash my bike is to remove the limiters and what not. And at this point Im leaning towards not even doing that. But saving my $$$$ and applying it to the V&H Headers and PCV. I can live with the top speed limited and the red line at 10,8
As I stated in another post I like the PC. for the same reason you stated, ease of use. Plug and play, install a generic map and or have it mapped on a dyno and head on down the road.
I know the ECU Editor can do the same and A LOT MORE! To the point of damage to the motor if one doesn't know what he is doing. Hence why Im gonna go with the PCV. I dont have the time to learn the ins and outs of ECU Editor.
Thanks for your input!

 

[Don Hardcastle]

I plan to use ECU Editor to unlock certain features myself, then my local tuner tune with a PCV.

 

[FirstBusa2014]

Exactly Don.
But I personally while having this discussion have begun to think of not bothering with a basic flash of the ecu, at $125 and save that money to put towards my PCV and headers. If I cant hit 200 mpg or up the red line to god knows what it doesnt bother me. I have seen 160 mph up to this point and that was a pucker moment.

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Exactly Don.
But I personally while having this discussion have begun to think of not bothering with a basic flash of the ecu, at $125 and save that money to put towards my PCV and headers. If I cant hit 200 mpg or up the red line to god knows what it doesnt bother me. I have seen 160 mph up to this point and that was a pucker moment.

PM sent . . .

 

[Don Hardcastle]

The only reason I'm going the route I am is because my local tuner isn't familiar with the ECU editor software and I got a GREAT deal on a PCV from a member here.

 

[FirstBusa2014]

Cool!
I have used here in Central FL two dyno's in the past and both use PC to due the tuning. So Im gonna that route after the first of the year.

 

[sixpack577]

With slip ons and a filter you really aren't going to get much from a PCV or an ECU flash. Those mods are gentle enough that the bike can adjust itself to them. Both the PCV and the ECU flash do essentially the same thing, except the ECU flash can access other things in the bike's programming like extending the redline. I have had PCV units since they came out and they are basically bullet proof. But the stock maps are garbage - get a dyno tune. I also have an AutoTune. This allows you to fine tune the bike based on your actual riding, but I have never used it as the dyno tune I got was perfect. Frankly, this is really for the person wwho either races (needs top performance on different gas, altitude, etc.) or people who don't want to dyno tune and are willing to log data and then improve the map over and over until its perfect.

If I was you, I would not bother with any of this in the current mod state of your bike. When you buy a PCV, go to the trouble to hook it all up, and then take the bike out for a spin you are going to think "Why did I spend all the money for absolutely nothing?" You need to get a full exhaust. You will lose 20-25 pounds just switching from the OEM bulk and it will sound better to. Then get a good tune either by adding a PCV or ECU flash. Which one depends on what the tuners you have access to can work with.

NOT true!
The ecu flash is nothing like a power commander.
You will most certainly notice the difference from an ecu flash.
Timing restrictions removed and stp opening rate adjusted makes the bike noticeably more responsive.
Ask ANYONE who has had it done.
The ecu flash combined with air/fuel adjusted on a dyno is also much better than just a PCV dyno tune, which only does air/fuel.

 

[sixpack577]

Exactly Don.
But I personally while having this discussion have begun to think of not bothering with a basic flash of the ecu, at $125 and save that money to put towards my PCV and headers. If I cant hit 200 mpg or up the red line to god knows what it doesnt bother me. I have seen 160 mph up to this point and that was a pucker moment.

The gen2 Busa is only capable of 197mph with stock gearing and perfect conditions.
You'll need a full exhaust, good dyno tune, a 41 tooth rear sprocket/or 55 series rear tire with stock 43 tooth, all the planets in alignment, and likely more than a mile to do 200mph.
The stock speed also off around 7%, you need a Speedohealer to correct that.
So the 160mph was more like high 140's.

 

[fallenarch]

NOT true!
The ecu flash is nothing like a power commander.
You will most certainly notice the difference from an ecu flash.
Timing restrictions removed and stp opening rate adjusted makes the bike noticeably more responsive.
Ask ANYONE who has had it done.
The ecu flash combined with air/fuel adjusted on a dyno is also much better than just a PCV dyno tune, which only does air/fuel.

I know its more involved than I explained it but i figured it was not worth going into all of that. Basically in the ECU you have access to everything the bike can do that the factory shut off on the OEM bike. I only went into the basic explaination because it seemed like 1stbusa2014 was not clear on the basic distinction between the choices he has on an upgrade path.

If I'm starting all over again, I would go ECU flash for sure.

 

[sixpack577]

I know its more involved than I explained it but i figured it was not worth going into all of that. Basically in the ECU you have access to everything the bike can do that the factory shut off on the OEM bike. I only went into the basic explaination because it seemed like 1stbusa2014 was not clear on the basic distinction between the choices he has on an upgrade path.

If I'm starting all over again, I would go ECU flash for sure.

I have flashed over 2 dozen gen2 ecu's for members(I have a bench flasher and don't need the bike here).
Takes 2 minutes to change the settings. Click a few boxes, and copy/paste STP settings.
The ecu can be changed or flashed back to stock at any time too
I have a map saved, so now it only takes a few seconds...and about 4 1/2 minutes for the flash to load, and it's done.
Takes longer to box them back up than flash them.
Nothing to it.
I also NEVER touch an air/fuel map.
Dyno tuning is where the skill comes in, and not something I have the resources or ability to do.

 

[fallenarch]

Earlybird (Tim) flashed my ECU a long time ago. But we only set the Limiter to 11,500 rpm and turned of the PAIR system. Tune was done on a dyno through a PCV

 

[sixpack577]

Earlybird (Tim) flashed my ECU a long time ago. But we only set the Limiter to 11,500 rpm and turned of the PAIR system. Tune was done on a dyno through a PCV

If you'll get the Timing restriction(Smart TRE)/top speed limiter removal(removed together in later versions of Ecu Editor), and the STP rates changed, it'll be a much more aggressive/responsive bike, especially at low/mid range.

 

[FirstBusa2014]

I'm gonna have Frank at Powerhouse do the flash and make the changes that you mentioned. He said the same thing as far as the responsiveness of the bike. Big change!
Then after the first of the year I'll get the PCV and the V&H headers. Then in April get it tuned.

 

[sixpack577]

I'm gonna have Frank at Powerhouse do the flash and make the changes that you mentioned. He said the same thing as far as the responsiveness of the bike. Big change!
Then after the first of the year I'll get the PCV and the V&H headers. Then in April get it tuned.

That's the best thing to do since you don't have anyone that can do an Ecu Editor dyno tune(as they would make the other changes at the same time). It will be a different bike, after the flash, and again after the dyno tune.

 

[FirstBusa2014]

Thanks. Looking forward to it.

 

[sixpack577]

Add a +3 rear sprocket(46 teeth) if you really want some get up and go, especially after the flash.
Still have a mid 170's top end too.

 

[Lycan6]

Add a +3 rear sprocket(46 teeth) if you really want some get up and go, especially after the flash. Still have a mid 170's top end too.

And extremely high RPMs at cruising speed too.

 

[sixpack577]

And extremely high RPMs at cruising speed too.

600 rpm more than stock.
That is all.
Hard to notice, and far from extreme.
Had a +3 rear on my gen2, and my B-King(same engine and stock gearing as Busa).

 

[FirstBusa2014]

I kinda like the gearing as it is now. Pulls hard even in 6th when you hit it from a roll. I will compare after Frank does the ECU flash.

 

[Lycan6]

I was plus two on my gen II and rode the bike from Baltimore to Nashville and crushing at 80 my RPMs were really high and I was only getting about 160-170 miles in a full tank of gas. Went back to stick and RPMs dropped significantly. I can't imagine plus three in the rear.