I'm talking about a 25 yard slow fire target. 10 ring is 1.51 inches. Or a 20 yard slow fire target with a 1.12 inch 10 ring.
What are you talking about? A target the size of a man?
Hardballer 45 Longslide
- Thread starter Busaman5000
- Start date
I'm talking about a 25 yard slow fire target. 10 ring is 1.51 inches. Or a 20 yard slow fire target with a 1.12 inch 10 ring.
What are you talking about? A target the size of a man?
I'm talking about a 25 yard slow fire target. 10 ring is 1.51 inches. Or a 20 yard slow fire target with a 1.12 inch 10 ring.
What are you talking about? A target the size of a man?
No, I'm talking about a typical circular 25yd police target used at police ranges all over the country. If I'm in a combat situation, I would be very satisfied with a 25 yd 4" group in the middle of any target! Not competitive but certainly not horrible! I think we're talking about two different things, I carry a piece in case I have to use deadly force, I don't sport shoot, I just practice on probably bigger targets.
i love the accuracy a longslide affords but..hate draw'in'em in timed events..such as saving my life...it's like trying to pull taffy out of a holster!
a tall lanky guy might not have too much a problem but..i'm a short limbed shid..and when my wrist hasta be buried in my armpit to clear a holster?...
its a problem.
a tall lanky guy might not have too much a problem but..i'm a short limbed shid..and when my wrist hasta be buried in my armpit to clear a holster?...
its a problem.
i love the accuracy a longslide affords but..hate draw'in'em in timed events..such as saving my life...it's like trying to pull taffy out of a holster!
a tall lanky guy might not have too much a problem but..i'm a short limbed shid..and when my wrist hasta be buried in my armpit to clear a holster?...
its a problem.
Didn't think of that... but, the way to compensate for the drawing biomechanics is use a breakfront holster. When on duty I carried a 6" Colt Python and, in one motion, one can get incredibly fast into a combat stance (I am 5'11" and not an issue). Just screwing around fun shooting I've never noticed the .45's length but, admittedly, not a life or death situation.
are those "less bare" rare
In California they probably are. I don't think Less ever sent DOJ a 6" gun for them to test. I'm surprised that he has sent in any guns for testing, something about him not needing a state Gov't to tell him if his products are safe or not.
I've got a less rare bare in 5 inch too.Ok, maybe "horrible" was too harsh. How about "poor"?
Accuracy transcends a firearms suitability for a given purpose. A 4 inch group may be satisfactory to some for a given purpose, but to say a 4 inch group is "very accurate" at 25 yards?............... It's just not.
Very accurate handguns shoot Much smaller groups at 25 yards than 3-4 inches. I'll also debate that a 4 inch group is satisfactory in a combat situation. If a gun will only group 4 inches under ideal conditions, whats it going to group when fired under stress? I can't think of any IPSC, PPC or IDPA shooter I know that's going to be satisfied with any gun that can only group 4 inches at twenty five yards.
I've always wondered why AMT called that gun a Hardballer. At six inches it's not legal to be fired in a Hardball Match.
Russ, I think you are a great guy, an excellent motorcycle rider and obviously knowledgable in firearms. If a guy is a good handgun shot and can empty a 6 round clip in 6 seconds or less in a 4" circle, 25 yards away, he/she can be my partner in Watts, where I spent my career. I don't know about match competition and big sights other than when a friend hands me one and says, "try this". When there is no time limit to squeeze off a round, when perfect sight allignment is achieved, when breatherelaxaimslacksqueeze is performed.....then maybe surgical precision can be the measurement.
In my combat training (both as a student and as an instructor), we determined hits based on the location of vital organs on a silhouette target. I was a distinguished expert pistol shot based on a monthly qualification of >290 out of 300 on a circular target and I never put everything inside of a 2" circle! If the timing component was removed, then maybe but I'm not sure. I do remember some of the guys traveled all over for competitive shooting and spent alot of money on match quality firearms.
I think that speaks to the difference between match performance and monthly range qualification for coppers (at least in LA). Doyle
In my combat training (both as a student and as an instructor), we determined hits based on the location of vital organs on a silhouette target. I was a distinguished expert pistol shot based on a monthly qualification of >290 out of 300 on a circular target and I never put everything inside of a 2" circle! If the timing component was removed, then maybe but I'm not sure. I do remember some of the guys traveled all over for competitive shooting and spent alot of money on match quality firearms.
I think that speaks to the difference between match performance and monthly range qualification for coppers (at least in LA). Doyle
In California they probably are. I don't think Less ever sent DOJ a 6" gun for them to test. I'm surprised that he has sent in any guns for testing, something about him not needing a state Gov't to tell him if his products are safe or not.
i hope this is sarcastic humor, if you own a les baer, hopefully you would remember the name you sent all that cash to.
I think you a great guy as well Doyle, a better rider than me and certainly firearm literate. I was merely questioning the definition of what a "very accurate handgun" is. Nothing more.
What? My spelling or California Gun Laws?
The DOJ does require all handgun manufacturers to submit 2 of each model handgun and a couple thousand bucks each to them for testing. They need to determine if they are "safe". One gun they destroy by drop testing the other they keep on file. If they pass they can stay on the "safe list" for 5 years, at which time the manufacturer can send 2 more guns for testing and another couple thousand bucks.
Get this two handguns of the exact same model, just one blued and the other stainless or two tone are considered separately. Meaning that the manufacturer has to send 2 blued models and 2 two toned models and a couple thousand bucks each in order to get them both on the list. Same deal for fixed or adjustable sights on the same gun, barrel length, grips etc. any change........................... 2 guns and the $$$ to get it on the list. Only exception being night sights. Olympic style target pistols are exempt if they are on the Olympic exemption list.
It's ok to transfer handguns between private parties within the state that aren't on the "Safe List". We can't buy a used handgun from out of state that isn't currently on the "Safe List" So say I want to buy an old 686 S&W
revolver. The 686 on the current list has the keyed hammer block, so the older 686 pre lock can't be brought in to the state.
And yes, when this law was implemented Les did say eff u CA.
you misspelled les baer in two posts is what that was about. just figured someone that owned a gun would at least halfway spell the name right. esp a gun that is as high end and high priced like a les.
im aware of cali's borderline communist gun laws. one reason you wont catch me there, vote with your feet if you dont like it.
im aware of cali's borderline communist gun laws. one reason you wont catch me there, vote with your feet if you dont like it.
Sum Beach
Registered
The AMT Hardballer was a nice looking gun with a poor reliability issues. AMT stopped making them in the mid 70's for that reason.
The only reason its famous now is because of its use during the movie "The Terminator"
My suggestion, keep it cleaned and stored away as a collectors item.
The only reason its famous now is because of its use during the movie "The Terminator"
My suggestion, keep it cleaned and stored away as a collectors item.
Hey gun folks, the long barrel .45 of mine depicted above has a stamp/mfgr label that says, "John Williams custom firearms, Orange County, California" Is that considered a "hardballer"? I've always treated it as simply a custom 1911 with a long barrel, anybody know anything about that name? sorry for the semi thread jack! Doyle
Never mind! I just looked it up and learned that John Williams was a gunsmith in Fullerton, CA 20 years ago and did fine work on especially .45's. This thing is a one off keeper (just like my Busa!). Doyle
Heres some better pictures of what it looks like now that I cleaned her up. Still havent got to shoot it.
A pair of Bears. Is that better?
A pair of Non Baers
Schmidt and Weston
Oops that ones a .38 Special
Last edited:
Got to go shoot it today. It shot real nice. Not much kick. Pretty accurate from about 20 feet or so. One of the clips was bad on it. It had got bent some how and would not hold the bullets in properly so I ended up buying a new clip for it. Once I solved that problem it only jammed a few times out of 50 rounds.
Similar threads
