1st gear dead, other gears vague.

JSpeed

JSpeed

Registered
Hi from New Zealand.

This is my first post here. I've looked through a heap of transmission related threads but can't find anything that matches my problem, so hoping this community might be able to help.

Firstly a bit of background. The bike is a Gen 2, 2010 with nearly 50,000ks (31,000miles) on the clock. I'm the second owner and had the bike for 3 years. The transmission was a bit temperamental when I got it, particularly 1st, 2nd and neutral, but this tended to improve when I changed the engine oil. The bike has a few mid-level road performance mods - Yoshi R-22, K&N filter, ecu flash and TRE mod.

The temperamental gear problem escalated during a sedate ride through town! I took a slow 90 degree bend in 2nd gear, just slow enough to cause a mild judder on exit. I then cruised along in 3rd before leaving town and hitting normal highway speeds. I noticed the upshifts were spongy and vague, and when I came to a stop I couldn't get 1st at all. Since then I've had to pull away in second and all gear changes feel vague (no crisp 'snick' into gear). Might be worth adding, when trying to engage 1st it feels a bit sticky!

I'm keen to hear if anyone else has experienced this issue or if anyone might know what the problem is?

While I'm happy to do routine wrenching on the bike digging into the transmission might be a step too far, so I'm also keen to hear from anyone in New Zealand who knows of an experienced Busa mechanic who could tackle this job.

Thanks in advance

(Photo - The big girl on the shore of Lake Taupo, biggest lake in NZ)
Hayabusa in New Zealand.jpg
 
Welcome, good looking bike..

It sounds more like a clutch issue to me especially if it got slightly better once the oil was changed...

I'd say pull the clutch and measure the pack and plates, it might be time for a new clutch pack.

Unless they were flogged hard, gen 2 transmissions aren't known for many issues...

You have a fellow countryman who just happens to be an actual tech @Kiwi Rider on the board as well who is a stellar asset to us all....
 
Thanks @Bumblebee, reassuring to know it could just be a clutch issue... I'm happy to pull out and inspect the clutch myself.

Also good to know a kiwi Busa tech is on the forum! Would be great to hear what @Kiwi Rider reckons.
 
JSpeed said:
Hi from New Zealand.

This is my first post here. I've looked through a heap of transmission related threads but can't find anything that matches my problem, so hoping this community might be able to help.

Firstly a bit of background. The bike is a Gen 2, 2010 with nearly 50,000ks (31,000miles) on the clock. I'm the second owner and had the bike for 3 years. The transmission was a bit temperamental when I got it, particularly 1st, 2nd and neutral, but this tended to improve when I changed the engine oil. The bike has a few mid-level road performance mods - Yoshi R-22, K&N filter, ecu flash and TRE mod.

The temperamental gear problem escalated during a sedate ride through town! I took a slow 90 degree bend in 2nd gear, just slow enough to cause a mild judder on exit. I then cruised along in 3rd before leaving town and hitting normal highway speeds. I noticed the upshifts were spongy and vague, and when I came to a stop I couldn't get 1st at all. Since then I've had to pull away in second and all gear changes feel vague (no crisp 'snick' into gear). Might be worth adding, when trying to engage 1st it feels a bit sticky!

I'm keen to hear if anyone else has experienced this issue or if anyone might know what the problem is?

While I'm happy to do routine wrenching on the bike digging into the transmission might be a step too far, so I'm also keen to hear from anyone in New Zealand who knows of an experienced Busa mechanic who could tackle this job.

Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Welcome along mate,
I think the very first thing to do that is quick and easy is to flush new brake fluid through the clutch hydraulics.
This often changes how well the clutch operation works, I've had a 2 gen Busa that had half the lever was freeplay, flushed and bled the clutch, all back to normal again.
If the problem persists the next thing I would look at is the clutch pack condition and measurement of the plates, and the pack height.
While in there, I'd remove the clutch basket and take a look at the gear shifting mechanism, the gear shift cam plate (star thingy) and the stopper arm spring (may be weak, bent or broken)
No 9 and no 14 on this diagram.
These are the first things to look at when diagnosing this type of fault.
Pity you're in the N Island, where are you? Taupo?


Gear shifting for 2010 Suzuki GSX1300 | sales region, , 11560738-723679

Looking for genuine OEM Gear shifting for 2010 Suzuki GSX1300 ( sales region, , 11560738-723679)? Check on MegaZip at discounted price from manufacturers' warehouses in Japan, USA, UAE. Detailed diagrams & catalogues. Worldwide shipping. Easy to find parts & order online. Buy now!
www.megazip.net www.megazip.net
 
Good suggestions so far. 1 to 2 is typically temperamental, that’s where the greatest distance is found because of neutral. Not many bikers haven’t experienced issues getting into first, into neutral, hitting neutral when going from 1 to 2. Also check the shifter rod and make sure it’s in the hole, experts will be along
 
Kiwi Rider said:
Welcome along mate,
I think the very first thing to do that is quick and easy is to flush new brake fluid through the clutch hydraulics.
This often changes how well the clutch operation works, I've had a 2 gen Busa that had half the lever was freeplay, flushed and bled the clutch, all back to normal again.
If the problem persists the next thing I would look at is the clutch pack condition and measurement of the plates, and the pack height.
While in there, I'd remove the clutch basket and take a look at the gear shifting mechanism, the gear shift cam plate (star thingy) and the stopper arm spring (may be weak, bent or broken)
No 9 and no 14 on this diagram.
These are the first things to look at when diagnosing this type of fault.
Pity you're in the N Island, where are you? Taupo?


Gear shifting for 2010 Suzuki GSX1300 | sales region, , 11560738-723679

Looking for genuine OEM Gear shifting for 2010 Suzuki GSX1300 ( sales region, , 11560738-723679)? Check on MegaZip at discounted price from manufacturers' warehouses in Japan, USA, UAE. Detailed diagrams & catalogues. Worldwide shipping. Easy to find parts & order online. Buy now!
www.megazip.net www.megazip.net
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice @Kiwi Rider, sounds like a good approach mate.

Surprised to hear how much of an improvement can be gained from just flushing the clutch hydraulics. Do you reckon it's worth me servicing the slave/release cylinder while I'm at it? It's certainly not been serviced in the 3 years that I've owned the bike.

Hopefully the hydraulic flush will do the job, but if not, good to know I still have other things to investigate before having to consider opening the bottom of the engine. And thanks for the link and diagram... really useful.

Yeh mate, I'm based in Taupo - for those that don't live in NZ, that's high on the Central Plateau in the middle of NZ's North Island. Surrounded by active volcanos... geological Russian roulette! :D
 
dadofthree said:
Good suggestions so far. 1 to 2 is typically temperamental, that’s where the greatest distance is found because of neutral. Not many bikers haven’t experienced issues getting into first, into neutral, hitting neutral when going from 1 to 2. Also check the shifter rod and make sure it’s in the hole, experts will be along
Click to expand...

Thanks @dadofthree, really appreciate all the advice on here.

I reckon I've got a plan of attack now. I'll let everyone know how I get on.

Cheers
 
Berlin Germany said:
@JSpeed

remote diagnosis
never is a good idea

check if @Kiwi Rider is in a comfortable distance to you
if yes , ask him to make test ride with ur bike and listen what he felt while the ride.

or join a suzuki mech.
Click to expand...


I understand what you are saying @Berlin Germany, and if @Kiwi Rider was an hour or so away, it would be great. But as @Cantab points out... it's not going to work. :)

Also, I'm pretty comfortable with the diagnosis approach... dealing with simple items first and going from there... and I enjoy waving a spanner or two around.
 
Thanks again for the advice everyone, sorted the problem but I must confess I feel like a bit of a knob! Here’s a quick summary in case it helps someone else.

Finally got some time to look at the bike Saturday morning. Inspected the clutch hydraulic system. I noted fluid was a little low but the lever moved smoothly with constant hydraulic pressure throughout the range of motion (no slack early on). Fluid was starting to darken, so flushed and bled the system with fresh DOT4 anyway. I also took the oil filler cap off so I could see the clutch plates move in response to lever. Outside plate moved approx 2mm, so action looked ok.

It was then that I noticed the gear change lever! It was bumping the side stand when trying to shift into first… yep, the locking nuts had come loose on the adjuster shaft, which allowed the lever to slowly drop over time!

So I’m relieved to report a simple and free fix. I’ve been riding and tinkering with bikes since I was young, so also highly embarrassed to have overlooked such a fundamental adjustment!

Still have some drag on the clutch, and gear changes are a bit rough so I'll continue and take a look at the clutch plates...
 
JSpeed said:
Thanks again for the advice everyone, sorted the problem but I must confess I feel like a bit of a knob! Here’s a quick summary in case it helps someone else.

Finally got some time to look at the bike Saturday morning. Inspected the clutch hydraulic system. I noted fluid was a little low but the lever moved smoothly with constant hydraulic pressure throughout the range of motion (no slack early on). Fluid was starting to darken, so flushed and bled the system with fresh DOT4 anyway. I also took the oil filler cap off so I could see the clutch plates move in response to lever. Outside plate moved approx 2mm, so action looked ok.

It was then that I noticed the gear change lever! It was bumping the side stand when trying to shift into first… yep, the locking nuts had come loose on the adjuster shaft, which allowed the lever to slowly drop over time!

So I’m relieved to report a simple and free fix. I’ve been riding and tinkering with bikes since I was young, so also highly embarrassed to have overlooked such a fundamental adjustment!

Still have some drag on the clutch, and gear changes are a bit rough so I'll continue and take a look at the clutch plates...
Click to expand...
Always a relief when it's a simple fix....
 
JSpeed said:
Cheers @Bumblebee, supports your earlier point about robust Gen 2 transmissions.
Click to expand...
I've had my fair share of "face palm" moments where I was trying and failing to diagnose a problem only to find it was a very simple solution...

One time my son was having an issue with his Honda Civic in which he put an Acura engine in...it was literally running awful and had a huge tick...I was deployed at the time but I was told he figured the engine was no good...

When I got home, I told him to start it up and sure enough the sound was a loud ticking...a sound I immediately knew was valve adjustment being out of whack...I took the valve cover off and found one adjuster was missing and many other were able to be moved by hand as they were so out of of adjustment...within minutes I had all the valves adjusted to specs and even found the missing adjuster screw in the head buried in oil.....when he started it up, it was whisper quiet but the idle was very high and the idle adjuster on the throttle cable didn't do anything...I felt around and found a small tube that was cut and put my finger over the cut end and the idle went to normal....the engine was taken out at a wrecking yard and they cut lots of stuff to get it out...I fashioned a cap for the vacuum tube and the car ran perfectly....

I felt pretty good after that knowing I resolved an issue that most likely would of ended with the car being scrapped...

Long story short, diagnosing an issue can be a real challenge but it's always a good feeling when the "ah ha" moment is realized...
 
I love that 2010/11 black with deep red decals. When I was beginning to hunt for a bike that scheme was at the very top of my wish list. I made the decision to get a newer bike as I do not wrench, but it was stinging to eliminate that scheme!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

S
Gen II transmission 2nd gear
Replies
15
Views
4,549
mister08busa
mister08busa
blacknight
Problem with gear selector
Replies
4
Views
2,866
Telboy2000
T
BIKE DUDE
Gear indicator flip flopping
Replies
7
Views
1,092
High-Gain Busa
High-Gain Busa
B
Clunky transmission.
Replies
17
Views
8,456
Billyroe
B
0
1st to 2nd gear change issues
Replies
9
Views
2,174
lankeeyankee
lankeeyankee
Back
Top