clutch problem

[edsmini]

Hi guys, hope someone can help me with some information.

i am building a hayabusa powered car, the engine is a 2004 and the engine has been lying for around 4 years, the engine has been drained of oil 4 years ago and has been dry stored since. today i turned the engine over by hand and it turns over with no problems but the clutch seems to be seized.

i have converted it to cable clutch as i have not got the space for the slave sylinder.

when i put the engine in first gear and push the clutch lever back and crank the engine the output shaft still turns. if i try and turn the output shaft while the clutch lever is pushed back and in first gear the full engine turns over, i think the plated maybe seized together?

the output shaft turns freely when its in neutral.

any help appreciated :-)

Ed

[sixpack577]

Best way to tell is to remove the cover and the clutch.
It's a simple job.
Here's the service manual. 02 to 07 models are all the same
Service manuals for Suzuki GSX-R Motorcycles, free download of service manuals for your GSXR bikes

[delbert]

sounds like the plates have just stuck together after standing for a long period, as said its an easy enough job to remove , clean and refit the plates .

[lankeeyankee]

I know if I start my 09 cold on the service stands my rear wheel will spin so I can imagine with no chain wheel etc the output shaft will spin with some force

[edsmini]

I know if I start my 09 cold on the service stands my rear wheel will spin so I can imagine with no chain wheel etc the output shaft will spin with some force

well i stripped the clutch to find all the plates stuck together, i managed to mix all the plates up in the process i think i would be safer buying a new clutch kit to be on the safe side. on the plus side the inside of the engine looks new with no other visible problems. would i be better fitting a genuine clutch or is there something better out there?

i should have mentioned that the engine is not in a bike, its destiny was always for my ford anglia 105e. these engines are by far the best bit of engineering i have experienced.

many thanks for all your help regading my clutch, they always look daunting whenyou see the exploded diagram of all the clutch plates, if i get the clutch put back together that will be a miracle. an even bigger miracle if it works.

Ed

[Mr Brown]

Soak the fibers in motor oil for a couple hours, and put it back together. Alternate fibers and steels. As long as the steels ain't burned or warped and the fibers aren't rubbed smooth you are good to go. If you buy a new OEM clutch pack (and you should, with a couple exceptions the aftermarket ones aren't as good...) they come individually bagged so you still gotta figure out what goes where.

[lankeeyankee]

With the extra weight I wouldnt put nothing but OEM steels and fibers back in. Maybe even some heavier clutch springs.
I wouldnt worry about mixing up the clutch plates, as the other user stated soak the fibers in oil, and if the steels show any glazing have them sand blasted or scuff them up with some coarse sand paper to remove any glazing or purple heat marks. lay em on glass and chack to make sure they arent warped. Other then that I would run em unless the car your putting them into makes it hard to access the clutch cover. Keep us updated on this project I would enjoy watching the progress of this build and hopefully some videos of it running

[edsmini]

i thought the clutch fibre plates were different thicknesses? i will have to print off the workshop manual as it should show me what goes where. the clutch wont be warped it was just all stuck together due to not having any oil in it. the steel plates have rust marks on the surface but im sure that if i use some fine sandpaper they will clean up. the fibre plates look ok at a glance.

Regards,

Ed

[fiend]

If I remember correctly there are 2 thick fibers and 2 thick steels in the pack and the rest are thins. I'm not sure the placement matters so long as your stack height is correct

[Mr Brown]

If I remember correctly there are 2 thick fibers and 2 thick steels in the pack and the rest are thins. I'm not sure the placement matters so long as your stack height is correct

The number and size of the thicker ones varies between 99/00 and 01+, but I've used them all, including mixing and matching in order to get stack height correct. Placement don't matter at all within the stack, just make sure you alternate fibers and steels.
Here's an exploded view. Looks way more complicated on paper than it actually is.

[edsmini]

well i cleaned all the plates today (nightmare) then reassembles the clutch, so foook knows if it will work when the engine starts but i have ioled everything that i can see. i turned the engine over using the starter and released the clutch and all seems well. i took the rocker cover off the engine and the inside of the engine is like new. i will drop the sump next week and check everything is ok, then i will put oil in it and turn the engine over until the oil pump get the oil around all the main bearings and cams, fingers crossed that the engine will be ok.

next job is to figure out the wiring. i need to eliminate the tilt sensor, bike stand switch, and work out how to fit the resistor that would normally go in the ignition barrel. mmmm loads of fun coming my way.

Ed

[delbert]

looks an interesting project , please keep us posted with pics of the build lease: will be very interested to see it finished

[edsmini]

well, after fitting a new barnett clutch kit and heavier springs, all seemed well. the engine has been sitting for a while. so today i started the engine up, pressed the clutch and engaged first gear, the rear wheel immediately started turning but when i pulled the handbrake on the engine stalled (with the clutch still pushed down) its like the clutch is not going down far enough (i have converted it to cable clutch) when i press the clutch you can look inside the oil fill hole and see that the plates are free. is it possible that the other clutch plates are stuck together? if i adjust the clutch to go in further i can hear a rattling noise coming from the clutch cover. this clutch is turning into a headache :-(

Cheers for any help or advice

Ed

[edsmini]

hello again :-)

believe it or not I have still not got this sorted out :-(

it goes into gear no problem, but very difficult to get out of gear. its like the clutch is not far enough down. would it help if I put standard clutch springs back in, could the Barnett ones be too heavy?

if I adjust the clutch cable up, I can hear a rattling noise. if I open the oil filler cap, I can see the plates separating when the clutch is pressed. I am really stumped with this one, so once again any advice is greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Ed

[shade]

Ill try to help as i had a similar issue -

rolling slowly to a stoplight the bike died clutch died.
holding the clutch in and trying to start the bike - the bike wanted to move forward like the clutch wasnt doing anything.

I was able to get it in neutral and pull it off the road.

further investigation yielded the outermost fiber and steel were warped.
Why? Bike only has 1k miles on it (2013)

putting the bike in gear and holding the clutch the bike wouldnt move.
the fiber was stuck to the steel not retracting. Why did this happen


there seemed to be lots of pressure on the clutch release cylinder rod pushing back - basically keeping the engaged.

The rod i believe in the cylinder wasnt lined up just right and retracing in smoothly. the little plastic cup wasnt seated right

hope this helps

[dadofthree]

Two things to look at, you may have a cracked slave cylinder cover because of the heavy springs. You need a heavy duty cover. While you're doing that make sure the slave cylinder push rod is clean and corrosion free ( slides in and out freely like it should ) Most people soak the fibers for days in oil before installing.

[edsmini]

thanks for the help guys, the clutch is cable operated, and moved in and out freely, so it looks like I will have to get the clutch taken to pieces to see whats going on.

nightmare of a job since its in a car.

Many thanks again, your help is really appreciated.

Ed

[dadofthree]

Best of luck, let us know what you find. It applies to our bikes.