More "Transparency" in Govt

[afterhours]

First off, I'm not "up in arms" about it and this by itself would not concern me as much, HOWEVER given this administration shady policy and agenda it's just another item that I find concerning. It may turn out to be nothing and if so, great, but I have every right as an American citizen to question my government's motives or be concerned with their constant disregard for the people they represent. If you choose to live thinking the government is looking out for your best interest, because you're not capable, then so be it.

Does it make me a nut, because I care, no. Does it bother me if you think it does, no.
You can share information without accusing people of being nuts or as Dino points out being "retarded", but I understand that's how the left operates. It just doesn't intimidate me.

Now where did I put that straight jacket. Need to get ready for bed.

Have a good night.

the time for concern was 1983, when R.Reagan originally signed the executive order.

nobody want you to be intimidated.....you just have no idea of what you are alarmed about.

its been law for over 25 years.

 

[HT_USMC]

I haven't read all 5 previous pages but I've done a bit of reading about what the changes are. I believe it's more then diplomatic immunity of certain people. If I understand correctly, Interpol was just granted immunity in all facets of their operation that take place on American soil.

If this is true, this means that Interpol does not have to share with anyone in our government (Federal, state, local) what they are doing at any time, on US soil or not. Whether they are in the immediate act of "gathering information" or just passively "storing information" as part of an investigation. This, as I read it in more places than one, means that phone taps, gps records, surveillance, and even perhaps satellite/drone tracking of individuals are all within their right. Unfortunately, the records they keep are declared off limits to our own agencys and citizens.

These are the things I don't understand:

As one of the participating nations, should we not be afforded the right to review that information as to aid our own investigations?​

In the day-and-age that the sharing of information has been touted as the way to "do business" in the military arena, law enforcement, and national security, why then are we cutting ourselves off from this information?​

What happened to the backbone America once had? Years past we would have never given up a constitutional "promise" in order to "participate" (I use the term loosely as I feel we're participating in screwing ourselves over) in this type of activity.​

So far, Obama hasn't done much that is noteworthy. However, it seems anything that even years removed we as a nation look back on and appreciate, he's slowly destroying or where congress is concerned he's allowing someone else to do so. When do we say, "enough"?​

Aren't embassies US soil? This would seem to allow Interpol to infringe on that security as well. If they did, how would we ever know, now? We can't even ask for documentation of what they are doing.​

Between the gun control talks, the nationalist/socialist health-care reform, and the trillion dollar bailout debt... how are we not supposed to see this going on and watch the red flags go up. The guy has been in office at roughly a year and there isn't a thing I've seen him do that I'm not cringing over.

Bogus, I'm with you on this. Something doesn't sit right.

 

[HT_USMC]

the time for concern was 1983, when R.Reagan originally signed the executive order.

nobody want you to be intimidated.....you just have no idea of what you are alarmed about.

its been law for over 25 years.

President Reagan was careful about the two sections he left out of that law. It was done in a way as to keep the constitution from being infringed upon. Then that law lasted through Bush Sr., Bill Clinton (two terms), and W. (two terms). Say what you want about any of them but not one of them was a "bad" president. Not one of them touched this after each of them spent four or more years in office.

There's my alarm. I trust those four, previous Presidents far more than I trust our current President. They guy's like a bull in a china shop.

 

[Valkyrye]

... I can't say that we have had a "good" president since before Vietnam...nor can I say I would "trust" any president within the past 80 years.... now I know some of you will throw the age card on me...{grins} and no I'm not in my 90's...but I've read carefully and tried to keep up with where our country has gone in past years... and its that past that makes me worry for our future. Our loss of freedom has not just been infringed on with this president...but it has been slowly insidiously clipped away for many many decades for lots of carefully constructed reasons that we have all swallowed because many reasons in their individuality did not seem like such an insult to our way of life, but combined into the culmination of today and added to the insult of how we are treated by our own chosen elected REPRESENATIVES ... suddenly we feel the pinch of the collar...
Sadly we allowed it, and even more sad is that it is now already there, in place, and removing it will be more difficult. Sad is the country that begins on freedom and falls into control...and so unlike the country that rises from its roots of socialism...
I said before I love my Country...and I do. I'll willingly fight and die to make a point that this country and its flag represent freedom...but...I feel shame and embarrassment for my once unique and respected country. We were NOT like other countries, we were looked upon with a mixture of curiosity, respect, and often dislike by the countries that sought to see us fall. Now we are the wounded country, circled and watched by the world, in part to see if we will rally...and in part to see if we will fall and can be picked over like so many bones. This president didn't do it single-handedly...and no political party is blameless...but none of that matters when you are in a struggle for your freedom. What happened to the unified America?... the one that could come together in times that tested us as a nation? Did our finest fight and die to leave a country of weakness behind? Sometimes I wonder...

 

[dadofthree]

There has been plenty of criticism of Obama on this site without involvement of race. I agree 100% that he has flaws, and has made mistakes, I'm not blind. There is also an undercurrent in certain segments of society regarding his race, you are a fool if you deny this to be true. I didn't play the race card in this thread, just pointed out what had been said. If the person that said those things feels as if race was at the bottom of it, so be it.
If you think I'm a racist, again, so be it. Those that know me in real life know how laughable an idea that is.
I don't know you, or Justyntime in real life, all I can do is form my opinion based on the comments you make, and how you make them.
Your original post has elicited lots of spirited discussion, as I hope was its intent.

Have you seen the recently released quotes credited to Harry Reid and Bill Clinton in regards to the President. Another funny thing often overlooked, not that it makes a darn. Obama's parents are racially mixed.

 

[dadofthree]

He figured this out years ago........
Just funny watching folks reactions to his presidency........

My reaction, thoughts on his Presidency are based on the actions of the administration....................

 

[dadofthree]

With a name like "Mr. Brown", you must one of "Them"



Oops, I mean't "You People"



Damn, I guess that would be one of "Us People"



Don't know, according Harry Reid, you don't talk like "One" !!

Well maybe, you're just American, but I guess NOT, if your dad made & your mom, just happened to be out of the county when you were concieved ..................

I'm confused ........

Fu*k it, Brown you must be a Troll (That's what I get called, when I disagree with the "popular" opinion or I mention anything remotely concerning race) ..........

Oh well, have a good one Bro.

He's awful white isn't he

 

[dadofthree]

You know I asked a while back if we could get some "Afro-American" Emoticons, cause when I do this , I am offended, because my AZZ is not that color!!

I also need a 40 oz. emoticon, and a Chad Ochocinco "Child Please" emoticon, ASAP.

Can a Moderator please make this happen?? Consider it part of Board "Reparations"



(Please no one take this offensively, but today is Monday & I needed a good laguh)

What's a laguh Is that the gullah

 

[dadofthree]

Michelles yellow and wears blue shoes, that's why she's laughing

 

[dadofthree]

... I can't say that we have had a "good" president since before Vietnam...nor can I say I would "trust" any president within the past 80 years.... now I know some of you will throw the age card on me...{grins} and no I'm not in my 90's...but I've read carefully and tried to keep up with where our country has gone in past years... and its that past that makes me worry for our future. Our loss of freedom has not just been infringed on with this president...but it has been slowly insidiously clipped away for many many decades for lots of carefully constructed reasons that we have all swallowed because many reasons in their individuality did not seem like such an insult to our way of life, but combined into the culmination of today and added to the insult of how we are treated by our own chosen elected REPRESENATIVES ... suddenly we feel the pinch of the collar...
Sadly we allowed it, and even more sad is that it is now already there, in place, and removing it will be more difficult. Sad is the country that begins on freedom and falls into control...and so unlike the country that rises from its roots of socialism...
I said before I love my Country...and I do. I'll willingly fight and die to make a point that this country and its flag represent freedom...but...I feel shame and embarrassment for my once unique and respected country. We were NOT like other countries, we were looked upon with a mixture of curiosity, respect, and often dislike by the countries that sought to see us fall. Now we are the wounded country, circled and watched by the world, in part to see if we will rally...and in part to see if we will fall and can be picked over like so many bones. This president didn't do it single-handedly...and no political party is blameless...but none of that matters when you are in a struggle for your freedom. What happened to the unified America?... the one that could come together in times that tested us as a nation? Did our finest fight and die to leave a country of weakness behind? Sometimes I wonder...

I'm afraid for America.

 

[Dino]

I haven't read all 5 previous pages but I've done a bit of reading about what the changes are. I believe it's more then diplomatic immunity of certain people. If I understand correctly, Interpol was just granted immunity in all facets of their operation that take place on American soil.

If this is true, this means that Interpol does not have to share with anyone in our government (Federal, state, local) what they are doing at any time, on US soil or not. Whether they are in the immediate act of "gathering information" or just passively "storing information" as part of an investigation. This, as I read it in more places than one, means that phone taps, gps records, surveillance, and even perhaps satellite/drone tracking of individuals are all within their right. Unfortunately, the records they keep are declared off limits to our own agencys and citizens.

These are the things I don't understand:

As one of the participating nations, should we not be afforded the right to review that information as to aid our own investigations?​

We will be doing that BECAUSE WE ARE A MEMBER NATION

In the day-and-age that the sharing of information has been touted as the way to "do business" in the military arena, law enforcement, and national security, why then are we cutting ourselves off from this information?​

We are not cutting ourselves off.

What happened to the backbone America once had? Years past we would have never given up a constitutional "promise" in order to "participate" (I use the term loosely as I feel we're participating in screwing ourselves over) in this type of activity.​

What are you talking about? What costitutional promise?

So far, Obama hasn't done much that is noteworthy. However, it seems anything that even years removed we as a nation look back on and appreciate, he's slowly destroying or where congress is concerned he's allowing someone else to do so. When do we say, "enough"?​

Aren't embassies US soil? This would seem to allow Interpol to infringe on that security as well. If they did, how would we ever know, now? We can't even ask for documentation of what they are doing.​

You need to understand what INTERPOL does.

Between the gun control talks, the nationalist/socialist health-care reform, and the trillion dollar bailout debt... how are we not supposed to see this going on and watch the red flags go up. The guy has been in office at roughly a year and there isn't a thing I've seen him do that I'm not cringing over.

Bogus, I'm with you on this. Something doesn't sit right.

When you don't understand it is no shock that "Something doesn't sit right"

 

[Dino]

... I can't say that we have had a "good" president since before Vietnam...nor can I say I would "trust" any president within the past 80 years.... now I know some of you will throw the age card on me...{grins} and no I'm not in my 90's...but I've read carefully and tried to keep up with where our country has gone in past years... and its that past that makes me worry for our future. Our loss of freedom has not just been infringed on with this president...but it has been slowly insidiously clipped away for many many decades for lots of carefully constructed reasons that we have all swallowed because many reasons in their individuality did not seem like such an insult to our way of life, but combined into the culmination of today and added to the insult of how we are treated by our own chosen elected REPRESENATIVES ... suddenly we feel the pinch of the collar...
Sadly we allowed it, and even more sad is that it is now already there, in place, and removing it will be more difficult. Sad is the country that begins on freedom and falls into control...and so unlike the country that rises from its roots of socialism...
I said before I love my Country...and I do. I'll willingly fight and die to make a point that this country and its flag represent freedom...but...I feel shame and embarrassment for my once unique and respected country. We were NOT like other countries, we were looked upon with a mixture of curiosity, respect, and often dislike by the countries that sought to see us fall. Now we are the wounded country, circled and watched by the world, in part to see if we will rally...and in part to see if we will fall and can be picked over like so many bones. This president didn't do it single-handedly...and no political party is blameless...but none of that matters when you are in a struggle for your freedom. What happened to the unified America?... the one that could come together in times that tested us as a nation? Did our finest fight and die to leave a country of weakness behind? Sometimes I wonder...

Can you provide ANY substance to this statement? What freedom have you lost in the past year? How exactly are we in a struggle for our freedom?

 

[Projekt]

The "SPIN" is strong in this one friends...

 

[Dino]

The "SPIN" is strong in this one friends...

I think you are giving way too much credit to the level of understanding of this topic. SPIN implies that you know what you are talking about in order to spin in. I am not seeing that.

 

[Projekt]

I think you are giving way too much credit to the level of understanding of this topic. SPIN implies that you know what you are talking about in order to spin in. I am not seeing that.

That may very well be the case. It's more like, regurgitated pre-spun material..

 

[Dino]

That may very well be the case. It's more like, regurgitated pre-spun material..

In some cases, yes.

When you try to spin crap all you get is crap. Sorta like trying to argue with stupid.

 

[Mr Bogus]

First off, I'm not "up in arms" about it and this by itself would not concern me as much, HOWEVER given this administration shady policy and agenda it's just another item that I find concerning. It may turn out to be nothing and if so, great, but I have every right as an American citizen to question my government's motives or be concerned with their constant disregard for the people they represent. If you choose to live thinking the government is looking out for your best interest, because you're not capable, then so be it.

Does it make me a nut, because I care, no. Does it bother me if you think it does, no.

You can share information without accusing people of being nuts or as Dino points out being "retarded", but I understand that's how the left operates. It just doesn't intimidate me.

Now where did I put that straight jacket. Need to get ready for bed.

Have a good night.

You gotta stop and remember that "dino" resorts to the name calling and "his great superiority" (cause he said so) when cornered...

Has been shown enough times and best just to ignore him... The little guy works in a cubicle at some govt job of likely questionable worth.. (after all, look at the hours of his posts... he is either playing while on the job or only works about 2 hours a day, be curious what the policy is about this)..

Anyway it is easy to brush off this little slight of hand until some guy accuses you of something that is not true..

Say Dino is spying for the Russians and Chinese at the same time..(bet you did not know that, but it is out there)

Now they walk into your home, pull your computer and find what "they" consider to be damning material..

no search warrant, no anything but a guess.... (what they were really doing is just poking around)..

The FBI can not operate like this all the time, (but they do on occasion) but if they get a real cozy relationship with say "interpol", interpol uses a few of their "immunity brownie" points and just "collects" the stuff wanted by their buddies at the Fed...

yep, sky is falling alright.. "You think the FBI is going to allow this?" they could not stop a number of coordinated attacks by terrorists, you think they can stop a few "agency" pros? now that is some funny stuff...

If you need more information on this type of stuff , research the FISA act that Obama and the liberal left was so so so upset about... guess who is pushing for it... nothing like a great idea (you know they thought of it first)..

What really appears to be going on is a series of "trap doors" for escape if someone in the govt is caught outright intruding into your home or life without cause (or warrant).. FISA act, Interpol immunity, FBI *cause they can or any of the agencies being granted some type of "immune" status to the law... one grain of rice at a time...

 

[Mr Bogus]

btw, you think the IRS would use any of this stuff for their own benefit? .



.... naw... silly thought....

 

[Mr Bogus]

I haven't read all 5 previous pages but I've done a bit of reading about what the changes are. I believe it's more then diplomatic immunity of certain people. If I understand correctly, Interpol was just granted immunity in all facets of their operation that take place on American soil.

If this is true, this means that Interpol does not have to share with anyone in our government (Federal, state, local) what they are doing at any time, on US soil or not. Whether they are in the immediate act of "gathering information" or just passively "storing information" as part of an investigation. This, as I read it in more places than one, means that phone taps, gps records, surveillance, and even perhaps satellite/drone tracking of individuals are all within their right. Unfortunately, the records they keep are declared off limits to our own agencys and citizens.

These are the things I don't understand:

As one of the participating nations, should we not be afforded the right to review that information as to aid our own investigations?​

In the day-and-age that the sharing of information has been touted as the way to "do business" in the military arena, law enforcement, and national security, why then are we cutting ourselves off from this information?​

What happened to the backbone America once had? Years past we would have never given up a constitutional "promise" in order to "participate" (I use the term loosely as I feel we're participating in screwing ourselves over) in this type of activity.​

So far, Obama hasn't done much that is noteworthy. However, it seems anything that even years removed we as a nation look back on and appreciate, he's slowly destroying or where congress is concerned he's allowing someone else to do so. When do we say, "enough"?​

Aren't embassies US soil? This would seem to allow Interpol to infringe on that security as well. If they did, how would we ever know, now? We can't even ask for documentation of what they are doing.​

Between the gun control talks, the nationalist/socialist health-care reform, and the trillion dollar bailout debt... how are we not supposed to see this going on and watch the red flags go up. The guy has been in office at roughly a year and there isn't a thing I've seen him do that I'm not cringing over.

Bogus, I'm with you on this. Something doesn't sit right.

Thanks, I value your opinion

 

[BlueHaya]

Just because something does not affect you as an individual does not mean it does not affect you as a member of the masses or that it holds any less truth.