Come on guys? It's not like she was selling the country out to Russia!
I have questions,maybe you have answers. George Floyd & Karma
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TallTom
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All sort of true. But then the devil is in the details. In Ga I believe a Taser is considered a deadly weapon. Would you feel differently if he managed to get the cops handgun?
And yes he was shot in the back as he was turning and running away. The cops blew that. As soon as he turned it was de-escalating. But for a moment, should they have done this with another deadly weapon besides a Taser. The fact that the man disarmed a cop and at the least threatened them with a weapon shows he presents a clear and present danger to them.
Again the cops knew when they showed up, he had a record of violent crime and was on probation. Sort of puts the cop in a better likelihood of danger than someone that has no history of crime.
Should a cop let themselves be shot so that they won't be called a racist?
Nope, your eyes are very brown. You don’t know shiite about police work.
Mythos
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And you do? It seems like more right here are agreeing with me than you. I suspect most police would also. and most of the criminals would agree with you. What was that you were saying about police work? Please tell me. I've already researched when an officer can use deadly force. You have as much access to google as I do.
Whether it’s ‘considered’ a lethal weapon or not, it’s not! Not unless it’s used against an old frail person with heart trouble. The taking of the cops handgun would be very different but that didn’t happen. No ‘what ifs please’. Didn’t happen. The cop used his bright yellow taser as a visual warning by drawing it. Cops shouldn’t ‘warn,’ suspects by drawing their taser, they don’t draw their hand gun to warn anybody. If use of the taser is warranted it should be used, right after drawing it. This cop drew his taser point blank, right into the lap of the suspect within a hand’s reach to grab it (and didn’t pull the trigger). Not good and NOT what’s taught.
Again, even from a cop’s POV, a good cop, there were no reckless driving observations, no chase, no crash, no injuries, they simply woke up a sleeping man behind the wheel who had probably been drinking (not so disabled that he had passed out because he woke right up when the cop knocked on his window) (and...and) he was apparently not so inebriated, not such a danger ’to society’ that he was allowed to drive his car away (at the direction of the police) to park it out of the way. Like I said, taking all that in and taking in all that has happened between cops and black people in recent days, couldn’t it have been handled w/o lethal force? The obvious and correct answer is YES.
Mythos
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A taser is less lethal than a gun but it is still lethal. I just read more than 1000 people have been killed by police use of a taser since 2000. Also read 7 out of 8 men and boys shot in the chest with a taser died.
Yes, indeed, if a cop draws that weapon, he best plan on using it especially at close range like that. I'm sure that is a part of training.
The cop told him to drive his car which was a poor choice. He did instruct him to drive it within the parking lot and put the car in a parking space which is not the same as instruction him to drive it onto the street.
As fallenarch pointed out, the choice to shoot when there were cars with occupants a few feet to the right was also not good. Deploying the taser presented some risk to everyone nearby also and a taser has three shots so the guy had one left by my count.
No the answer "yes" is not obvious or correct as we have amply discussed already. Multiple felonies in front of and against the cops, stole and attacked a cop with a taser. I'm not on board with cops bending over for people because they're black. That sets a dangerous precedent. Are police now supposed to give preference to black people? What if they can't tell if the person is black? What if a white looking person is really black? What if the person just identifies as black? Maybe if the police are lenient to all people they think are black, they can treat everyone equal after all the protests blow over. Wait, aren't the protests about discrimination in the first place?
Yes, indeed, if a cop draws that weapon, he best plan on using it especially at close range like that. I'm sure that is a part of training.
The cop told him to drive his car which was a poor choice. He did instruct him to drive it within the parking lot and put the car in a parking space which is not the same as instruction him to drive it onto the street.
As fallenarch pointed out, the choice to shoot when there were cars with occupants a few feet to the right was also not good. Deploying the taser presented some risk to everyone nearby also and a taser has three shots so the guy had one left by my count.
No the answer "yes" is not obvious or correct as we have amply discussed already. Multiple felonies in front of and against the cops, stole and attacked a cop with a taser. I'm not on board with cops bending over for people because they're black. That sets a dangerous precedent. Are police now supposed to give preference to black people? What if they can't tell if the person is black? What if a white looking person is really black? What if the person just identifies as black? Maybe if the police are lenient to all people they think are black, they can treat everyone equal after all the protests blow over. Wait, aren't the protests about discrimination in the first place?
TallTom
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We can TOTALLY TOTALLY agree on the part where cops can use discretion in their community.
It's already been argued successfully that a Taser is considered a deadly weapon. Has nothing to do with being a frail old person. It can't work for one side of the law and not the other. If it was deadly when a cop used it, it's deadly when an inebriated adult does.
Blow in a breathalizer. Blow fail. Take yer medicine like a man.Get in the car.Out in less than 24 hours.
Or...resist arrest,fight the cops,assault them,dis-arm them,shoot it at them,flee,etc.
We have all done stupid things. Who has dropped to this level before?
This is so horrible.Excuse me,I need a tissue.
Rubb.
Or...resist arrest,fight the cops,assault them,dis-arm them,shoot it at them,flee,etc.
We have all done stupid things. Who has dropped to this level before?
This is so horrible.Excuse me,I need a tissue.
Rubb.
Tasers have more recently been determined to be ‘less lethal’ even if fired at an old frail person and are not considered lethal or non lethal. Excuse me. Anyone that receives a strong electric jolt can suffer cardiac arrest. They’re intended use is when lethal force (a final solution) is not warranted, as in this case. A coward shot this guy in the back, period. Had they chased after him he might still be alive.
TallTom
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Yes anything is less lethal than an insertion of a bullet. I think cops are way too fast to use a Taser these days because they are easier than running or using non lethal holds to subdue. They need to lose their jobs more readily as well as their pensions if they abuse Their Rights to use Force that has become too easy to have their Union protect them using nowadays. The cops aren't losing pensions even if found guilty. That needs reform as well.
busabobh
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If you watch the whole video you will see he did NOT wake right up . There was one cop there at the beginning gave the road side test, the man failed, another cop came with a breathalyzer, which he also failed. When he realized he was going to jail he decided to fight TWO cops. Disarmed a cop, ran fired at him. Cops pull their guns as warnings often and do not use them , it’s your last warning. WazzaCBXRider says no what ifs, but then gives us a what if, Had they chased after him he may still be alive! How about he got away, got a car somewhere, hit and killed someone else? Or had he hit the cop in the eye, or the head with the taser and we had a dead or blind cop. We all have our own opinion, mine is this cop is not a coward, and did his job.
I’ve tried waking up passed out people. They’re like the dead. This guy was asleep and the few (seconds) it took to wake him told the cop the same thing. His near instant ‘woke’ and response to the cop might have been what led to him to being told to park his car (by the cop who woke him). Cops do NOT pull their guns as a warning. That’s fantasy. Maybe you can understand this premise, what will the cop do with gun in hand and the suspect runs or wants to fight? Say excuse me, I’ll have to holster my gun first or just shoot him? My ‘opinion’ is based on real police work. Damn man, this ain’t a TV show. He didn’t run, didn’t carjack someone, drive away and kill someone, he didn’t hit the cop in the eye or the head. The cop wasn’t blinded and in fact, was good enough of a shot to put two rounds (in his back) as he was (running away). TV cop shows are crap.
busabobh
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If a cop pulls a weapon and doesn’t use it I would consider that as strong a warning as they come! He didn’t run? I guess he was taking the long way to the police car, after he helped the police lay down? Your right he didn’t kill anyone, he didn’t get the chance. Anyone who has the balls to fight TWO cops takes ones weapon and shoot it at them has the potential of deadly violence. No cop show here, just what I would think is common sense.
ottafish
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Indeed we do. Here's mine
The cops were two up. Get of your lazy arses, and chase the guy down, subdue, restrain and arrest. Do the work what you're paid for and signed up for. Protecting life, not erasing it.
And before you ask, no never been a cop. Been a bouncer for many years, personal protection work and cqc instructor. Chased many people down, both armed and unarmed. It's what I was paid to do.
In re: “He didn’t run? I guess he was taking the long way to the police car, after he helped the police lay down?”
Come on man, I was following your list of what ifs. He didn’t run, after the cop woke him and directed him to park his car, he didn’t run when he got out of the car, he didn’t run during his FST, he didn’t run until he realized he was being arrested which is very common. Panic causes someone to fight or run not balls. If you think common sense was why the cop shot him I’m thankful you’re not a cop.
busabobh
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What I witnessed in lower down town Denver some years ago; I did not see the start , when I drove up a cop had his gun on a brown man (not black) from about 25 ft. Away. The man had a knife, cop told him to drop it and kick it away, then lay down and put his hands behind his back, which he wisely did. Two more cops showed up one put his gun on him from about 5ft. while the 3d cuffed him. The cops put their guns away, helped him up and in the back of the cop car , off to jail. I’m glad I’m not a cop to, also glad your not a cop, I wouldn’t trust you to protect my life and property .
busabobh
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#1 these cop could not subdue this guy.
#2 I don’t know if they could chase him down. #3 who’s life are they protecting. You sir have more experience than I in this field, if you chase down armed people and your not, I’m glad your alive, for as was noted above in a panic someone could kill you!
ottafish
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Re #1 & 2, are the Police in the USA not issued with batons, whether fixed or extendable? Capsicum spray as part of their carry?
Re #3, I thought the basis of the police was to protect the general public from harm. And to pursue those that transgress harm and wrong doing against the public.
I will admit, I have only dealt with a person with a firearm once. And it was many vs one. We stood out the way and let the Police deal with the matter. But I have dealt with other forms of personal armourment and I'm so glad to be away from that life now.. Things have got real crazy in the last 10-12 years..
busabobh
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#1,2 the cops were in close combat at this point , cop got to the easiest and quickest equipment short of his gun he could. I don’t think this guy would stop fighting while the cop gets a baton. If you spray in that close proximity good chance you just sprayed yourself and partner, that’s if he didn’t take it away from you. #3 , we are the general public, he was the transgressor . That’s my point of view, I could be wrong it’s happened before, but I’ve seen nor read anything that changes it for me.
08BusaKY
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