AR enthusiasts......What do you think of DPMS lowers?
- Thread starter redkat05
- Start date
biggest difference between manufacturers is the finish. all are mil spec unless colt. ive had two colt ars and nothing to brag about from either except the money i made from them. i personally like bushmaster for price and quality...
the next few i build will probably be off a larue lower.
dpms is what it is. no bubbles no troubles and cheap.
the next few i build will probably be off a larue lower.
dpms is what it is. no bubbles no troubles and cheap.
Haya01B
Registered
I thought the difference between manufactures were some catered military and law enforcement needs and others catered to the civilian interest. When a rifle is considered Mil-Spec it is with tight tolerances and are very close in spec from rifle to rifle meaning parts from one rifle with most likely fit another from the same maker with no problems where the civilian market allows for more loose tolerances and things fit a little loosely. Case in point the mag well on some S&W M&P AR15s will not accept MagPul magazines with out modifications. Have a buddy with one that had that exact problem and he found other owners with similar problems although there were some who did not have that problem.
Has anyone else other than tofas2c had experience with www.spikestactical.com ?
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TheAtomicAss
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DPMS is good, $189 is not. Unless that's receiver+shipping+FFL fee+kiss on the cheek. Shoot for <$150, all costs combined.
I picked up a Century Arms AR last year. I know some people have bad mouth the Century AR's but I got it for a good price. Its a Colt surplus upper and the Century Arms lower, I have had no issues with it at all. Fires very good with no jams, like everyone was saying they did but maybe I got lucky with it. Its the standard 20 in barrel A2 design.
I've got three of their lowers and a couple uppers. I’d say all are above average of what is out there on the market. There are only about 8 companies manufacturing lowers. The 4 major players in the market are LAR CMT LMT and hmmm one other that cover most of the major brands you see out there. There has been at least two and I think maybe 3 people that Spikes have has make their lowers. There is way more difference than finish. While the critical points of the “mil spec†may be covered not all always are.
The attached picture shows two of my Spikes lowers. You can easily tell they are a different manufacturer. Finish, roll stamps, one is a high shelf, the other a low shelf, mag well.
I’ve got my toys, but the Colts are the ones I depend on until the "toys" are proven as a reliable "tool". If this is your first and you want an out of the box, rock solid, dependable gun, save up and buy a Colt 6920. I understand buying it a piece at a time. I do that quite often, but I am prepared for possible problems. I am willing to work with them, resolve them and then put it to the test before I will stake my life on it.
You will get many opinions on these. Do a bit of research on some of the larger gun forums. Don’t rely on one single person, validate what they are telling you very carefully and spend your money wisely. I have a barrel and a bare upper that cost more than some of the complete cheaper guns on the market.
It does not mean you have to spend a ton of $$$ to get a good one. But do some research and make sure you are getting the value you need out of the parts you are buying to meet your goals.
join ar15.com
tons of info there. ill never buy a colt unless i can get it dirt cheap and make money on it. theres nothing special about a colt. and saying mil spec means tight tolerances???
all lowers are made the same. some take more time than others to machine to higher quality they all take the same parts and go on any upper(except the colts). i can build an ar on any lower and be happy and reliable, the upper, barrel, and internals are where the money should be spent.
tons of info there. ill never buy a colt unless i can get it dirt cheap and make money on it. theres nothing special about a colt. and saying mil spec means tight tolerances???
all lowers are made the same. some take more time than others to machine to higher quality they all take the same parts and go on any upper(except the colts). i can build an ar on any lower and be happy and reliable, the upper, barrel, and internals are where the money should be spent.
heres a pic of my colt tactical elite. most people have never seen or heard. came from colts custom shop....
made $600 on this one.
made $600 on this one.
Matt I’m not picking on you but I feel some of the statements you have made represent a very common misunderstanding of the AR15 world. So, I have to disagree a bit. Colt Special, maybe not. Different, yes sir there is a difference.
How about some documentation or maybe just some other opinions. The others viewing this thread can make their own mind up even if we agree to disagree.
1) The Colt 6920 has all the most desirable milspec features. Most other brands are missing some but that may or may not be an issue to a prospective owner. Check out this comparison chart for current M4 config ARs. There are links at the bottom specs, comparison, explanations of the features, etc.
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA
2) The mil spec is much more than machining tolerances. It is impossible to buy a current milspec AR15/M16 for private ownership. The milspec details the full auto parts. So anyone one claiming to sell you a mil-spec receiver is omitting something. We know it is not going to have the auto sear pin hole, that is a given. So mil-spec for them is advertising. I’ve seen magazine wells that were not machined correctly and would not allow a magazine to drop. The inside dimensions were not within the spec. I’ve heard of several issues with the hardness of the anodizing process. With the mass hysteria going on over the new political leaders, the manufacturers were working in an overload mode to keep up with demand. There is a very high potential for problem is the manufacture cuts quality control.
I’ve got the Mil-Spec document at the house. I’ll see if I can find it online.
3) It depends on what colts you are talking about. Some Colts have parts that will interchange. The 6920 for instance has a standard size front push pin. The trigger and hammer pins are also standard size. I’m 99% sure all current LE6xxx series are the same way.
I’m not saying the Colt is the best bet for everyone, but cheapest may not always be the best deal. At least know what you are buying and make an informed purchase/investment.
I have build about a dozen over the last year. I have build a bunch of different brands incuding dpms. They are all about the same. The one i like the most is Spikestacktical.com (Stripped Lowers : Spikes Tactical) they have the stripped lowers on sale for 89.99 plus shipping to your ffl. Then i would go to akpartskits.com and order your complete kit for just over 400 so you build the gun for around 550$. Smoken deal. 6months ago it was about 700+ to build. Good luck
pm me if you have any questions
BTW ... this is MR AR
He's correct about the time to order...I waited since they were so high a few months ago~!~
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Haya01B
Registered
2) The mil spec is much more than machining tolerances. It is impossible to buy a current milspec AR15/M16 for private ownership. The milspec details the full auto parts. So anyone one claiming to sell you a mil-spec receiver is omitting something. We know it is not going to have the auto sear pin hole, that is a given. So mil-spec for them is advertising. I’ve seen magazine wells that were not machined correctly and would not allow a magazine to drop. The inside dimensions were not within the spec. I’ve heard of several issues with the hardness of the anodizing process. With the mass hysteria going on over the new political leaders, the manufacturers were working in an overload mode to keep up with demand. There is a very high potential for problem is the manufacture cuts quality control.
I’ve got the Mil-Spec document at the house. I’ll see if I can find it online.
Mil Spec is more than full auto too. Some military forces don't even have full auto because waste of ammo. There are spec differences like the buffer tube will be different between commercial and Mil-Spec. Tolerances are a huge factor when making anything for the Gov. I worked at Allied Signal Aerospace (Now Honeywell) in Rocky Mount NC and the tools that machined military products were closely monitered and inspected along with frequent visits from government employees checking in. That much attention was not given to the comercial products. Think about that the next time you are on a flight!
I’ve got the Mil-Spec document at the house. I’ll see if I can find it online.
Mil Spec is more than full auto too. Some military forces don't even have full auto because waste of ammo. There are spec differences like the buffer tube will be different between commercial and Mil-Spec. Tolerances are a huge factor when making anything for the Gov. I worked at Allied Signal Aerospace (Now Honeywell) in Rocky Mount NC and the tools that machined military products were closely monitered and inspected along with frequent visits from government employees checking in. That much attention was not given to the comercial products. Think about that the next time you are on a flight!
look at your own chart. the lowers are just about exactly the same across the board.
you can put any group in most lowers and all that have the cross web machined.
people like you guys are the people i sell my colts to and make money on.
at the end of the i could care less.
list the reasons that makes a mil spec receiver over a civilian receiver. lowers only no parts kit or anything
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Haya01B
Registered
I doubt the selling me a colt thing! I bought a LMT because I did my research on it and found it to be the closest to a service rifle that is going to be more trouble free than most commercial brands. There will always be name brand suckers out there case in point Harley Davidson customers. I am not the guy! So don't drop your pants too soon!
As for the AR I am not a real big fan. I favor the far more reliable trusty battle tested AK platform. I don't have to be concerned about what manufacture or what brand ammo I run through it. Now that's a good rifle hands down.
As for the AR I am not a real big fan. I favor the far more reliable trusty battle tested AK platform. I don't have to be concerned about what manufacture or what brand ammo I run through it. Now that's a good rifle hands down.
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ak dead nuts reliable,
ars
aint gonna touch that with 100000000000ft pole.
ars
aint gonna touch that with 100000000000ft pole.
$189 isn't a bad price, but it's not really a great price for a stripped lower. Nothing wrong with DPMS though. It's good to remember that there are only a handful of companies actually hammering out the Forged lowers then lots of companies buy either the finished lowers and stamp a name or they finish the forgings in house themselves and then stamp a name. So you really can just about toss a blanket over em'
You'll find Colt fans screaming that it's got to be Colt, but ignore em' and their out of spec rifles. Pat em' gently on the head and smile. Ignore the "CHART" they'll bust out on ya as well...
Seriously though, DPMS, Aerotek, Bushmaster, Spikes, Smith&Wesson, are all pretty much the Same thing with a different stamp.
Enjoy the build, it's something I like doing a lot. Just remember it's a real slippery slope once you build one, you'll find all kinds of reasons to keep building.
You'll find Colt fans screaming that it's got to be Colt, but ignore em' and their out of spec rifles. Pat em' gently on the head and smile.
Ignore the "CHART" they'll bust out on ya as well... Seriously though, DPMS, Aerotek, Bushmaster, Spikes, Smith&Wesson, are all pretty much the Same thing with a different stamp.
Enjoy the build, it's something I like doing a lot.
Just remember it's a real slippery slope once you build one, you'll find all kinds of reasons to keep building.
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ak dead nuts reliable,
ars
soooooooo where do we start if intrested in those too?
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