APE high volume oil pump gear probelm

[Aly Kabil]

Hello everyone,

maybe it’s sound strange but my mind will blowout,
2 days ago I installed APE high volume oil pump gear in my stage 1 turbo Gen2 , after that I took the bike for a ride for 20 min and l lost the crankshaft bearing!!! The engine start to make some knocking sound before my garage 500 meter, so I went to garage to check what is this, maybe I have something loose, the. I discovered it’s coming from the engine, I drained the oil and booom copper color, I removed the oil pan and this what I found
What can be the reason

 

[Mythos]

I'll go first and it's only a guess, your oil pump wasn't pumping and the crankshaft bearings spun from lack of lubrication? Could it be a coincidence? Crankshaft bearings have been know to go out on busas occasionally. If you didn't change to a higher pressure relief valve, the oil pressure wouldn't be increased by using the high capacity gear alone.

 

[202mphbusa]

forget the oil pump drive ring on the back of the clutch basket?
some how break that gear?

 

[GIXERHP]

forget the oil pump drive ring on the back of the clutch basket?
some how break that gear?

I have seen this before, when you install the gear if you dont make sure the basket is all the way seated it breaks the cast gear on the back side of the basket

 

[GIXERHP]

Hard lesson learned for sure

 

[Mythos]

I have seen this before, when you install the gear if you dont make sure the basket is all the way seated it breaks the cast gear on the back side of the basket

Would the engine run normally for a short time before the gear on the basket broke? I'm thinking his oil light would have stayed on if the pump wasn't working at startup.

 

[ColdBusa]

Mythos and 202mphbusa asked the key questions. Since you're going into the engine now this should tell us. I know that gear on the back of the hub can be tricky on install sometimes and you could put the hub in without interlocking the pump gear and the hub gear.

I'm always a full supporter of data logging specific information when engine mods are started. Oil pressure (you made a change to your oiling system), fuel pressure (you are adding boost). This will help troubleshooting. I know it's a suggestion after you have had an incident and one may say hindsight, but for others reading, this is important.

 

[Dopey]

I have seen this before, when you install the gear if you dont make sure the basket is all the way seated it breaks the cast gear on the back side of the basket

Assuming everything in the dash was working shouldn't the oil light have came on one or was started and no oil was flowing of the gear was broke? Asking because I had my clutch out last night and now reading this has me second guessing if everything went together right.

 

[Aly Kabil]

Everything was installed correctly 100% and nothing is broken except the crankshaft bearing, some people told me that I should run with more oil since I have 1.5” DME oil pan and with the HV gear I should add more oil, someone said that he is running with 5 liters of oil

 

[ColdBusa]

Everything was installed correctly 100% and nothing is broken except the crankshaft bearing, some people told me that I should run with more oil since I have 1.5” DME oil pan and with the HV gear I should add more oil, someone said that he is running with 5 liters of oil

I was running the original required OEM amount of oil when I ran DME's 1" oil pan and I was drag racing it with no issues. However I was running both the gear and the high pressure relief. I did have a baffle installed, but this only helps you when launching. For street riding, you are probably fine as long as you weren't making mile long pulls. Is running more oil a benefit, yes but would it have prevented this issue? I doubt it.

I run 5L of oil now, but that's because I run DME's wedge pan and I'm running pro street so I'm launching quite hard.

Have you pulled the basket yet?

 

[Mythos]

Everything was installed correctly 100% and nothing is broken except the crankshaft bearing, some people told me that I should run with more oil since I have 1.5” DME oil pan and with the HV gear I should add more oil, someone said that he is running with 5 liters of oil

My thinking is that the high volume gear should pull oil out of the pan quicker but if you still had the stock relief valve, the oil should go back to the pan at an even lower rpm than it did stock. Of course, I'd take the word of people who had experience.

 

[Aly Kabil]

I was running the original required OEM amount of oil when I ran DME's 1" oil pan and I was drag racing it with no issues. However I was running both the gear and the high pressure relief. I did have a baffle installed, but this only helps you when launching. For street riding, you are probably fine as long as you weren't making mile long pulls. Is running more oil a benefit, yes but would it have prevented this issue? I doubt it.

I run 5L of oil now, but that's because I run DME's wedge pan and I'm running pro street so I'm launching quite hard.

Have you pulled the basket yet?

I will pull it on Monday, didn’t have time to do anything except removing the oil pan quickly to check it

 

[Aly Kabil]

My thinking is that the high volume gear should pull oil out of the pan quicker but if you still had the stock relief valve, the oil should go back to the pan at an even lower rpm than it did stock. Of course, I'd take the word of people who had experience.

That’s why am asking to check what experience people will say, I run this motor without any problem for 5 years, I rebuild it one time 3 years ago because of gearbox problem and i rebuild it by myself so I know that there are no mistakes, and I who changed the HV gear

 

[Mythos]

If you're certain you saw the oil pressure warning light turn off when you started the engine, I'd say it was just bad luck. The rod bearing(s) were ready to go any time and they happened to do it after you changed the oil pump gear.

If there's a possibility the oil pressure warning light was on the whole time and you never noticed it, then the basket gear probably wasn't meshed with the oil pump gear. It doesn't seem like the other parts like the plates and the drum would fit together properly if the gears weren't meshed but apparently that has happened to other owners.

 

[Bigboy Busa2]

I have seen this before, when you install the gear if you dont make sure the basket is all the way seated it breaks the cast gear on the back side of the basket

If the basket and gear are not seated correct, the basket is out farther that would cause more distance than normal between basket and slave cylinder and should have a noticeable difference in clutch feel. Or possible hitting inside of the clutch cover. And all that should been noticed before or very shortly during the first ride. Or I'm looking at this wrong. How did the one your talking about happen. I say this because I didn't seat mine correct once, I knew something was wrong, pumped my clutch before startup after assemble and I could tell it wasnt right. Thanks

 

[GIXERHP]

If the basket and gear are not seated correct, the basket is out farther that would cause more distance than normal between basket and slave cylinder and should have a noticeable difference in clutch feel. Or possible hitting inside of the clutch cover. And all that should been noticed before or very shortly during the first ride. Or I'm looking at this wrong. How did the one your talking about happen. I say this because I didn't seat mine correct once, I knew something was wrong, pumped my clutch before startup after assemble and I could tell it wasnt right. Thanks

It breaks the gear as you it is tightened the basket into place, There is a post on the Old boards here about from 2000 Kawi Abusa and another guy all went at it, about what dealership wouldn't do any thing after they installed the aftermarket part

 

[Aly Kabil]

hello everyone, i checked yesterday the engine and everything was installed correctly, i think that the only reason can be the 4.2 liters of oil were not enough when i installed the high volum gear with DME oil pan, because i can't find anything else wrong

 

[Aly Kabil]

I was running the original required OEM amount of oil when I ran DME's 1" oil pan and I was drag racing it with no issues. However I was running both the gear and the high pressure relief. I did have a baffle installed, but this only helps you when launching. For street riding, you are probably fine as long as you weren't making mile long pulls. Is running more oil a benefit, yes but would it have prevented this issue? I doubt it.

I run 5L of oil now, but that's because I run DME's wedge pan and I'm running pro street so I'm launching quite hard.

Have you pulled the basket yet?

i pulled it yesteday and everything is 100% installed correctly

 

[202mphbusa]

so If everything was installed correctly and the Oil light did not come on

You just coincidentally spun bearings after you put the gear in
95% would have happened anyways

 

[Aly Kabil]

so If everything was installed correctly and the Oil light did not come on

You just coincidentally spun bearings after you put the gear in
95% would have happened anyways

So it’s not because of the gear or let’s say maybe the gear suck all the oils…

do I need to change the relief valve coz am still running the stock one