Electrical Troubles

[Rokketman]

I have been having some issues with my 06 for the last 6 or 7k. About 7k ago I had a no charging problem. Found the plug to the R/R was cooked. I ordered a new R/R but it did not fix the problem, I thought it was the Stator and replaced it with a new OEM one. Problem persisted and after ohming out the wires to the ignition switch wound up replacing the assembly.
All was well until a week ago. Rode to work, started it up to stop by a friends job for a few minutes, went to leave, turned the key on, engine cutoff on, hit the starter and nothing. Everything lost power. Towed it home, and it started right up. Did some voltage checks and removed an alarm system because it was showing a slight draw on the battery. All was well. This morning, rode about 20 miles, stopped and after a few minutes attempted to start and again all power is gone.
I got it home and now find this is the issues: Sometimes when ignition is turned on, no power. I checked the voltage on the battery and it goes to 0 or there abouts when I turn the ignition on. I turn key off, battery recovers after a few seconds. Voltage at approx 13.16vdc. Sometimes it will actually let me turn the power on but as soon as I touch the starter button it fails again. I also hear a loud click when it fails which could be the ECU or powercommander as I have the seat and hump off
I know this was long but trying to be accurate for you electrical wizards out there. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[BA BUSA]

Is the battery the original from '06?
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[RussellJ]

The click when the bike fails to start is the starter relay and nothing to pay any mind to. I had a starting problem which killed my battery due to my power wire going to the starter was cut and shorted to ground...

 

[Rokketman]

The battery is pretty new. Replace twice during the recent failures. One of which was a bad battery. I have stripped the bike and checked every connector for cut wires or poor connections. I have ohmed out all the wires I could which led me to the ignition switch the last time. This is the first time I have been able to duplicate anything.

 

[Rokketman]

Well I played with it some and could duplicate my problem with the start switch. The bike does have close to 50k on it and I just started having problems. Thanks for the questions, it helps with troubleshooting. Ordered new switch assy from Honda East Toledo.

 

[Rokketman]

Well, that was a wrong direction. I got the switch after a couple of weeks and installed it. Now I am just plain lost.

I have checked the battery again and it shows 13.16vdc. As soon as I turn the key on it drops voltage to approximately 4 or 5vdc. I also hear a distinct click in the turnsignal/sidestand relay as the power flashes off. I removed the relay and tried to check the diode but could only get a reading one way and not sure of the results.

Now the bike has started a new thing. I turn on the key and the power flashes on and off at the pace of a hazard light flashing. Still have the loss of power when the key is turned on. The voltage scrolls around 5vdc with an occasional jump to 13vdc.

I checked it this morning before leaving for work and the power flickers like a bad connection.

I am thinking the turnsignal/sidestand relay could be a big part of the problem. According to the wiring diagram, it controls several grounds along with powering up several things to include the neutral light which has been off. That could explain the power loss with the key turned on? I did jump the sidestand switch to eliminate it from the circuit.

Any thoughts?

 

[Rokketman]

Nobody has any thoughts on this issue?

 

[twotonevert]

Electrical gremlins are a pain to find. It sounds to me like you have something grounding out and not blowing a fuse. I really wish I could offer more.

 

[dane789]

Take a set of jumper cables and connect to the battery, not the factory connector ends... MAKE SURE you are clamping to the battery. +/+ and -/- Connect the the other ends of the cables to the bike itself........Black to a solid point on the engine, Red to the positive side of the starter solenoid. You are basically adding additional cables to eliminate possible ground or positive side connection issues. Do this and try again.......

Also...try turning the ignition on and connecting a test light between the ground on the battery and the frame itself...if you are getting and light at all on you test light even a slight glow, you have ground issue.

-Dane

 

[twotonevert]

Take a set of jumper cables and connect to the battery, not the factory connector ends... MAKE SURE you are clamping to the battery. +/+ and -/- Connect the the other ends of the cables to the bike itself........Black to a solid point on the engine, Red to the positive side of the starter solenoid. You are basically adding additional cables to eliminate possible ground or positive side connection issues. Do this and try again.......

Also...try turning the ignition on and connecting a test light between the ground on the battery and the frame itself...if you are getting and light at all on you test light even a slight glow, you have ground issue.
-Dane

Good trouble shooting suggestion.

 

[Rokketman]

Thanks fellas! I appreciate the help. I will do some more troubleshooting tonight when I get home. I will let you know where I got to.

 

[Rokketman]

I would like to provide a follow up to the troubleshooting I have done with this issue I had. Ultimately, I discovered the battery as the main culprit so far.

I decided to have the battery tested before starting with the suggestions I was given. I put the battery on the tender(it was reading 11.34 vdc) and hit the rack. The next morning I checked on the battery and the voltage was down to 10.12 vdc. Took the battery to have tested and it checked bad.

I replaced the battery and now I have no issue. I did check the charging system and found no faults.

The battery was installed a year ago after the regulator/rectifier plug melted. I was surprised this battery failed so quickly(original battery lasted for 3+ years).

The testing of the charging system found no faults.

75+ vac from the stator @5000rpm
Diode check of R/R was good
voltage check of the battery indicated 14.96 vdc @5000rpm

It appears it is working properly but I will be watching it closely.

I have learned a valuable lesson, proper voltage reading do not guarantee a good battery. Having it load tested is worth it's weight in gold!

I want to thank all those who offered suggestions for me to try to get my Busa on the road!

 

[Rokketman]

As a follow up, I have been monitoring my voltage on the battery. I discovered while doing the "Battery runs down quickly." troubleshooting tree, that when I was measuring the charging voltage between the battery terminals I have these results:

At idle my voltage was 15.07 - 15.14vdc, at 5k it was 14.83vdc.

I have been doing a lot of reading and found found that my bike passed all tests however, I have this extremely high voltage at idle. I am pretty sure at this point that I may have a faulty regulator/rectifier(even though it passes the diode testing) and it is causing an overcharging condition.

This voltage was taken with a new battery installed so I don't suspect the battery as being bad. I did check the voltage a couple of times and have some questions that someone on here might be able to answer for me.

1. What is the resting voltage for a battery in a busa?

2. I had a battery tender on the battery over night and found the voltage in the morning at 13.62. I timed it for 2 minutes and it dropped to 13.06vdc. Is this normal after a charging?

3. I have left the battery in the bike, hooked up and the voltage went to 12.93 and after 24 hours it went 12.90. After 48 hours the voltage is still at 12.90. Is this what I should be seeing?

 

[IG.]

Your data is absolutley normal. That's what I observe with my relatively new battery.

To easily anticipate any future electrical problems, I would strongly recommend to permanently install a V-meter from RadioShack or similar - connected straight to the battery with a small denomination fuse - like 300mA. You can calibrate it with your digital V-meter. It draws less than 1mA, and therefore there is no need to disconnect it.

By observing the voltage at different times, you would be able to quickly notice any degradation.

RadioShack® Panel Meter 0-15VDC - RadioShack.com


Look on the left side - between the mirror and the handlebar.

 

[Pardini]

Your charging voltages are fine. As you found out the battery voltage tests only give limited info on it's condition.

If everything is working ok at this point then your probably good to go. You may want to check the neg battery cable connection to the frame. Remove and sand lightly. Also the side stand and neutral grounds. They complete the starter relay coil circuit to ground. Too much resistance and it could cause the starter relay to chatter or not quite close and hold long enough to start. The relay can click, but not close if the contacts are pitted from arcing. Jump the coil circut on the relay with 12 vdc then check for continuity across the other two terminals. Poor connections cause a voltage drop and the amp draw goes up to compensate. Burns connectors and drains batteries.