Automakers in deep trouble..

[dreamin_of_ridin]

I have a little problem with these bailouts for the car makers. If they made it so the dealerships couldn't charge the huge "market value adjustment" markups, more people would be able to buy cars and maybe the problem wouldn't be so bad. The Ford dealerships in my area are marking alot of vehicles up by $10K and no one can afford them.

 

[DaCol.]

I wonder if the NEW PRES ELECT is saying: GOOD GOD, what idiot talked me into this

 

[twotonevert]

I have a little problem with these bailouts for the car makers. If they made it so the dealerships couldn't charge the huge "market value adjustment" markups, more people would be able to buy cars and maybe the problem wouldn't be so bad. The Ford dealerships in my area are marking alot of vehicles up by $10K and no one can afford them.

No Joke! We looked at trading a few weeks ago. They wanted to trade retail for wholesale. I couldnt even get them to agree retail for retail or wholesale for wholesale. And I was looking the biggest SUV they make! I got, "thats how car dealers work". Bah, they are not wanting to sell them.

 

[99'busa]

 

[J.Busa]

bad business plain and simple, just like any other bad business. Let them fall. Let all the overpaid workers get normal jobs at burger king and blimpie. I'll walk or ride a bicycle to my job if i have to.

Let america rebalance itself and find its real priorities in life: No more $300 cell phone bill, no more $50,000 trucks, no more 1.5 million dollar houses they shouldn't have afforded in the first place.

+100000

 

[Mr Bogus]

bad business plain and simple, just like any other bad business. let them fall. let all the overpaid workers get normal jobs at Burger King and Blimpie. I'll walk or ride a bicycle to my job if I have to.

let America rebalance itself and find its REAL priorities in life: no more $300 cell phone bill, no more $50,000 trucks, no more 1.5 million dollar houses they shouldn't have afforded in the first place.

Economic Homeostasis take the pill now or later.... they will keep pumping billions into this to try and stop the inevitable... I vote.. let it happen now... Or I suppose if they can hold it off another 20 years, i will be dead by then...

 

[Wag]

Soooo, first we pay a bunch of people's mortagages, then we pay a bunch of CEO bonuses and salaries and now we have to buy people's cars too?

Jeez.

--Wag--

 

[02spool]

Well said WWJD,about sums it up across the whole spectrum of our american, ...um ,unreality! We have been obedient(sp),mindless consumers for far to long.Sad situation we find ourselves in.I personally have stared in dis-belief at the past 10 years of the rabid escallation of consumerism and its obvious implications.. The :American dream: is a notion that I grew up with,that became a sales pitch, about half way thru my lifes journey. Oh well,lets hope this mess is reversable.???

 

[LA Busa]

No Wag, we have not paid anyone's mortgages yet....

I was wondering this evening, before looking at my favourite motorcycle board, what Obama will do when he takes office. I am an options trader, I have to wonder about that!

I too, thought... help the auto industry; big unions, big piece of American economy and image.

GM sunk to the $4.00 range at close today.

Volt coming out in future... Big time Lib (who has enlisted Warren Buffet as an adviser) taking office in January and they love unions... Troops probably on the way home... Not my ideology but I'm not gonna be Prez...

Wondered... will it get to $6.19 by June '09?
Money to be made if'n ya feel brave and right now, the buy in is LOW!

I am gonna kick it around till the market opens Monday, nice thread 8!

 

[WWJD]

lets hope this mess is reversable.???

for what looks like pessimism on my part, I'm actually very optomistic about this sort of stuff. One thing I've learned over time is, we American's don't just lay down and die when stuff goes bad, we pickup our shovel and get to work fixing it. what if the economy collapes? do we all just stop eating, stop working, stop living and fall over where we stand, dead? No! we get up the next day, and figure out the next thing.... how to make it work.... maybe we barter, maybe we jump on multigenerational housing, maybe we use gold instead of paper... whatever it is, just laying down dead is not a realistic option. We pick up, and move on.

 

[shawnski]

going back to auto business, get away from palying games, get rid of rebates, cash back. give us the real value, lets us decide this is what we want to buy or not, if some one can afford buying the car then great and if not too bad, don't use the cash back or rebate because people don't have good credit or down payment or upside down etc....etc....
that is why most american car don't hold value becuase of these bull sh@@ games.
look at every car commercial or tv on newspaper, it is all about how much discount and how much rebate rather than how good of a car we make.
folks we are all as much in fault because we learned and brain washed that this is the ONLY WAY!

 

[Liltroy]

Soooo, first we pay a bunch of people's mortagages, then we pay a bunch of CEO bonuses and salaries and now we have to buy people's cars too?

Jeez.

--Wag--

Thats the problem...we didnt pay the mortgages, we just payed the banks that were holding them money to get by on.And what did they do with it? Alot of them turned around and issued bonuses and extra"benefits" to thier management....they very people that screwed us all in the first place. And the biggest kicker of all is that NOTHING is being done about it. I think I need to change proffessions and become a bank manager, they seem to be the only ones benefitting from all this. I say, if a business cant run on its own then let it fold, yes it may cost alot of jobs but it would be a wakeup call to all the other big business that they cant just abuse the system and keep getting richer!

 

[Wag]

I was thinking that because some of the mortgage bailout money was INTENDED to help refinance people's bad mortgages that it would actually be used for that purpose.

Dummy me.

--Wag--

 

[runeight]

I just don't understand why we, the tax payer, continue to bail out "failures". As I said a month ago, let GM crash. Reorganize through a Trustee. Get rid of the fat, pay off the debt, reorganize worker contracts and move on.

Some of you own small business companies here. Will they bail you out? Nope. Like I said, GM and Ford lobbied for less restrictive CAFE and EPA standards, sold the car/truck line that was in demand and said "the hell" with fuel efficient cars.

"Now we are broke" just doesn't cut it. Close the doors. Start over.

r8

 

[Justyntym]

Let me tell you people something...

It's awfully easy to sit there in your comfort zone and
shrug your shoulders and say oh well...let the fgers go down.

It's quite a different matter when it's you.

I've been in that comfort zone working for a big stable company
for the last 20-25 years. I always thought I had a rock solid job
for as long as I wanted it, till I retire probably.

I have also been very blessed in that I have never been out of work
for more than a day and half, and I've gotten a better job than the
one I left.

In the last 2 years, although my company is still stable it has shut a number
of mfg plants around the country and shut down 1 of the 3 in my town.
We are down to 2 and neither of the 2 are building squat. We are hanging on by our finger nails.

I have watched a lot of good people go, our workforce has dwindled from over 100 to about 25
(and if they work every other week they are lucky). The
same has cascaded down to the suppliers.

To make matters worse, in my area central florida...jobs are a biotch to come
by. One ad in the newspaper for a single job will generate 200 applications.
So if the ax falls for my plant...I have no idea what I will do or what will
become of us. I have a daughter in college and an elderly mother and
a lot of people depend on me.


So my point is...it's real easy to sit there in govt. job or some safe zone
and talk about pulling the plunger...it's quite another to sit there and lie
awake everynight wondering what the future holds. I wonder if it was your
job with the prospect of months of unemployement and losing everything
if we'd be so financialy self righteous.

Oh I firmly see the problems of the economy and creditors, I have a slightly
different take on it (that's long and for another post) but I do believe the
economy will "fix" itself if we can just hang on and give it time.

So how many people work for GM...

 

[runeight]

I agree with you but where is the end?

Let's say the taxpayer bails out GM. GM builds fuel efficient cars and starts to show a profit.

Will the savings be passed to the taxpayer or will GM ask $35000 for the car after a 50 billion bailout?

r8

 

[Justyntym]

Well I don't agree with the bailouts, especially the fanny and freddie bs

but I look at the high unemployemet rate...yahoo laying of 1500 people,
and company after company laying off hundreds and thousands...

We have got to stop the bleeding of joblessness before this will turn.

Of course I don't wonder if it wouldn't be better to give us the money to
help pay for our houses or buy a new car...seems like that would stimulate the
economy more than pouring money into a bloated company to watch it
disappear like it was never there.

Heck forget the mortage and automaker bailout and give every TAXPAYING
american 10,000 dollars as "holiday incentive" and see what happens.
Pull some of the funds out of bloated IRAQ $$$

 

[runeight]

Of course I don't wonder if it wouldn't be better to give us the money to
help pay for our houses of buy a new car...seems like that would stimulate the economy more that pouring money into a bloated company to watch it
disappear like it was never there.

Heck forget the mortage and automaker bailout and give every TAXPAYING
american 10,000 dollars as "holiday incentive" and see what happens.

Exactly but remember, politicians are for themselves and political contributors not you or I. This includes the new Administration.

The last stimulus package offered I didn't even qualify for.

r8

 

[Justyntym]

Course I also think the scorge of the American Auto industry are the unions...

I find it very difficult to deal with union demands and compete in a global
economy. Especially dealing with communist China ???

Ah but...that is yet the subject for another post....

Besides...what are we worrying about...Obama is going to fix everything right

Change...yeah...Hitler was change to, God Help Us lease:

 

[Justyntym]

Exactly but remember, politicians are for themselves and political contributors not you or I. This includes the new Administration.

The last stimulus package offered I didn't even qualify for.

r8

OMG...did you see who he picked for chief of staff ???

WOW...the sob was on Mayor Daily's staff (so ya know he's clean...ya right)
and was on the board of directors for freddie or fanny i forget which...wtf...

So much for being bipartison and reaching across the isles...what a surprise.