To Atomic Ass and his remarks about tax cheating....Please first read the Tax revolt thread that got me involved with this individual's espousal of becoming a tax cheat.
Do any of you guys remember Howard Ruff...the gold guru of the 70's. This type of mentality, as well meaning as it could be, is so far out of practical reach of most people that it is ludricous to dangle this sort of mythical carrot in front of people. Do we need reform?..Do we like all of the things are gov't does? Are we up to our necks in debt and they just keep shoveling it on more every day? What you are espousing is revolution, anarchy...and carried out to the Nth degree results in what? The end of civilization as we know it...and what, sir, do you propose to replace it with? Are you such a leader that can come up with a better constituiton then what was written by Thomas Jefferson? Have you lived in other parts of the world for years at a time like I have and witnessed other forms of government, corruption, tyranny, and civil rights problems that dwarf our problems?
Yes, we have a big problem in America...and it is going to get a lot worse before it gets fixed. Your ideas of getting away from fiat money...money not backed by a tangible value...has been a simmering sore for a long long time. A lot of these young guys haven't been around long enough to have heard all of this crap before. Our taxes, albeit used inconsistently and stupidly, pay for medicare payments to old people who are in the last quarter of their life and need federal help...infrastructure like damns, roads, airports, and parks are paid by our taxes...our military is funded by taxes...our postal system..our social security retirement system...and you want to destroy our system and replace it with what?...I have lived in communist countries and seen what infrastructure they have...what social programs they have...In Russia if you are out of work...there is no unemployment monies, no disability, and few have a retirement at all. Guess what, my friend, guess how most of the business is done in Russia? Under the table...away from the gov'ts greedy fingers. Russians are some of the most clever, hard nosed people you will ever meet. They shoot journalists in the head if you investigate the gov't or the underworld...well at least they give them one warning and the next warning has a loud bang associated with it. There country has so much corruption it makes the boys in Chicago look like school children stealing the other guys marbles. I have personally witnessed things while living there that would be incomprehensible to you unless you understood the mechanisms and the culture...it is not a pretty side
This civil disobedience thing you are espousing raises it's head about every decade or two due to people's disgust at the government. I understand exactly where you are at...but to pontificate this civil disobedience to people who have no earthly means as ordinary citizens is beyond credible thought. A tax cheater has to face the music sooner or later. Stop paying your taxes...use only gold and silver...end up getting caught and pay back what you owe, interest, and fines...and go to jail...Your life is ruined...and for what? No federal court to this date has taken the side of a tax cheat. IRS has and will use any legal mechanism in their large array of tools to disembowel you. And they are quite good at it.
Show us your great plan how to bring America out of this dilemma? But to tell people who count on their jobs and paychecks to feed children, buy groceries, put a little dress on their wife, make house payments...and hide their income from the gov't till it stops to exist and then total anarchy sets in....paalease...the thing that is always interesting to me is this shizzle is usually someone else's disenchanted regurgatation...ad nauseum...What makes you think that someone as insignigicant as you or I have either the mental finess or capital to bring about the revolution our country needs....believe me...it will take alot smarter man than you or I to change this country. I would only ask that if there is to be a revolution that the plans be good ones...that will give our great nation stabilty, nobility, and a sweetness to it that people can believe in and be nurtured by...tax cheating has none of the above mentioned attributes that would instill into people something worth fighting for...
If you have studied the history of civilizations you would understand that governments are necessary evils. To go back to a land with no government, no police, no infrastructure, would be a hell hole ruled by the cruelest and most savage people you cannot imagine...You would have Somalia and Haiti type of societies? Where the cruelest and strongest throw crumps off of their tables to their dogs who will do their bidding....there is no effective governements in either land...this is what you would have us be? Governments need money to operate..to keep order..because, whether you realize it or not, the nature of men at the most basic level is not very refined..the scripture that says it best is "the natural man is an enemy to God" and if you take God out of that and just try to understand it on human terms...we would self implode without the structure and safety of laws, courts, and social programs that keep people within balance..We are light years ahead of the some of our fellow planet walkers...and I am disgusted as well with the direction of our govt right now...but what you saying ...show me how that leads to stability, nobility, and safety by not paying the taxes necessary for our government to maintain order? I will listen..2hip
Do any of you guys remember Howard Ruff...the gold guru of the 70's. This type of mentality, as well meaning as it could be, is so far out of practical reach of most people that it is ludricous to dangle this sort of mythical carrot in front of people. Do we need reform?..Do we like all of the things are gov't does? Are we up to our necks in debt and they just keep shoveling it on more every day? What you are espousing is revolution, anarchy...and carried out to the Nth degree results in what? The end of civilization as we know it...and what, sir, do you propose to replace it with? Are you such a leader that can come up with a better constituiton then what was written by Thomas Jefferson? Have you lived in other parts of the world for years at a time like I have and witnessed other forms of government, corruption, tyranny, and civil rights problems that dwarf our problems?
Yes, we have a big problem in America...and it is going to get a lot worse before it gets fixed. Your ideas of getting away from fiat money...money not backed by a tangible value...has been a simmering sore for a long long time. A lot of these young guys haven't been around long enough to have heard all of this crap before. Our taxes, albeit used inconsistently and stupidly, pay for medicare payments to old people who are in the last quarter of their life and need federal help...infrastructure like damns, roads, airports, and parks are paid by our taxes...our military is funded by taxes...our postal system..our social security retirement system...and you want to destroy our system and replace it with what?...I have lived in communist countries and seen what infrastructure they have...what social programs they have...In Russia if you are out of work...there is no unemployment monies, no disability, and few have a retirement at all. Guess what, my friend, guess how most of the business is done in Russia? Under the table...away from the gov'ts greedy fingers. Russians are some of the most clever, hard nosed people you will ever meet. They shoot journalists in the head if you investigate the gov't or the underworld...well at least they give them one warning and the next warning has a loud bang associated with it. There country has so much corruption it makes the boys in Chicago look like school children stealing the other guys marbles. I have personally witnessed things while living there that would be incomprehensible to you unless you understood the mechanisms and the culture...it is not a pretty side
This civil disobedience thing you are espousing raises it's head about every decade or two due to people's disgust at the government. I understand exactly where you are at...but to pontificate this civil disobedience to people who have no earthly means as ordinary citizens is beyond credible thought. A tax cheater has to face the music sooner or later. Stop paying your taxes...use only gold and silver...end up getting caught and pay back what you owe, interest, and fines...and go to jail...Your life is ruined...and for what? No federal court to this date has taken the side of a tax cheat. IRS has and will use any legal mechanism in their large array of tools to disembowel you. And they are quite good at it.
Show us your great plan how to bring America out of this dilemma? But to tell people who count on their jobs and paychecks to feed children, buy groceries, put a little dress on their wife, make house payments...and hide their income from the gov't till it stops to exist and then total anarchy sets in....paalease...the thing that is always interesting to me is this shizzle is usually someone else's disenchanted regurgatation...ad nauseum...What makes you think that someone as insignigicant as you or I have either the mental finess or capital to bring about the revolution our country needs....believe me...it will take alot smarter man than you or I to change this country. I would only ask that if there is to be a revolution that the plans be good ones...that will give our great nation stabilty, nobility, and a sweetness to it that people can believe in and be nurtured by...tax cheating has none of the above mentioned attributes that would instill into people something worth fighting for...
If you have studied the history of civilizations you would understand that governments are necessary evils. To go back to a land with no government, no police, no infrastructure, would be a hell hole ruled by the cruelest and most savage people you cannot imagine...You would have Somalia and Haiti type of societies? Where the cruelest and strongest throw crumps off of their tables to their dogs who will do their bidding....there is no effective governements in either land...this is what you would have us be? Governments need money to operate..to keep order..because, whether you realize it or not, the nature of men at the most basic level is not very refined..the scripture that says it best is "the natural man is an enemy to God" and if you take God out of that and just try to understand it on human terms...we would self implode without the structure and safety of laws, courts, and social programs that keep people within balance..We are light years ahead of the some of our fellow planet walkers...and I am disgusted as well with the direction of our govt right now...but what you saying ...show me how that leads to stability, nobility, and safety by not paying the taxes necessary for our government to maintain order? I will listen..2hip