My First Experience With Water Injection

H

hendrixgr

Registered
Hi.
I just wanted to say to all those who might be thinking of a water injection system that this thing worth every cent.
I was sceptical but i decided to fit the system as a precaution for i already have a water to air intercooler.
Not only i got better protection against knocking but i found that steam cleaning the injectors and the head makes the engine perform better and above all cooler, the injectors got cleaned up and i can see it in my AFR gauge (when the water injection is off of course).
I did noticed that the bike accelerates better for up to 10 seconds after the system has activated
because this is how long the head takes to come back to the normal temperature.
I run clear distilled water 100% and my system is made from a aquatec 58xx 12v pump (boy this pump is huge)
some relays, a boost switch, an external water pressure regulator and a aquamist nozzle (0.6mm) mounted after the intercooler.
Chris
 
GNBRETT said:
aquamist is a nice setup. can u run methanol with those pumps? or just water?
Click to expand...
I can run anything with this pump as they told me (from where i bought the pump)
It is not a pure aquamist setup i am just using their nozzle which i think is the best money can buy.
My pump is the left most one in the right top photo:
http://www.aquatec.com/automotive-market.html
and to be more exact this one with no bypass
(i am almost 99% sure that this is the one i got because the label was gone as i bought it used):
http://www.aquatec.com/sg_userfiles/Auto-5800_Industrial_1.2_GPM_12Vdc_Pump.pdf
Chris
 
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Unless you have data to back what you're saying, I have a very hard time believing it, and here's why.

I've had to prove this many of times on the dyno, straight water does nothing other then hurt HP. What does water do to fire outside of an engine? Puts the fire out. So yeah there's your detonation protection because you're not even getting an efficient burn.

You will not see the injectors get cleaned in any. Water going through the intake runners is moving too fast to turn to steam, it's only hot enough to MAYBE evaporate. You'll get steam in the combustion chamber, and exhaust ports as a by product of water being "burned". If you needed the benefit of cleaning because you had excessive carbon build up, you need to have your tune checked.

In regards to having better acceleration after the system shuts off... The only way this would make sense is if you were so far lean that the engine was detonating badly and causing sub par acceleration. (Assuming you're talking about part throttle accel.) Then I could see a cooler cylinder head helping that, and could see why you would experience a change there.

However, you're not spraying enough volume of water to make that big of a temperature sway (if even at all) that it would take 10 seconds to get back up to operating temp.

In conclusion, if you have a METHONOL INJECTION system, you'll see the greatest benefits when spraying methonol, not water. Reason being its alcohol, so when it's in a fine mist going through your charge pipes it's actually absorbing the heat in the air charge, vastly reducing iats, thus eliminating detonation.

If you spray enough, that it doesn't evaporate in the charge pipe and the methonol makes it all the way in to the combustion chamber it acts like an octane booster essentially because alcohol has less BTU's then gasoline, it's more resistant to knock, and it burns cooler.

Ever see a magazine or YouTube video of a turbo car making crazy power on 92 pump gas? That's all because of methonol injection. They're spraying enough that engine is actually using it as fuel and allows them to push past the octane limit of pump gas.
 
If you are spraying water what does it do to the oil film on the cylinder walls and is there enough to affect the engine oil itself?
 
Well as you said i don't have any data to back what i feel and how could i?
I could fit temperature sensors in the head, accelerometers, gps and a logger if i had enough money and time but what is the point?
I don't sell anything, i just reported what i feel but then again you may be right and i am merely just too excited and i imagine things except the AFR that went down from 13.5 to 12.6 at idle and the engine fires quicker, of course there might exist another explanation for this behavior like at last i found a gas station with no diluted fuel.
I've had to prove this many of times on the dyno, straight water does nothing other then hurt HP. What does water do to fire outside of an engine? Puts the fire out. So yeah there's your detonation protection because you're not even getting an efficient burn.
Click to expand...
That's why i fitted it as i already have a water to air intercooler, i don't want more power but i do want reliability,
286 Hp ar more than enough for the street and me personally.
Last i wan't to say that WI was (and it is still used by motor companies) by fighter airplanes for increasing power,
sure it was a 50-50% mix but the methanol was there to add fuel so they didn't had to alter the engine fueling
(FAA airplane technology volume 4 i think) so water does cool thus condense the air at altitude.
Btw thank you for sharing your information i always take seriously what the other has to say and think over his opinion, i am not an engine guru but a normal end user with some mechanical knowledge.
Chris
 
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I remembered that BMW had water injection post turbo and after searching here it is:
http://www.m-power.com/_open/s/varlink2.jsp?id=3301&lang=en
It does look exactly like my setup with the intercooler, the water spraying location etc.
Of course it could be a marketing trick (i am serious about that because that big "BMW M Division has a solution") but the article does appear to be logical.
Chris
 
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hendrixgr said:
Last i wan't to say that WI was (and it is still used by motor companies) by fighter airplanes for increasing power,
sure it was a 50-50% mix but the methanol was there to add fuel so they didn't had to alter the engine fueling
(FAA airplane technology volume 4 i think) so water does cool thus condense the air at altitude.
Chris
Click to expand...

Please let me clarify some things. Water injection does not really lower intake temps, or condense the air. In order for the intake temps to be cooled off and condensed you need to remove the heat. To remove the heat it has to be transferred out of the intake system, which water injection is not doing, your intercooler is, but the water injection is not. If your intake charge is 250 degrees F. and you inject 75 degree water mist you could possibly change the intake temps by a few degrees, as you are only sharing temps, no heat is being removed.

The advantage of water injection is when converted to steam in the combustion chamber is absorbs a lot of the heat and takes it out the exhaust ports. In turn working as a very good detonation prevention by lowering combustion chamber temps. Water injection can also somewhat increase hp in forced induction and NA motors by raising the compression slightly while it also absorbs combustion heat.

Richard
 
2wicked said:
The advantage of water injection is when converted to steam in the combustion chamber is absorbs a lot of the heat and takes it out the exhaust ports. In turn working as a very good detonation prevention by lowering combustion chamber temps. Water injection can also somewhat increase hp in forced induction and NA motors by raising the compression slightly while it also absorbs combustion heat.
Click to expand...
Hi,
I absolutely agree, that was my intention in the first place (detonation prevention due to bad fuel, hot spots etc. and not to cool the intake charge, i have a water to air intercooler for that purpose.
I was expecting to loose some power for the sake of added anti detonation protection.
From what i have read water injection allows you to increase timing advance and run somewhat leaner and this in turn produces more power (otherwise you loose power) but all i want is to make sure that i stay as far away as possible from the detonation zone.
Chris
 
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If you really want better protection against detonation why arent you using methanol? Much better than straight water
 
Best info i have seen suggested a 50/50 blend gave best results ,
i use straight water in the LSR bikes i have lots in the ice tank , mostly to control cyl temps which were climbing after a min or so at hi rpm and boost , methanol can make you illegal for gas classes where i run ,
 
OZBooster said:
Best info i have seen suggested a 50/50 blend gave best results ,
i use straight water in the LSR bikes i have lots in the ice tank , mostly to control cyl temps which were climbing after a min or so at hi rpm and boost , methanol can make you illegal for gas classes where i run ,
Click to expand...
This is what i have read also so far.
I guess i can try a 50/50 or 70/30 solution and see what will happen.
Chris
 
If you have a low blow kit & wanna fanny around cooling the charge by maybe 10 degrees & adding a bucket of weight & voltage despair then carry on. It won't hurt & it's good to tell yer buddies about.

At the hard end though on a big power bike battery voltage & spark strength is king. The original small Aquamist pumps were ok but these AEM & other bouncing bomb sized pumps are ridiculous on a bike. When you wonder why your volts are dropping & the injectors are not lifting in their seats properly or the spark is being snuffed out remember reading this.

As alluded, it increases compression in the cylinder which prob accounts for seeing zero change in egt's . It also makes the spark struggle more because some bugger turned the fire hose on! Lol.

Everything you put in that cylinder whether petrol, race fuel, water or alcohol has to get burned & it's not always easy for the poor motor. Misfiring from failed spark or injectors not lifting will blow a head gasket far more than a higher boost pressure. So why make it harder?
 
The other aspect is what you gonna bolt on next? HID lights with its reels of wank wiring? Heated grips next? Funny money indicators that need a box to blink properly. Multiple boost & EFR gauges wired in everywhere etc etc.

Eventually these kinda turbo bikes just end up a right mess when they could otherwise be nice & neat & tidy
 
Well i do like experimenting a bit as it is part of the overall fun i have.
I do agree that the size and weight of the pump is ridiculous.
BTW please remember where i live, today at 3pm the air blowing at me was burning my skin.
Cooling can be a problem on hot summer days here especially when i don't own a car and i have to rely
on my bike everyday.
Chris
 
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