another friday

[fstbusa]

well first off I would like to say I am happy and disappointed in the same night. I am happy how I improved but disappointed in the POS weathermen. I looked online right before I left and there was 10% chance of rain. Guess what it RAINED. Delayed the racing about 30 min and then rained again about 40 min before the nights end. Just enough to not make it worth waiting around.

secondly I want to know how your R/T factors into your ET? I figured if you redlight it shouldn't matter on your ET. The time starts when you break the beam and ends when you break the beam, correct? ok now onto the improvements.

My best(legal) run of the night

R/T: 0.649
60': 1.777
330: 4.475
1/8: 6.629
mph: 114.12
1000: 8.491
1/4: 10.083
mph: 141.12

ok now onto my actual "Best" nonlegal run

R/T: 0.376
60': 1.297
330: 3.984
1/8: 6.141
mph: 114.08
1000: 8.002
1/4: 10.044
mph: 141.67

ok now if my thoughts were correct this run SHOULD have been a 9.5 or so. So how does the R/T factor into your ET?
FastAZZ40th was there and I'm comparing my run to his.

his RUN

R/T: 0.710
60': 1.598
330: 4.179
1/8: 6.254
mph: 118.62
1000: 8.049
1/4: 9.574
mph: 147.31

so if R/T has NOTHING to do with ET I should have ran atleast a 9.5 or so. I'm stumped. Someone enlighten me.

I'm happy overall with how I did. I KNOW I could have gotten into the 9's tonight if it wouldn't have rained. Ahh well there is always next week.

 

[Krieg]

looks to me like your launch and shift points may be causing you some issues. Your partner carried more speed through the 1/8 and therefore left you in the top end. Stability/repeatability will take you further than anything at the strip because you have to be able to do something more than once before you can improve on it. RT will only be a factor on two somewhat evenly run time slips.

JMHO



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[fstbusa]

well thats the thing.. he has more mods. 1" lower in the rear. 16/39 gearing, and an airshifter.

 

[Krieg]

Mods will make a bike faster for sure but in the end it usually depends on the rider. I started drag racing on a street bike and did ok, actually took 4th in the points standing at my local track my first year. I went to a Pro chassis and it made a world of difference though. This was simply due to the fact that I had an acurate way of repeating runs. I had a slider clutch with button launch on my Pro Mod as well as a shift minder, air shifter and of course wheelie bars. All this ment I could launch the same every time without worring about flipping and that I shifted at exaclty the same rpm every run. My times went from 8/10 margins over the course of a night to 1 or 2/100 on the Pro Mod and once I was able to repeat then I was able to fine tune my riding to get the best from the bike. I would again say work on your consistency to get it right then start worring about going faster otherwise you will never know WHY you went faster. Again this is JMHO and best of luck to you!

Here is a pic of my old Pro Mod  

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[fstbusa]

sounds good. I've been trying to launch the same way at the same rpm everytime and it seems to make me consistent if I hit the shift points the same. Usually the only thing that still varies is the amount of time it takes me to get the throttle wide open at launch.

 

[Krieg]

Yep. This is where you should put your effort and practice. Really this is the only reason a Pro chassis bike has any advantage over a street bike. On a Pro chassis bike you push a button to hold your clutch in and open your throttle full so it sits at the low level rev limiter. When you let the button go you launch at full throttle every pass so it takes the guess work out of it. There in lies the consistency.

Couple things you may try to help your consistency:

Get a shift light. They flash at a preset RPM and will help you "remember" to shift

I also remember a device on Schnitz, although it has been a few years ago, that was basically a clutch mod that worked off air and allowed a street bike to use a button style launch. Drawback is it may not be legal for you to use in your class of racing and you would have to find a way to mount an air tank on your bike.

Another thing I have seen is a homemade set up like the one above but working without air. It is basically a mod where you use a spring loaded damper, like the ones on hatchback car windows, and connect it to your clutch so that you can just drop it at launch and the damper actually opens the clutch for you.

Let me know if you have any questions about any of these and good luck!

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[Krieg]

My best(legal) run of the night

R/T: 0.649
60': 1.777
330: 4.475
1/8: 6.629
mph: 114.12
1000: 8.491
1/4: 10.083
mph: 141.12

his RUN

R/T: 0.710
60': 1.598
330: 4.179
1/8: 6.254
mph: 118.62
1000: 8.049
1/4: 9.574
mph: 147.31

On the R/T question you have to first understand that R/T factors into you win/loss margin rather than your ET. What does a R/T do for your ET on a solo pass when your not racing an oponent? Not a thing. It is not a factor in the passes you show because you lost this pass not because of your R/T but because you were outrode. Your friend had a 1.598 60' time compared to your 1.777. You lost .179 right there and your better R/T only gained you .061 leaving you in a .115 deficit in the first 60'. You then lost basically 1.5/10 more by the 330' mark and another 1/10 and 4 MPH by the 1/8. The first 1/8 is key in 1/4 mile drag racing because everything you get working there carries over into your speed and et on the top end. R/T ONLY BECOMES A FACTOR AGAINST AN EVENLY RUN OPPONENT AND THEN ONLY IN THE WIN/LOSS MARGIN, so working to cut perfect lights and blowing the race will get you nothing. Hope this clarifies the question for you.



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[fstbusa]

not really..... so whats the deal with my nonlegal run.... all my "times" at each point are faster than his except for the last one.  How did I get a 8.002 at the 1000' mark and it take another 2 whole seconds to finish the last 320ft and his was 8.049 and only took him 1.5 seconds more.  I find it hard to believe 6 mph is going to make that big of a margin.



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[Krieg]

Well believe it or not that is what it is. You were still 4 mph behind him at the 1/8 even on your illegal run, and speed counts a lot in the last 320'. It is all about momentum. Look at it this way 4 MPH is 5.866667 extra feet per second. Now spread that over the course of the last 1/8 mile, equating roughly to 20 feet, and you should see where he beat you. Honestly though I wouldn't worry about it I would just take every oportunity to practice and I guarantee you that you will catch and pass your friend.

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[Krieg]

OK I thought of a way to illistrate my point. This should clarify the question I think.

You and another Busa line up for a race. You both cut perfect .500 lights and amazingly you both run perfectly the same at 9.500. Who wins this race? Neither because it is a dead draw and although it is extreemly rare it has happened.

Now you two decide to race again and after lining up you cut a parfect .500 light again but your opponent slips a little and only cuts a .600 light. Amazingly again you both run perfectly the same et's at 9.500. Who wins this race? You do. Now for the real question. WHY? You both ran 9.500 through the 1/4 so how did you win? You win because you beat him to the line by 1/10 of a second. Drag racing is a combination of ET and FIRST TO THE LINE and this combination is the MARGIN OF WIN/LOSS. This margin can be effected by your R/T but it does nothing to your ET wich is a constant 9.500. Hope that answers your question.

 

[fstbusa]

I figured it out

if he was traveling exactly 6 mph faster than me at the 1000' mark.  He would reach the traps exactly 0.06315 seconds faster than me, NOT the 0.5 sec you say.



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[fstbusa]

I guess I figured out my own problem.... by him traveling a faster mph throughout the entire 1/4 he gained ground and if at the 1000' we were side by side I would have ran a 9.6 or so but since he was ahead because he was travels a few mph faster throughout the track he arrived sooner.

 

[Krieg]

He wasn't traveling a constant 6 MPH faster than you though. That is simplifying the issue too much. You also need to take into account the velocity as well as rate of acceleraton for the ENTIRE length of the race not just the millisecond you broke the timing light.

 

[Krieg]

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!

AND THE CROWD GOES WILD!!!!!

 

[Krieg]

Anyone that tells you drag racing is easy has either never done it or is completely full of SH*T

 

[fstbusa]

being a mechanical engineer I should be able to explain this but I can't

 

[Krieg]

Like I said it aint easy for anyone, and if it was easy it wouldn't be so damn much FUN!

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[hooken203]

I know you know this. R/T is the time measured from when the light turns green and when you break the beam to start your time. It is not figured into the E/T

 

[Krieg]

On the R/T question you have to first understand that R/T factors into you win/loss margin rather than your ET. What does a R/T do for your ET on a solo pass when your not racing an oponent? Not a thing. It is not a factor in the passes you show because you lost this pass not because of your R/T but because you were outrode. Your friend had a 1.598 60' time compared to your 1.777. You lost .179 right there and your better R/T only gained you .061 leaving you in a .115 deficit in the first 60'. You then lost basically 1.5/10 more by the 330' mark and another 1/10 and 4 MPH by the 1/8. The first 1/8 is key in 1/4 mile drag racing because everything you get working there carries over into your speed and et on the top end. R/T ONLY BECOMES A FACTOR AGAINST AN EVENLY RUN OPPONENT AND THEN ONLY IN THE WIN/LOSS MARGIN, so working to cut perfect lights and blowing the race will get you nothing. Hope this clarifies the question for you.

Uh...I thought I said that

 

[fstbusa]

I know you know this. R/T is the time measured from when the light turns green and when you break the beam to start your time. It is not figured into the E/T

I just had a hard time understanding how I cut a 1.287 60' time and all my times were quicker than his and I still run a 10.0 something and he run a 9.5 something.