Ya'll did NOT tell me...





Blacksmith

Registered
that you cant brake hard and turn at the same time! That's information I feel has been sorely lacking in my 6 weeks of riding education until today. I was on I95 getting off for gas and lunch but the exit lane was full of trucks so by the time I could get over I was still doing 80 and right at the top of the off ramp. This is one of those 180° ramps that's pretty tight and I hit it to hard so I was on the brakes fairly hard and could not make my bike lean. So I got in the gravel and sand at the edge of the pavement and when the front tire started to slide I straightened up fully and rode over the edge (thank God no guard rails!). So here I go over the edge down a 12' embankment through a shallow ditch over a 75 yard wide grassy knoll through another shallow ditch and back onto the pavement of the on ramp where I hang a hard left and quickly leave the scene of debilitating embarrassment and shame. I didn't know if I froze up and did something wrong or what so when I got off at my exit with no traffic around and two lanes of clear pavement I tried again and couldn't believe how hard it was to try and turn while braking relatively hard. Is there something I can change to improve this or it it just how bikes work and yall all knew better and wanted to laugh at me when I found out the hard way? I feel like yall just wanted to laugh...
 

Blacksmith

Registered
THANK YOU!! I actually knew about counter steering but I couldn't figure out exactly why it worked. My dad rode before I was born and used to tell me hope the steering was backwards on the street but it's hard to believe until you feel it yourself. So am I wrong and they're not they hard to turn while breaking hard? I just did a stupid thing from lack of experience (and intelligence)?
 

Mr Brown

Registered
Dude i'm in almost the exact same position as you except I had No experience whatsoever. Two weeks ago today i got my first bike for an early birthday to myself, 09 Busa with full exhaust and power commander, under 6k rpm this thing is very easy to ride. I've had her 2 weeks today and have put a tick over 500 miles on her and never been more than 10 minutes from home! The bike wont do anything you dont tell it to, if an absolute newbie like me can manage one you wont have a bit of problem. I had her at 120 in my first ride and broke 140 since then and the only small wheelie came from an accidental downshift instead of up. Btw beautiful bike, I think white is the best color in a Busa
Remember your earlier post where people who care about your well-being told you a Busa is a bad idea for a first bike? Now you know why. If there's a guard rail on the off-ramp your scenario ends very differently.
We just want you safe and healthy Busa brother.
 

Blacksmith

Registered
You absolutely can brake hard and turn. I'm not trying to sound like a d!ck, but if you can't negotiate a freeway off-ramp, you need to park the bike and go take an AMA riding class.
I've negotiated them with no problem until today, they're usually fun, but I've braked down before getting into the turn so this was the first time I've had to brake hard DURING a turn and it didn't work very well. But yall are saying it was me and not some strange thing about bikes I just didn't know about then I need to go see Mr Dobbs sooner than later for the riding classes
 

Mr Brown

Registered
I've negotiated them with no problem until today, they're usually fun, but I've braked down before getting into the turn so this was the first time I've had to brake hard DURING a turn and it didn't work very well. But yall are saying it was me and not some strange thing about bikes I just didn't know about then I need to go see Mr Dobbs sooner than later for the riding classes
I think that would be a great idea. Like, today.
 

Yellow09

Registered
I've negotiated them with no problem until today, they're usually fun, but I've braked down before getting into the turn so this was the first time I've had to brake hard DURING a turn and it didn't work very well. But yall are saying it was me and not some strange thing about bikes I just didn't know about then I need to go see Mr Dobbs sooner than later for the riding classes
You have to be looking ahead of the direction you want to go, heads up riding is what it's called. In a situation such as you described, you were unable to look ahead very well due to the rushed entry into the exit ramp.

Bottom line is you were going too fast to negotiate the corner especially a 180' corner...

Add to that you never know what is awaiting you in such a corner, spilled anti-freeze, oil, or sand.

You got lucky and I'm sure everyone on this forum is thankful you are OK.
 

Blacksmith

Registered
You have to be looking ahead of the direction you want to go, heads up riding is what it's called. In a situation such as you described, you were unable to look ahead very well due to the rushed entry into the exit ramp.

Bottom line is you were going too fast to negotiate the corner especially a 180' corner...

Add to that you never know what is awaiting you in such a corner, spilled anti-freeze, oil, or sand.

You got lucky and I'm sure everyone on this forum is thankful you are OK.
Pretty much overshot the entry due to traffic (impatience) and was a mistake on my part, you're absolutely right. That's why I was asking you boys cause I didn't know if it was my ignorance or stupidity. Oddly enough I named my bike Pashence, partly to remind me I have to have that every time I saddle up. Guess I left it home this ride
 

Yellow09

Registered
Well, I'll say this for you, you have guts...

Guts enough to hang onto the bike and save it and guts enough to share this with us and the rest of the silver-back riders...

Guts will only get you so far, educating yourself with what to do in these situations is the trick which will save your life.

No worries, there is a thread around here which people talk about the bikes they've crashed...some of their stories are far worse than yours.
 

HayaWakened

Registered
I am thankful you are OK.
As great as MSF and AMA courses are, they likely would not have covered this precise event, but rather the underlying fundamentals. Not knowing you, I would guess you are the wiser now; you are certainly more experienced having survived unscathed, and will no doubt benefit as a rider from this latest course :eek:
 

ROADTOAD1340

Registered
A good and fairly easy thing to remember about riding is always look to where you want to be , so you are constantly looking ahead , adjusting your view to where you are going to arrive , so to where you want the bike to be . Never fix your eye view , fixation is basically courting your demise on a motorcycle .
Another thing to be aware of , is the bike tends to naturally want to stand up when braking hard , so wants to run straight . If you find yourself panic or even braking late into a turn , you got to be really onto muscling it in the bend , counter steer with you body , look where you want to go / be , wash off as much speed as possible then off the hard braking to trailing braking and commit to turn using as much intended physical force to get it done . Never going to be real easy , especially without at least some learnt skills , and of course getting it done is what you are aiming for , but cannot always done !!
The Busa ain't no learners bike , yes she handles okay and you can punt around nice and easy all day , but when you do open that throttle , you may find yourself arriving at a tricky situation with more speed than anticipated , for this type of scenario you want to be packing plenty of smarts .
As the lads have advised , a good riders course will be of good value to most anyone , good luck and stay safe bro .
 

Blacksmith

Registered
A good and fairly easy thing to remember about riding is always look to where you want to be , so you are constantly looking ahead , adjusting your view to where you are going to arrive , so to where you want the bike to be . Never fix your eye view , fixation is basically courting your demise on a motorcycle .
Another thing to be aware of , is the bike tends to naturally want to stand up when braking hard , so wants to run straight . If you find yourself panic or even braking late into a turn , you got to be really onto muscling it in the bend , counter steer with you body , look where you want to go / be , wash off as much speed as possible then off the hard braking to trailing braking and commit to turn using as much intended physical force to get it done . Never going to be real easy , especially without at least some learnt skills , and of course getting it done is what you are aiming for , but cannot always done !!
The Busa ain't no learners bike , yes she handles okay and you can punt around nice and easy all day , but when you do open that throttle , you may find yourself arriving at a tricky situation with more speed than anticipated , for this type of scenario you want to be packing plenty of smarts .
As the lads have advised , a good riders course will be of good value to most anyone , good luck and stay safe bro .
Yeah see that's the part I didnt know, that they want to stand up under braking because even though I've practised hard braking it's always been in a straight line and I assumed it would be the same in a turn only with a better chance of lock up so I was totally unprepared for it not wanting to lean. Those classes can't come soon enough
 

ROADTOAD1340

Registered
Yeah see that's the part I didnt know, that they want to stand up under braking because even though I've practised hard braking it's always been in a straight line and I assumed it would be the same in a turn only with a better chance of lock up so I was totally unprepared for it not wanting to lean. Those classes can't come soon enough
You're well on the way bro , you have the right attitude just as @Mr Brown has noted , so that is great .
:thumbsup:
 

fallenarch

THE SLOW RIDER
Registered
So first of all off-ramps are sirens luring in motorcyclists. So many bikers hit them hard and they are dangerous! You can't see very well, often time they have double and descending radius turns that can easily be over run by an unsuspecting rider. No matter how much experience you have, never play on on/off ramps.

As has been said, hitting the gas or brakes will stand any bike up. Braking while turning is called trail braking. This involves diving deeper into the turn than usual to adjust your speed with the brakes almost to the apex of the turn. Trail-braking however is not a great method for maximum braking, it is more for maintaining higher corner speed.

To apply maximum braking in a turn, I use the technique where you cut the turn into straight segments. As you are going from segment to segment keep the bike as straight up as you can and apply maximum brakes, let off the brakes, angle the bike to the next segment, then go back to maximum braking.

One of the greats of motorcycle training used to have a 100 points of traction system. This system says the tires have 100 points of traction. Braking uses a certain amount, turning more and acceleration more. Exceed 100 points and you fall. So if you need to stop quickly, you might want to use 90 points of traction stopping you only have 10 left to turn.

This situation is why you need to improve your brakes (as well as your skills). It is very hard to feel the point where maximum braking is reached on the stock braking system. Also, if your suspension is not setup correctly the front of the bike will dive so much it becomes unstable.

What you really did wrong here though is to get yourself into that situation at those speeds. You have to think and learn how to recognize a dangerous situation almost instinctively.
 

Tetsuo1000

Registered
I believe you can be a novice with any bike, even the hayabusa. As long as you don’t ride beyond your limitations. The good thing you did is being honest with yourself and us, that was scary! So glad you are ok. Now In all my profound wisdom I will tell you how you should have managed that corner. Don’t!
That is to say don’t take the off ramp.
At that “oh crap” point when you realized you were on top of you exit and know it is about to get dramatic, you get frantic.
Recognize that feeling for what it is, your beautiful brain recognizing your limitations, and just take the next exit.
Now go find a big empty parking lot and practice some corner braking.
And hug your mama. ‘Cause it’s Mother’s Day
 

Yellow09

Registered
To add to the chaos, the Busa is a very forgiving bike, it only goes as fast as a rider wants it to, it can putter around at low speeds and thrill at high speeds, the only control is your right wrist.

Just like anything, only go as far as your limitations will allow...if you were in a car and the same situation occurred, the outcome could have been much worse.

A motorcycle can gather speed at an incredible rate and can also shed speed the same way. In the conditions you describe, an experienced rider would have their hands full in executing that manoeuvre..

This being said, in most cases, an experienced rider wouldn't put themselves in that situation in the first place.
 




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