weird wont start problem

[AZIROC]

Road the bike a few days ago, started fine, all that good stuff. go to leave for work this morning, throw it in neutral, everything comes on as normal, pull in the clutch, start the bike.. and the starter just spins. ??? ok, turn it off and back on, try again. same thing. now here is also where its weird. i throw it into 1st, pull in the clutch, nothing. like if i wasnt even touching the clutch. ???

so what say you forum... im stumped. i threw it on a trickle charger while im at work, see if maybe it was just barely to low of volts.

 

[twotonevert]

You mean the starter is not engaging the engine to turn it over?

 

[AZIROC]

thats what im guessing. you hear something spinning really fast, sounds like the starter, but nothing is turning over. not even trying or even a metal on metal sound.

 

[AZIROC]

UPDATE:

somewhat.

Got home from work and got to check some things out. the fuses are all good. the starter fuse??? (located underneath the seat, left side) is good. when the bike is on and in neutral, the fuel pump primes and when u hit the starter button.. the starter spins. when you put it in gear and pull in the clutch, then hit the starter button, nothing happens. battery checked out fine as far as voltage. i was going to let this stew and see if anyone has any ideas before i pull the fairing off and check the starter/sprockets.

 

[card16969]

UPDATE:

somewhat.

Got home from work and got to check some things out. the fuses are all good. the starter fuse??? (located underneath the seat, left side) is good. when the bike is on and in neutral, the fuel pump primes and when u hit the starter button.. the starter spins. when you put it in gear and pull in the clutch, then hit the starter button, nothing happens. battery checked out fine as far as voltage. i was going to let this stew and see if anyone has any ideas before i pull the fairing off and check the starter/sprockets.

two things for you to do from a mechanics point of view... put the bike in gear and hold in the clutch roll it forward a few feet dump the clutch (do this with the ignition off) all your trying to do is move the starter to a different spot to see if its a flat spot. And if that doesnt work jump the bike and try to start it like your jump starting a car and make sure its out of gear, you may have good voltage but your amperage could be low enough that your not engaging your solenoid and pushing the starting post out to engage the gears. This is most likely the problem as its very common in cars and in bikes.

 

[AZIROC]

I will try that in the morning when i put the cover and such back on. I took it off now and everything looked mechanically fine... but i did find 2 things ive never seen before... and i hope the 1st isnt a bigger issue.

1st, when i took the cover off, the inside gears (up top) looks to be covered in a white froth/foam. idk if it was from the start spinning or what. The last time the bike ran was fri night. now when i think white foam/froth.. i automatically think head gasket. but i have been religious on oil changes and have never seen water/coolant in the oil before plus the bike has been running fine and i use it mostly now as a commuter vehicle since my work is 2.2 miles away. I checked the coolant level and its fine, and the reserve coolant is at the same lever as its been since the last time i checked it.. prob 6000 miles ago when i cleaned the whole engine.

2nd, the bearing that fits inside the starter gear thing was covered it what i can only described as a brown grease. im pretty mechanically inclined and i have no clue wtf it could have came from. again, because of the top thing, i think rust. but it didnt look like rust, and the shaft the bearing and start gear sit on was only slightly discolored but not chewed up or rusted itself. i threw the parts in some degreaser, took a brush to it and it call came of and the bearings spin good as new. ???

as far as the start clutch, it only spins one way, i try to spin it the other way and it locks up. and the shaft thats on the starter spins both ways...but im 99% sure it always does.

 

[AZIROC]

Put everything back on, fired up the bike and it runs. both in neutral and in gear. IDK what could have made the starter NOT move. that rust colored "grease" didnt inhibit the bearing from spinning...so yeah. idk. i soaked the parts in degreaser and cleaned them off with a rag. looked good as new. i may order a new shaft/bearing part just to make sure and maybe this weekend ill go on a decent ride and then change the oil and see if there is any water in there.

 

[blk02ws6]

could be start of the starter going bad.

if its the original starter i would lean towards that if there was no signs of extreme wear or damage to the gears.

 

[AZIROC]

Its not the original starter, its prob a good year old, maybe 2 by now. only thing/reason y i dont think its water in the oil is because ever since ive first noticed the white milky look, its been since my commute to work is 2.2 miles. the bike doesnt even get to its normal running temp before im there or back home. so i figure its just the short trip + not enough time to warm up + possible condensation inside the cover. (i have a clean clutch cover so thats how i know ive had the milky look). ill still prob take it for a good ride this weekend and change the oil and see if there is water in it.

side note though..... IF it was the engine about to go bad... anyone know any decent engine builders in AZ? i may bump it up to a 1390 or 1420.

 

[card16969]

i dont see it being your engine going bad in all honesty i think its your starter, was it an oem starter or just an aftermarket.... alot of the aftermarket use cheap grease inside of the starter to lubricte things and our motors run hot and that grease is known to seep out when it gets hot. in my opinion i would look into the starter further. On a side note my dad had the same issue on a harley that the gear got stuck engaged for a few mins and heated up and wham whitish foamy grease that looked like white lithium with a dirty tinge to it.

 

[AZIROC]

...and wham whitish foamy grease that looked like white lithium with a dirty tinge to it.

thats EXACTLY how it looked.

as far as the starter, it was prob aftermarket.. i got it new off of ebay. I ordered a new shaft/bearing just to replace this 1 just incase. $13 is worth not having a headache down the road. atleast a bigger one.