Turbo expert opinions needed!

[EthanB]

I currently have an 06 with a few mods but basically pretty stock. Looking to go down the turbo road, and pick up a second 'busa already tubo-ed. I think I have found one that will work for me but I want to ask the opinion of those out there who know a lot more than me about turbos (which would not be hard)

I want a streetable system, around 250 hp with room to grow if needed but one that is solid and reliable. Bike will be used mainly for those weekend 2-300 mile trips, some touring and once or twice a year down a track. I am currently looking at a bike with the following setup:

Gen 1 with Mc Express street setup with 16g Turbo, with upgraded wheel, it has a internal blow off valve, rising rate fuel pump and power commander. Bike is making 250 plus now with a 7lbs spring in the waste gate on pump gas, it has a air to air intercooler, and full pipe with HMF carbon can. The motor has a spacer to lower comp, H Beam Crower Rods, ARP Head studs and Orient Express Valve springs.

Also has a 4" stretch on the swing arm and lowered to keep that front end down.

This looks like a good set up to me, but I am a novice at the turbo thing so any opinions are very appreciated, especially from the gurus out there..

 

[POWERHOUSE]

I currently have an 06 with a few mods but basically pretty stock. Looking to go down the turbo road, and pick up a second 'busa already tubo-ed. I think I have found one that will work for me but I want to ask the opinion of those out there who know a lot more than me about turbos (which would not be hard)

I want a streetable system, around 250 hp with room to grow if needed but one that is solid and reliable. Bike will be used mainly for those weekend 2-300 mile trips, some touring and once or twice a year down a track. I am currently looking at a bike with the following setup:

Gen 1 with Mc Express street setup with 16g Turbo, with upgraded wheel, it has a internal blow off valve, rising rate fuel pump and power commander. Bike is making 250 plus now with a 7lbs spring in the waste gate on pump gas, it has a air to air intercooler, and full pipe with HMF carbon can. The motor has a spacer to lower comp, H Beam Crower Rods, ARP Head studs and Orient Express Valve springs.

Also has a 4" stretch on the swing arm and lowered to keep that front end down.

This looks like a good set up to me, but I am a novice at the turbo thing so any opinions are very appreciated, especially from the gurus out there..

What exactly is an internal blow off valve? And what exactly is a rising rate fuel pump? What I think you mean is an internal wastegate - and if it has an internal wastegate, there is no 7 pound "spring" in the gate - there is more likely either a 5 or 8 pound actuator that is bolted to the compressor side, with a long arm going over to the internal gate. And you have a fuel pump running into an FMU- a rising rate fuel regulator.

First off, a 16G Mitsubishi turbo is not really upgradeable - you can change the compressor wheel and housing to make it a 20G, or change out the entire turbo to a 20G shootout turbo. And you are limited by the internal wastegate, which can only be controlled through "bleeding" the signal hose.

As far as a Stage One turbo system is concerned, what you are looking at is not bad. But you do not really have "room to grow" with this kit. The air to air intercooler is nice, but will limit your ability to lower the front end. And Orient Express doesn't make valve springs - they take other people's products and put their label on them. What you are looking at is your basic Stage One turbo kit. If you buy it, leave it alone. Trying to upgrade it - although it can be done - will cost you money better spent on another type of kit, like an RCC Stage One with a Garrett turbo and an external wastegate and a Tial blow off valve. Or even better, an RCC Stage Two kit, which will take you over 400 rear wheel with a built motor.

 

[EthanB]

Thank you Frank.

OK, very poor choice of words on my side.. what I meant by 'upgrade' was actually 'turn up the boost and be able to make bigger numbers without having to replace the whole setup'.

Interesting about the actuator and clearly a lot more research needed on my side as the whole 7lb spring thing didnt seem odd to me.

Thanks again for your advice.

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Thank you Frank.

OK, very poor choice of words on my side.. what I meant by 'upgrade' was actually 'turn up the boost and be able to make bigger numbers without having to replace the whole setup'.

Interesting about the actuator and clearly a lot more research needed on my side as the whole 7lb spring thing didnt seem odd to me.

Thanks again for your advice.

You can increase your boost to 13-15 pounds safely on pump gas with the air to air intercooler. Because you have stock pistons with a spacer plate, I wouldn't recommend going much over 13 pounds, though. With that setup, however, at 13 pounds of boost you should see 300 rwhp. There are a few things to consider, however. First off, with an actuator, the only way you are going to increase boost is with a controlled "bleed" two stage boost controller. POWERHOUSE sells these, and we have used many of them on Hahn kits that are very similar to yours. Your first stage would be your 7 pounds, and the second stage would be 13, or whatever you want to run.

The problem you are going to run into is the stock injectors. Even with a rising rate regulator, the stock injectors are only good to around 275 rwhp. You will run out of injector at that point. Bigger injectors, like the MPS 65 pound kit, would be a good option, as would S2000s, or something similar. The other fueling issue will be the two levels of boost. How would you map this to insure that you are getting the proper fueling at both levels? Probably the easiest and least expensive way would be to add a Dynojet Hub with a GM map sensor. This will give you boost referencing, and the ability to build a fuel map that accomodates your low boost, high boost, and everything in between.

All in all, with a few well though out mods, this setup could be very nice and not only be able to be ridden daily, but go into the eights at the strip with a decent rider . . .

 

[EthanB]

Thanks again for you input, tht is exactly the type of info I was hoping for.

No doubt when the time comes for more hp I will be taking a trip up the coast and I am sure that there will be plenty more newbie questions from me before then!

 

[karnage]

Thats a bypass valve instead of a blow off valve.Basically redirects the air back into the intake.Not needed unless you use a MAF or VAM.Also a carbon can for exhaust??Most just do a short dump after the turbo.I think an internal wastegate is fine with a gillis valve, which I use on my turbo car for 25 psi boost.Internal wastegates arent needed unless you run some serious boost or HP really.Now that turbo is pretty limited though.Is that a T-3 or T-4 foot print??I wonder why they upgraded the rods and not the pistons while they were in there already.

 

[TurboTJ]

I don't know a lot about turbo bikes, but I have been playing with turbo cars ever since I got my license.

My Eagle Talon TSI AWD is running a Mitsubishi Evo III 16g ($490 new). That turbo is amazing!!! I have it dialed in at 30PSI making 400AWHP and 460AWTQ, but the turbo has very good characteristics at 14psi too! You really can't find a better turbo for so cheap!!! Unless you're running over 14psi, I would run one of the smaller 16g's.

As for boost control, I would stick with an internal waste gate - it's way simpler, and smaller. Though people do port their internal wastegate's, it's probably not necessary unless you're getting boost creep (I.e. boost climbs above preset level). On my talon, I run ~12psi with the electronic boost controller off (wastegate spring pressure), 20psi in setting A, and 30psi in setting B. This is with an AEM Truboost. That's the point of a boost controller, you can raise the boost without changing the wastegate spring!

On my turbo jeep wrangler, I've also used an electronic boost controller but in this case it was set to the same pressure as the wastegate. This meant, with the boost controller off, it would run 6psi, but the turbo would take a while to spool and give me much better fuel economy. With it turned on, the turbo would spool instantly to 6psi - great performance but bad fuel economy.

I would definitely buy an electronic boost controller regardless of what you get. You can control power output, traction, and fuel economy at the flip of a switch!

Good luck!!!

 

[EthanB]

Thats a bypass valve instead of a blow off valve.Basically redirects the air back into the intake.Not needed unless you use a MAF or VAM.Also a carbon can for exhaust??Most just do a short dump after the turbo.I think an internal wastegate is fine with a gillis valve, which I use on my turbo car for 25 psi boost.Internal wastegates arent needed unless you run some serious boost or HP really.Now that turbo is pretty limited though.Is that a T-3 or T-4 foot print??I wonder why they upgraded the rods and not the pistons while they were in there already.

The dumps definitely have a cool factor, but I personally like the stealth aspect of having the can on there. Don't know what the footprint is, but hardly going to affect whether I buy her.. Looks like I will own my first turbo bike in about 10 minutes.

 

[POWERHOUSE]

The dumps definitely have a cool factor, but I personally like the stealth aspect of having the can on there. Don't know what the footprint is, but hardly going to affect whether I buy her.. Looks like I will own my first turbo bike in about 10 minutes.

Nice!

 

[EthanB]

Well thats it done.

Proud owner of a Turbo bus, in red, which I am certain add a few extra ponies.

I am over seas at the moment so wont get to ride her until I am home next month, so will post full photos and first impressions report!

 

[BlueHaya]

congrats.....

 

[wahly68]

Looks Great!!

 

[smithabusa]

if its a mcxpress kit should have secondaries in the plenum with the silver box fuel controller or their newer one if its a more recent kit i would think. mcxpress kits are very nice, but definitely not huge hp ones, but will make 300 hp all day long and spool like no ones business.

 

[EthanB]

300 hp is more than enough for me.. for now!

Mrs B just called on skype having got back from her first ride on my non-turbo busa (she has a Nitrous V-Rod and a Ducati 696)

"****. Oh wow. my heart is beating so fast. **** I can hardly breathe. sorry, I cant stop swearing. Oh my God I love the 'busa. my whole body is trembling. phew. OK, I am going out for another ride. Can we put my V-Rod on Ebay?"

She didnt even take her helmet off to make the call.

 

[Craash]

Are all RCC Stage One Kits Garrett Snails?

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Are all RCC Stage One Kits Garrett Snails?

All current RCC turbo systems use Garrett turbos. Some, like the Stage One and Two use Garretts with custom housings. Some of the earlier Stage One and Twos had Precision center sections . . .

 

[mike04busa]

That is way too funny. My girl won't go near the busa. Good for her. Enjoy the new toy.

300 hp is more than enough for me.. for now!

Mrs B just called on skype having got back from her first ride on my non-turbo busa (she has a Nitrous V-Rod and a Ducati 696)

"****. Oh wow. my heart is beating so fast. **** I can hardly breathe. sorry, I cant stop swearing. Oh my God I love the 'busa. my whole body is trembling. phew. OK, I am going out for another ride. Can we put my V-Rod on Ebay?"

She didnt even take her helmet off to make the call.