Tire wear question;




mjn

Hillbilly Deluxe
Donating Member
Registered
Here is my conundrum;

I just got back from a 325 mile ride and noticed some strange (for me) tire wear.

I have gotten used to using up a set of street tires in less than 3K. At 13449 miles, I put on my sixth set of skins; Bridgestone BT016's. I chose these because I hoped to get at least 3K out of them without sacrificing grip.

The wear on the last 5 sets of tires (two sets of OE BT056's, two sets of PP's, and one set of Qualifiers) was pretty similar... the rears were toast, the fronts still had some left..not enough to justify another rear..but some skin left.

I am seeing completely different wear characteristics with the 16's; the fronts are going away first. The rear seems to be wearing about the same as any other tire...maybe even faster..but the front is going away fast!

I understand that these tires have two compounds on the front...the sides being softer.

**One other adjustment was made at the same time the tires were mounted; I didn't have the extra cash to really do the forks right...so I had 15mm of internal preload put in, and went to 10 wt fork oil. The bike seems to handle very well... a noticeable improvement from before.

The question; why am I toasting the sides of the fronts all of a sudden?

These tires have 1665 (non track) miles on them;

Front; Sides are 1/32nds to the wearbars. Center is 2/32nds away. (started with 3/32nds at both points)
tires0709001.jpg



On the rear, I've used 4 of 6/32nds in the center, and 3 of 5/32nds on the sides;
tires0709003.jpg


Is it just the tire? Did my suspension changes cause this? Any ideas??
 

TruWrecks

Banned
Do a few more highway miles and even it out. :poke:

Did you get 'J' spec 016's? I ran mine to almost 2500 miles and they still have plenty left on the front. Bike is in storage for now.
 

Mr Bogus

Trouble Makers Inc.
Donating Member
Registered
sure making some heat in them... how hard are you pushing them in the corners? looks like you are pretty heavy on the throttle from the orange peel...

From what I have been able to gather on tire wear issues, it also appears to have some rebound issues (cupped trailing edge and raised leading edge)

TufBusa just ran a set of 16's at the track and perhaps he has some input on yours.. but just looks like they have been hot and run hard to me...

look at the treads on this tire, all track time and hard on the throttle, I got most of the trailing/leading edge wear issues fixed by tuning suspension up (well I paid to get it done)

DSCN4101.jpg


long.jpg


shortg.jpg
 

Zewski

Registered
Blisters! Way too hot. That is the case of that kind of wear, I wouldn't reccommend being too hard on those, they will lose their edge!
 

mjn

Hillbilly Deluxe
Donating Member
Registered
The surface looks the same as any other tire I've gone thru...kinda like an orange peel. I just don't understand why I'm burnin thru the front so fast when it's been the opposite before..
 

Mr Bogus

Trouble Makers Inc.
Donating Member
Registered
The surface looks the same as any other tire I've gone thru...kinda like an orange peel. I just don't understand why I'm burnin thru the front so fast when it's been the opposite before..
your riding style may have become more aggressive... the wear looks pretty normal for a tire that has been "on track" so I would just venture you are pushing the bike harder.. (maybe not so good on the street) Might be time to evaluate how you are riding and back it down a notch.. this did not come from normal casual riding...

Certainly not blistered and I was able to arrest some front tire wear by going up on preload and putting a bit more aggressive profile on the rebound/damping..

Do not think I want to try and hang with you if you are doing this to your tires on daily street riding :laugh:
 

Tufbusa

Track Coach / TufPoodle Coach
Registered
Suspension - Suspension - Suspension!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tire problems are almost always due to suspension. Apparently your tires don't like your suspension set up? My 16's are wearing great. Wearing some rubber off but the tire looks great!

(Do not think I want to try and hang with you if you are doing this to your tires on daily street riding)

Mark has no problem properly spankin a busa! :bowdown:
 

mjn

Hillbilly Deluxe
Donating Member
Registered
Suspension - Suspension - Suspension!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tire problems are almost always due to suspension. Apparently your tires don't like your suspension set up? My 16's are wearing great. Wearing some rubber off but the tire looks great!

(Do not think I want to try and hang with you if you are doing this to your tires on daily street riding)

Mark has no problem properly spankin a busa! :bowdown:
What would it be in my set up that would contribute to this Steven??

Are you sayin I'm pushing it too hard for the street?:whistle:
I had a frikkin blast yesterday, but I never had any Oh-Shat moments.. I was honestly pretty dam relaxed... We did 52 and 53 yesterday, and I did 52 twice, (just had to). I feel like I'm carrying a bit more corner speed, and am working hard to ease the throttle back on at the apex, but I can't see where my style has changed enough to warrant the front tire going away at such a rapid rate.

I still have the front Qualifier in my shop... with 2300 miles including one trackday, it has more skin on the sides than this 16 with 1665 miles.

Maybe I need to go back to the Qualifiers?
 

raydog

Enjoying 1 road at a time
Donating Member
Registered
Both Tuf and Bogus know their stuff....the only thing I would add is, based on your comments you recently stiffened up your forks, that reality coupled with all else being the same (pressures, riding style, riding environment, ambient temperatures, etc.) would induce a wider wear pattern (wider than the pattern when totally vertical). I don't think you should freak out about "what happened before", just concentrate on dialing it all in with what you have right now for optimal performance. Like Bogus says, you clearly are an aggressive rider (I believe that's good) so finer adjustments are way more important for you! Also, when you have the $, higher performance front springs are much better than pre-loading OEM ones! Take care, Doyle

(ps I just read your last post...please don't think I'm trying to be a know it all...I can see you are a "top of the heap" rider so I don't want to come across as "this is what you need to do" crap. Just trying to throw my humble opinion in! Doyle)
 

mjn

Hillbilly Deluxe
Donating Member
Registered
(ps I just read your last post...please don't think I'm trying to be a know it all...I can see you are a "top of the heap" rider so I don't want to come across as "this is what you need to do" crap. Just trying to throw my humble opinion in! Doyle)
I ride with Tuf on a regular basis and have the highest regard for his inputs, it also sounds like Mr Bogus knows his stuff too.

I agree that correct springs would be a far better way to go.. I just didn't have the cabbage at the time..

As far as the "top of the heap" stuff... one day at the track and I realized just how slow I really am..:laugh: Tuf could run circles around me whenever he wanted to..

Oh... and your humble opinion is greatly appreciated.. you make good points with the suspension comments..
 

Tufbusa

Track Coach / TufPoodle Coach
Registered
Mark, that tire looks like it's doing what it's suppose to. You could be pushing the front causing it to wear faster than maybe your qualifier? I'd try dropping the tire pressure so the tire hooks up better. The wear pattern is nice and even meaning the suspension is most likely doing fine. I didn't romp my 16's as hard as you did on our ride. I spent more time at the back with Teresa and friends. I was running 34 psi both ends and it worked fine with no issues.

Your rear tire is apparently doing well. It has a larger contact patch so it may not be moving around like the front. I'd bet you are pushing the front just enough to cause ware and not enough to make you pucker? Just a hunch.

I ran 30 psi on the track and the tires were both showing side wear but it was nice and even just like yours. I really don't think your excessive ware on the sides is suspension related. I'd work with pressure! 35.5 is to much for hard cornering!

We all know the 16's are great tires so I'd be reluctant to change tires. I'd work with the bike and air pressure to make it ride well on these tires. Your front should not wear out prior to the rear if everything is set up properly unless you are pushing the front. Remember dude, you spend a LOT of time on the sides of the tire! :beerchug:
 

mjn

Hillbilly Deluxe
Donating Member
Registered
Mark, that tire looks like it's doing what it's suppose to. You could be pushing the front causing it to wear faster than maybe your qualifier? I'd try dropping the tire pressure so the tire hooks up better. The wear pattern is nice and even meaning the suspension is most likely doing fine. I didn't romp my 16's as hard as you did on our ride. I spent more time at the back with Teresa and friends. I was running 34 psi both ends and it worked fine with no issues.

Your rear tire is apparently doing well. It has a larger contact patch so it may not be moving around like the front. I'd bet you are pushing the front just enough to cause ware and not enough to make you pucker? Just a hunch.

I ran 30 psi on the track and the tires were both showing side wear but it was nice and even just like yours. I really don't think your excessive ware on the sides is suspension related. I'd work with pressure! 35.5 is to much for hard cornering!

We all know the 16's are great tires so I'd be reluctant to change tires. I'd work with the bike and air pressure to make it ride well on these tires. Your front should not wear out prior to the rear if everything is set up properly unless you are pushing the front. Remember dude, you spend a LOT of time on the sides of the tire! :beerchug:
But wouldn't lower pressure mean more heat? Doesn't more heat = more wear?? I know the Qualies worked great on the track at 31 lb's.. but there is no question I had a TON more heat in them at the track than I ever did on the street..the surface was bluish/purple the day after.. I've never seen my tires turn color after a street ride..
 

BA BUSA

MotoGP Wannabe
Donating Member
Registered
Lower air pressure will generate a bit more heat, but it allows the carcass to flex a bit more and give you a bigger footprint. It will spread out the load on the tire, give you a bigger contact patch...should not cause anymore wear than you are already experiencing.

The tire wear is 'even' there is no suspension problems going on...if you had 'cupping' or any sort of uneven wear on the tire, then I would suspect the suspension was not working correctly.
 



Latest Bikes

Forum statistics

Threads
172,731
Messages
3,089,481
Members
47,629
Latest member
Weston Goldberg
Top