Starting trouble Gen 2

virkdoc

Registered
Hi everyone,
Got ride for an early morning ride today and the bike wouldnt start, its a 2011 gen2.
When i turn the ignition on, the headlight came on. The display lit up orange but it was blank. The needles didnt do the swing and the fuel pump sound not coming. Its still cranking. Any ideas what to look for?
 
Any recent work done on the bike or anything else which comes to mind? Is the bike kept outdoors? Was the bike subjected to heavy rain recently? Does the display always light orange?

I would suspect poor connection to the gauge cluster, but not sure whether this could impact the fuel pump (I think it could). I would exclude the ECU because if the ECU thought there was a problem it wouldn't let the starter to crank and would throw a code (I assume you don't get FI light and the codes, or maybe the display is blank due to this problem), but connection to ECU could be poor (although unlikely).
 
Bike always parked outside under the porch ans covered with a bike cover. washed the bike last week. the cluster is orange colored but there is no display and the needles and fuel indicator and temp gauge are not working.
 
Battery cranking ok and lights coming on also.....surprising is that the odo display is not there. Even if the kill switch was not ok the odo would not be blank.
I ahve a power commader also...just checked that and there is no power in the PCV
 
With a multimeter, checking the voltage at the battery while you start the bike.
If under 12 volts the coils will not fire, thus a bad battery
 
I'd say never mind voltage. If the bike cranks, this means the battery is OK. The gauges should come up even if the battery is weak and doesn't have juice to turn the starter motor. The bike has been sitting outdoors for 3 years! Never mind that it is covered. Heat/cold/humidity gets in there anyway. If a connector was not sealed 100% at the factory, humidity will get in, and cold/heat/vibration cycles will cause connection to deteriorate.

Here is what I would do...

1. Take the seat off. Unplug the ECU, look carefully inside both connectors with a flashlight for any signs corrosion. If all is clean (very likely), plug it back in (oftentimes, simply disconnecting and plugging connector back in restores good connection). Try powering/starting the bike.

2. Remove the left fairing and the left upper piece to gain access to the connector for the gauge cluster. Do the same as in item 1.
 
ok solved the issue. accessed the fusebox and the fuse marked FUEL 10A was blown. Changed it out and everything back to normal. So it means if the fuel pump fuse blows it blanks out the display also. New thing learnt!
Thanks everyone
 
Great news! Like you said, learn something new every day - and we all learn along the way. I thought about the fuse after posting, and wanted to suggest that, but you beat me to it. Good job!

Now, here is the thing. Fuses don't just blow for no good reason. There must've been a short somewhere, or the fuel pump draws a lot more current than it's supposed to (unlikely). You still gotta trace the wiring from the fuse to the fuel pump, and figure out what's going on. Pinched wire, exposed wire - anything along these lines. Any chance you have some aftermarket stuff on your bike powered through the fuel fuse? Have you done any work on your bike after your last ride, but before you encountered this problem? You are lucky this didn't happen while you were riding. And there is a good chance this may happen again unless you find and fix the source of the short which blew the fuse in the first place.
 
Agree ^^^

However there are cases where a weak fuse just blows.
So after looking for bare or broken wires etc. If nothing is found - Just keep an eye on it.
IF it blows again then you definitely have a problem. Hopefully you won't have any more problems.

To the OP Where do you live?
A dry or wet climate can make a difference.
 
The design can't provision a fuse for every bit of electrical item, so engineers group electrical subsystems per fuse in a reasonable way. In your case, such grouping makes sense - if the fuel pump is not operational, then there is no point to light up the gauge cluster. The opposite also makes sense - if the gauge cluster is out, there is no point to power the fuel pump.

On the other hand, it would be silly to let's say put either the gauge cluster or the fuel pump on the same fuse as let's say your tail light because you may have your tail light fuse burned but still be able to ride.

Considering your climate, and assuming you don't find any kinked/exposed/shorted wires, I would suspect humidity getting into connectors. Even more reason to open up all connectors on your bike, inspect, clean with contact cleaner, let dry, stuff with dielectric grease, and close them up for good - to never have a poor electrical contact or a short again.
 
ok here we go the damn fuse blew again...checked all the fuel pump wiring for any kinks etc could find none, my friend also tested the current draw from the fuel pump, it was showing 7amperes. can anyone confirm if thats ok?
The only thing added recently was a new horn...but the horn is not thru the fuel pump fuse.
Any help urgent pleaseeee, we are going for a long ride tomorrow
 
7 amps sounds excessive to me. Here is why... when your bike runs, the voltage is around 14V, so the pump draws 7 amp x 14 V = 98 Watt - tha's a lot for a fuel pump. The same fuse handles the gauges and maybe something else, so it's feasible to guess that other stuff take another 1.5-2 Amps - which brings the total current on that fuse to 8.5-9.0 Amps! Now, it's not surprising that the fuse blew.

A fuse designation is usually noticeably higher than the normal current, so for 10 Amp fuse, there is an expectation that normal current is probably no more than 5-6 Amps. Can you measure a fuel pump current on someone else's bike, or find out what it should be from other sources? If our suspicions are correct, then it's the fuel pump motor.

Lift the tank, start the bike, and let it idle. Keep touching the fuel pump, and see if it gets excessively warm/hot. A big percentage of that excessive wattage has to translate into heat, and if this is the case, then there is even more reason to blame the fuel pump. Could be that fuel pump motor winding got partially shorted somewhere. Who knows? While you are at it, carefully touch other electrical components, and feel if anything is excessively warm/hot. This might give you a clue.

If it turns out to be the fuel pump, but it performs seemingly normally, and you don't have any fuel related issues like when you get close to red line (you actually have to test this - accelerate up to 80 mph in 1st gear and ride like this for at least 10 sec before slowing down), and you really have to/want to go on that trip and are willing to take a chance, then I would simply replace the 10 Amp fuse with 15 Amp fuse TEMPORARILY, and postpone further investigation until you come back. However, by doing so you run the risk of the fuel pump failure in the middle of your trip.
 
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