Idle, slipping and knocking

[kwaaiesaki]

Hello my busa family I ’m back at it again and I am getting sick of this s***. A while back i finally found an expert in Hayabusas and i am more than glad i have found Him. I’ve put around €1500,- in the bike. What he found not only made me cry but some of you guys too. So a couple of months ago i went to Him and he took a jack and lifted my bike. The first thing he found was the Headset bearing was shot. So he upgraded it. Then he pulled parts of to check and inspect. The bike has run 30.000 km or 18640 Miles or so. The original spark plugs From 2007 came out. The knocking I heard is normal according to the store I got the bike from. Because a Hayabusa has a clearance between every gear so it won’t break or something. The expert told me that when he diagnosed it it sounded like the clutch basket which has more play than he is used so maybe it is that. So the shop i got the bike from told me they had done everything every service and so on. Eventually we found out they didn’t. He changed the spark plugs, oil, oil filter, air filter(was hairy as hell), brake pads where shot, braking fluid, coolant, upgraded temp switch, tps reset, chassis bolts(could turn btw), set valves, throttle bodies sync, pair valve removed, upgraded lights, suspension set and checking the choke cable. Hé did more but i can’t recall it so quickly. I have made an appointment to set the ecu for max power and tune it for my new exhaust system. I bought the bike with the system but wanted it standard. With the normal exhaust no one hears me so i put these on without db killers. Since then the bike runned smooth. No worries. Now after 4 days i am losing power, the idle suddenly Goes from 1350 to 2000 and back like a maniac and when I want to go and put it in first it is like I am having a slipping clutch. I gave it some more gas and released the clutch but it went slower than a Daihatsu cuore running on 2 cillinders. This Saturday I am going back to the expert because he thinks the tps could be shot too. The reason I am posting this is because I want to get some advice. Am I doing something wrong or is there something wrong and I mean terribly wrong with my bike? This is my second bike and i am getting the same feeling about this one as with my first bike. That had a shot head gasket and was declared totaled because of it. Every signal this bike currently gives is the same my old bike gave. Overheated once, sudden slipping, loss of power and more.

when I release the clutch a little the idle goes back to 1350 and sometimes when I am driving and I give it gas it suddenly feels like it’s got immense power out of nowhere.

I have put a video under. The first couple of seconds you can hear the knock. At the traffic lights it got so bad and heavy I felt it in my wrists.

If you need/want more videos I can always make them.

 

[Hayabusa Wannabe]

It seems like something changed from when you got it back until now. Just a thought: Are the battery cables still tight? Can you put a DC voltmeter on the battery, while off, then while idling, and revved up?

Did the tech see anything in the oil he changed (coolant, etc.)? (Sorry I cannot comment on the knock.)

 

[kwaaiesaki]

It seems like something changed from when you got it back until now. Just a thought: Are the battery cables still tight? Can you put a DC voltmeter on the battery, while off, then while idling, and revved up?

Did the tech see anything in the oil he changed (coolant, etc.)? (Sorry I cannot comment on the knock.)

unfortunately i don’t have any equipment like that so that‘s a good tip for the mechanic. And for the flushing nothing came out with the oil. No metal or chips. the only thing was the coolant was never refreshed. So with the coolant came white chalk if I am saying it right. When I bought the bike it stood still for around 7 months. And it had the knocking and rattles. The rattles are gone but the knocking remains. Even after everything the mechanic did. And The only change I made after everything was done, was the exhaust system.

 

[Kiwi Rider]

Turn the idle down to 1100 rpm.
Is that knocking still present as you bring the revs up higher, or only at idle speed?
It may be just backlash in the clutch and perfectly normal, they all have a little backlash at idle.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

Turn the idle down to 1100 rpm.
Is that knocking still present as you bring the revs up higher, or only at idle speed?
It may be just backlash in the clutch and perfectly normal, they all have a little backlash at idle.

it is present at low to about 2500/3000 rpm. After that you can’t hear it anymore. Lower than 1000 is something I’ve never tried. But under 1150 it will not run smooth. The previous owner put handle bar raisers on it but never changed the cables. So when I steer to the left while on idle the choke goes back. But to the right it remains on it place. The idle is jumpy and it has never been running as smooth as my Kawasaki Zx9r.

 

[Kiwi Rider]

it is present at low to about 2500/3000 rpm. After that you can’t hear it anymore. Lower than 1000 is something I’ve never tried. But under 1150 it will not run smooth. The previous owner put handle bar raisers on it but never changed the cables. So when I steer to the left while on idle the choke goes back. But to the right it remains on it place. The idle is jumpy and it has never been running as smooth as my Kawasaki Zx9r.

You can correct that idle problem when turning the bars with the revs increasing, adjustment on the throttle and choke cable is needed, the ‘choke’ cable is actually only there to raise the idle speed when motor is cold, nothing to do with mixture enrichment.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

You can correct that idle problem when turning the bars with the revs increasing, adjustment on the throttle and choke cable is needed, the ‘choke’ cable is actually only there to raise the idle speed when motor is cold, nothing to do with mixture enrichment.

That’s something I can put on the to do list. I only use choke for a little to start when the engine is cold. But it was something I noticed a couple of months ago.

 

[Berlin Germany]

(..) So when I steer to the left while on idle the choke goes back. But to the right it remains on it place. (...)

sounds for me as if the throttle cable is a little too tight - acc. to manual you HAVE to have a "gap" of 3-5 mm in the throttle (at the bar).
___________________

for second opinion test this board : Falkenhorst - Hayabusaclub Germany e.V. Forum (at its "NL" - section)
could be helpful.
_______________________

and dear - you have no "choke" at ignitions like at busas.
the haya only increases the iddle from ~1100 to around 1500 (and more)
the pin (at the bar / left switch) only opens the throttle valves a very little bit
the TPS send this signal to ecu and by this a bit more gas is given .

 

[rubbersidedown]

Knocking noise...loose nut on the clutch basket?
Rubb.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

Video cold start

Video after riding

now you don’t hear the knocking because the bike was cold at the beginning. After it is warmed up it knocks and bangs. The second video is too short for that sound. Could this be a faulty tps?

 

[kwaaiesaki]

Knocking noise...loose nut on the clutch basket?
Rubb.

They are tight with loctite

 

[kwaaiesaki]

sounds for me as if the throttle cable is a little too tight - acc. to manual you HAVE to have a "gap" of 3-5 mm in the throttle (at the bar).
___________________

for second opinion test this board : Falkenhorst - Hayabusaclub Germany e.V. Forum (at its "NL" - section)
could be helpful.
_______________________

and dear - you have no "choke" at ignitions like at busas.
the haya only increases the iddle from ~1100 to around 1500 (and more)
the pin (at the bar / left switch) only opens the throttle valves a very little bit
the TPS send this signal to ecu and by this a bit more gas is given .

Thanks for clearing that up. First thing tomorrow is checking the tightness of the cable and see how it runs after

 

[Kiwi Rider]

Video cold start

Video after riding

now you don’t hear the knocking because the bike was cold at the beginning. After it is warmed up it knocks and bangs. The second video is too short for that sound. Could this be a faulty tps?

If that was my bike doing what your's is doing, I would be removing the throttle bodies and cleaning all the carbon off the throttle plates, ultrasonic cleaning would be good, and then synchrise the throttle bodies using a vacuum synch guage set, then set the idle speed when warm to 1100rpm.
This may very well sort the problem out.
If it's still making the 'knocks and bangs' after the synch and clean of the throttle bodies, then it would be time to ascertain EXACTLY where this noise is originating from.
I use a mechanic's stethoscope to do this.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

If that was my bike doing what your's is doing, I would be removing the throttle bodies and cleaning all the carbon off the throttle plates, ultrasonic cleaning would be good, and then synchrise the throttle bodies using a vacuum synch guage set, then set the idle speed when warm to 1100rpm.
This may very well sort the problem out.
If it's still making the 'knocks and bangs' after the synch and clean of the throttle bodies, then it would be time to ascertain EXACTLY where this noise is originating from.
I use a mechanic's stethoscope to do this.
View attachment 1620160

I think I need to go deeper. Because all of the above except for the ultrasonic cleaning has been done.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

A little update. I went to the garage and the mechanic checked my bike. On the way to him my bike would stutter and rode very hesitating. When I arrived it ran smooth again. I sh#t you not. This bike has its own will. I think it is playing with me. The mechanic laughed and said would you look at that. Runs all smooth. He checked everything for leaks but everything was fine. No vacuum leaks or anything. The tps was good and the voltage also. On the way back home the first traffic light the rpms went up for a second and then everything was normal again. I rode for an hour back home and no funny business on the way back. This Tuesday the bike will be on a dyno for fine tuning. I will keep you guys updated.

 

[Hayabusa Wannabe]

Has a fuel maintenance been performed? There could be crud moving around on the intake side of the fuel filter, the injectors, etc.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

Has a fuel maintenance been performed? There could be crud moving around on the intake side of the fuel filter, the injectors, etc.

The injectors where clean and the company I got it from told me they replaced the fuelpump. But that hasn’t been changed because the marks on the bolts from the factory are still present. And the original spark plugs from 2007 came out while the mechanic was maintaining the bike, so if this Tuesday maybe we can check it before the dyno. Thanks for the tip.

 

[kwaaiesaki]

So the bike went to the fine tuner last week and has a very nice curve. The first Thing they noticed was the clunk but named parts that aren’t in a Hayabusa to check. So the bike is running fine and smooth and stays between 1150-1200 rpm now. The clunk remains but has been gone for a couple of days and got back. It can’t be the clutch because it won’t go away when you pull it in. The sound comes after its warmed up. So there are a couple of things left to check. Pistons, valves/retainers, crankshaft and camshaft. Those are the only parts what are turning and moving when it’s on and stationairy I think. I’m gonna go to the shop tomorrow and ask what can be checked without messing too much with the bike.