How to install lowering links?

rubbersidedown

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and if one likes the look of peter fonda´s bike in "easy rider" then get another frame and put in there the busa´s engine.
riding gif.gif
:laugh:
avoid , like devil the holy water , the cheap crap from the houseware store around the corner.
otherwise you will definitely fail massively at some point!

will wreck/round the bolts / nuts at some point and will you get pi$$ed.
"like the devil the holy water"
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uuuuuuuuuuuh what i forgot

when ever one is "fumbling" around that area
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and yes again - havin´ a bike means a life long lasting repeated maintenance.
I love reading reading your stuff Frank. Always entertaining and informative.
Rubb,
 

Mythos

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No worries. How is the rear end "up in the air?" If the tire is off the ground via a rear race stand,then the suspension is still "loaded." Even if the rear of the bike is hanging from something say the ceiling,via the sub-frame the suspension is still loaded.Its being pulled apart instead of pushed together.
This is kind of important: The weight of the bike is on those dog bones.You have to have the weight of the rear end supported while removing the links PLUS the bike itself needs secondary support. The weight of all your bike is all on those bolts you are removing.You need to support the bike by the frame.If I am not making perfect sense to you,read the manual. I'm sure there will be room for a box end once you have loosened the attachment points you mentioned.
Rubb.
Hey there, rubb! I have the bike on a swingarm pivot stand so the bike is supported on the swingarm pivot and the front tire. The only weight on the rear suspension is the swingarm. I even put jack stands in to hold half the swingarm weight off the rear suspension.
swingarm.pivot.stand.wheel.off.busa.jpg


Yes I know the bike is vulnerable to tipping backward without the rear wheel on but I already had it off and I am wrenching forward. With this much force, it's actually a concern that the bike could roll forward when I wrench but I would see it lift off the ground before the stand tilted forward. I will be putting the rear wheel back on and placing those phone books under the the tire since it appears I will be now wrenching from the RH side. That way, the bike can't roll backward.

I got my 14's rear suspension apart using this method. The tie rod nuts were very tight on that as well.
@fallenarch said his busa fell in his lap while he was taking these bolts out. :eek: He couldn't reach his phone so he had to benchpress his busa! Oh yes----I am EVER so careful wrenching on a stand. How is the bike supported, how will it roll which way will it tip, what angle am I wrenching, forward or back.... I haven't lost one yet. I have lifted the bike and inch or so and that's when I learned to be extremely cautious in these situations.

@rubbersidedown
and
@Mythos

to change the rods (generally) the best way to get space for the tools (and the torque at the end - the nuts/bolts need 95 Nm!)
is to dismantle both mufflers incl. their two pipes.

i did this job, i guess, 2 dozen times now when two end pipes were installed at both gen1 and gen2 - both are "equal".

at a 4in1 exhaust it can! be done without taking the entire exhaust off but
you have to put out the one muffler bolt
and you then need to impact a lots of power to bend the ex-pipe down a bit to wrench the bolt / nut.

and YES @ rubb - if never done before / no experiences with that job - see, read and follow the damn manual line by line !
__________________________________________
OK, Frank, we will try taking out just the muffler hanger bolt but I think the exhaust hanger under the engine will also need to be removed. My pipe is pretty fat (:laugh:). The next size smaller box end was thin enough to fit between the pipe and the nut but of course, it would not fit on the nut. Whatever the case may be, a six point wrench is needed for this and I will need to buy one. Maybe I'll just grind it down so it will fit between the exhaust and the nut. It can't be more than a milimeter.

"my opinion / mind apart from all kinds of tastes

who the heck makes a bike lower in the rear (and then alone this)?

yes the fairing is scratching the ground very soon and the loss of agility is horrible.

and if one likes the look of peter fonda´s bike in "easy rider" then get another frame and put in there the busa´s engine.

only for quarter mile races or so a rear lowering can make sence, but a front lowering, at same time, so much more
so why the heck are those kind of racers usually strapping down the front to block the fork???

dears - seriously - lowering the rear (and front) is in my engineers view technically a total nonsense for any use at all other roads then 1/8, 1/4, 1/2 or 1 mile tracks."


Yes I agree, Frank. Some people like the look of a lowered bike, many lower for racing. In my case, I am installing raising links that will lift the tail 1 inch. This also looks cool IMO and should make a huge change in handling. With the swingarm open another inch, it will also allow me to remain with stock chain length and 18/47 gearing...and also have the bike at minimum wheelbase. I'm going for a canyon carver setup that can easily be converted to LSR with tie rod change and gearing change.


the bolt´s head at the swing arm links, i guess, is 14 and the nut´s size is 17 mm (millimeters!!!!!)
inch sized tools can/will wreck/round the bolts / nuts at some point and will you get pi$$ed.
You have the nut and bolt head sizes correct, Frank. There are a couple standard sized sockets that will fit metric. I don't even know if the manufacturers bother to use two separate molds to cast these sizes but why take a chance? I did test fit a small metric against a similar sized standard some time ago and the standard had a more slop in it. Just use a metric for metric and standard for standard.

the nuts at the links have two self securing metal halved rings inside - no! thread lock (loctite or so) is needed (same kind of self securing nuts you can find elsewhere at the bike also)
these nuts are reusable hundreds times without losing their function.
Yeah, these nuts have the two little blades at the top of the threads. They self lock onto the threads of the bolt. The engine sprocket nut (and rear sprocket nuts too I believe) have this. The rear axle nut does too if I'm not mistaken. It adds a few ft lbs to the torque required to move them. Probably 30 or 40 extra ft lb on the great big engine sprocket nut. fallenarch said his cushion rod nuts also had white thread lock agent on them and I believe at least one person who posted on this thread previously made the same observation.

sometimes the threads are rusted together - then anti rust spray plus some heat (1200°C hot air dryer) and lots of patience CAN! help - in the very end no other way was to cut, how ever, the nut off, buy a new bolt´n nut-pair at suzuki and end the job that way.
I have a can of Deep Creep here. It's an excellent product to loosen up bolts. It works best after heating the bolt. It will not evaporate or burn like most penetrating oils. The only reason I don't like to use it is because although they have grease and dirt in the hard to reach areas, the bikes have never seen salt and they have no major corrosion. I don't like to put something on them that eats corrosion. The chemical reaction might continue a while after whatever small amount of corrosion is dissolved. I am almost at the point where a soaking with a Deep Creep soaked rag is in order though. If the nut is going to round off, it's better to try more extreme measures.

PLEASE pull ALL bolts every 4-5 years to clean deep and re-grease ALL the roller bearings
those in the swing arm too ;)
:rolleyes: I would like to....I would never ride the bike if I was that thorough with the maintenance. Maybe it's time for a new bike so I can just wrench on the other two...:D



Thank you for all the ideas Frank and rubb. Keep an eye out for this thread. I will probably need to order some tools before I can resume.
 

Mythos

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IDK rubb. i will be pulling toward the back if I go for the nuts on the RH side. I was looking at it today. I think I will get a Pit Bull rear handle stand so it can't tip backward. I need to have the rear wheel off for the wrench handle to stick out unless I take off the exhaust there on the RH side. As for pulling the bolts, I guess I'd switch back to the swingarm pivot stand so all weight is off the rear suspensin. One thing I know is I don't want that bike tipping backward while i wrench downward. I could put the back wheel on but then there would be no room for the wrench.

I bough t a new 14mm socket today. I got a set of six point 10-19mm impact sockets too. I need a set of 6 point box ends now. You have to order those online. Nobody carries those. This is not a cheap hobby. Oh well, it's been years since I spent much money on bikes.
 

rubbersidedown

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IDK rubb. i will be pulling toward the back if I go for the nuts on the RH side. I was looking at it today.
Just put the wrench on an' angle that will allow you to put most of the force on a downward angle/motion. Couple of wrenches or long pipe. Just get it cracked loose,then you can put the wrench on any angle you like. The set-up you have going will not allow the bike to tip over backward. Those jack-stands under the swingarm are plenty good enough. If you get a long enough wrench/pipe combo you'll be surprised at how little you have to push down. GTG...:thumbsup:
Rubb.
 

Berlin Germany

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(...) This is not a cheap hobby. Oh well, it's been years since I spent much money on bikes.

jepp - look what tools i own her at my page. ;)

and for the safest stand ever, i suppose, look at my self-made mid-jack

and here a pic into my workshop with my "tool" near under the ceiling to lift an entire bike
or only the engine out of it and so on.
(the 140mm high & ~20 feet long steel I-beam is turnable at its other end - it can thus be swiveled over the entire width of the room)

2020-03-24 Werkstatt_a.jpg
 

Mythos

Registered
Just put the wrench on an' angle that will allow you to put most of the force on a downward angle/motion. Couple of wrenches or long pipe. Just get it cracked loose,then you can put the wrench on any angle you like. The set-up you have going will not allow the bike to tip over backward. Those jack-stands under the swingarm are plenty good enough. If you get a long enough wrench/pipe combo you'll be surprised at how little you have to push down. GTG...:thumbsup:
Rubb.
It just so happens that both nuts are situated so that I can put my wrench on them with the wrench handle almost parallel to the ground. That was using the open end of my wrenches. An open end is not going to be adequate for the amount of torque that will be necessary to break these nuts loose. I will need to use a 6 point box end wrench.

Assuming a 6 point will fit so the handle is sticking out under the swingarm, it will take a lot of force to break them loose. It will not be totally downward force but a bit pulling toward the back. I think it would be ok but I have levered this stand up to vertical by wrenching backward once in the past. I could stand to the left of the bike and hold the stand's handle forward while pressing the wrench down. There is some risk of rolling the bike forward over the stand too though. The nut suddenly lets go and I'm pressing a couple hundred ft lbs forward on the handle of the stand....hope I have mighty fast reflexes. Nope, that's too iffy. If I could have the wheel on so books could be placed under it to prevent it from rolling back, I'd try it. For that, I'd need to remove the exhaust and use a socket rather than a box end.

The jack stands look more secure in the picture than they do in real life. They are almost at max height and they are not very broad at the bottom. They could tip like a bumper jack if a reasonable side load is applied.

and for the safest stand ever, i suppose, look at my self-made mid-jack
Very safe for lifting, much safer for resisting a sideways tip over, still risky for tilting back down accidentally. A hundred or so foot pounds of levering the handle up off the ground, it takes a lot less to pull it back down. A rear spool stand tilts backward so there is a lot less risk of pulling it over backward although with enough force at the proper angle, even that is possible.

lifted.w.heindl.jpg
 

Mythos

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I wonder if it would be possible to put the stand on with the handle on the RH side so the feet are pointing to the back when the bike is lifted?
 

rubbersidedown

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@Mythos ,Just make yer stand bullet proof.Tie down or similar to the front,or roll up on a piece of plywood and screw it down with some of that strapping with the holes in it...you paranoid bastid. With all this time typing,I could have flown down there and did this job myself...
rofl.gif

Rubb.
fs.jpg
 

Berlin Germany

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grin

i think next days / weeks i have to make a short video by my cell phone
how easy i can use my mid stand and how high it rises the rear
and what little issue i allways have with the original gen2 mufflers ;)

okay okay :) - one needs some practice of two or 3 liftings (as like as with every tool) but at the end it is so damn easy,
that i usually use my lift every time a busa comes to my workshop.

you all disbelievers - lool - will see . ;)

and at @Mythos
that hight of the rear wheel is at its end too much and never necessary e.g. to pull the wheel - i would say - ;)
 

rubbersidedown

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I wonder if it would be possible to put the stand on with the handle on the RH side so the feet are pointing to the back when the bike is lifted?
Those stands are designed to have the weight of the motor over the horizontal "feet" of the stand. Using it backwards defeats its design.
The front end,front wheel,frame,motor and tank weigh more than the rear end. As I mentioned before,strap the handle to the front wheel so the handle cant tip backwards. Or place the bike on a sheet of plywood with hold down points. It will be safe as if in a mother's arms. Or in this case a Mutha F...er's arms...
nevermind. :poke::laugh:
Rubb.
 

Mythos

Registered
@rubbersidedown I have levered a bike's sidestand an inch off the floor and I've levered a bike up onto one spool using my forward handle rear stand. I've tipped the swingarm stand we are looking at straight up and down wrenching, and that's just before it falls over on its own. I do my best to learn from close calls. Nope, I wouldn't let anyone else perform this operation if I'm having trepidation myself. When the bike's on a stand, I have every opportunity to make sure it doesn't drop so I take it.

I like your idea of strapping the stand forward. I could just strap the front wheel to the wood platform it's sitting on instead. I've thought about using some kind of hinge to hold the toes down in the past. I normally just put a couple phone books under the rear tire but in this case, there is no rear tire to rely on. I've always wanted a rear handle Pit Bull stand. Even though they're the not safest for lifting and lowering, they can't tip over backward if that's the way you're wrenching.

and at @Mythos
that hight of the rear wheel is at its end too much and never necessary e.g. to pull the wheel - i would say - ;)
The photo is deceptive. This stand lifts the rear wheel less than my Pit Bull forward handle stand. When I use my Pit Bull front stand with this one, the front is elevated a little higher than the rear. The rear is only about 4 inches off the ground.

Those stands are designed to have the weight of the motor over the horizontal "feet" of the stand. Using it backwards defeats its design.
I believe you're right although I could lift the front with my hands after the bike's lifted on the swingarm stand. It would be about 200 lbs of weight and it doesn't even feel like that much. There's a lot less leverage and weight holding it down as there is with a spool stand.

With all this time typing,I could have flown down there and did this job myself...
rofl-gif.gif


If you bring your 6 point box end wrenches I will borrow the 17 mm and have a go at it myself. You stand on the feet of my swingarm pivot stand and hold the lever. Problem solved.
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Mythos

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Finally gittin er done. My Pit Bull rear handle stand and 6 point box end wrenches took a whil to come in and I just don't move very fast out in the cold.

The setup:
1. Swing arm pivot stand removes all weight from the rear suspension.
2. Pit Bull adjustable height stand fits right under the spools, prevents a backward roll off the swing arm stand ad also supports the rear shock from being pulled down on while it's already at full extension.
3. Exhaust mounting bolt removed from under engine, exhaust supported by small toolbox, muffler hanger bolt loosened. Wrench fits between exhaust and lower cushion rod nut.
4. Rear wheel and belly pan removed. Rectifier/belly pan bracket removed and cleared to the RH side and hung on foot peg.

setup.tie.rod.removal.busa.jpeg


Six point wrenches positioned, 17 mm on nut, 14 mm on bolt LH side. 14 mm supported with jack stand.
12" x 1.5" id steel pipe over 17 mm. Took about 70 ~ 80 lbs of downforce and when it broke loose the pipe went flying.
pipe.on.wrench.tie.rods.busa.jpg


Same routine with the top bolt and nut tomorrow. Then we try these Schnitz raising links. I have a detailed tutorial in the works.
 

Mythos

Registered
Got er done. Now I got a question. Something unexpected happened right at the end of the cushion rod removal. I had to remove the LH cushion rod and the top bolt as one piece. The top bolt was stuck in the hole of the cushion rod as though the two parts had been fit with a press before they were installed at the factory. The shank of the bolts do not slide right through the holes in the LH cushion rod like you might expect. Is it normal that the bolt shanks fit this tight in the LH cushion rod holes?
cushion.rod.bolts.press.fit.busa.jpg


Yeah, it will turn without undue force and I have succeeded in working it through the hole a short distance by pressing the tip against a piece of wood while I turn with a ratchet at the same time. You can see the oil smears on the shank of the upper cushion rod bolt where I have worked it through the cushion rod hole. Also note the lower cushion rod bolt does not slide smoothly all the way through the lower end of the cushion rod. It will go through up to the last 4 millimeters and then it stops in the hole.

Normal or NOT normal? Should I continue to work the upper bolt out of the cushion rod hole pressing the tip on a piece of wood and twisting with a wrench?
 

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