How do you reason with someone...

[Twobrothersbusa]

I was trolling around the internet tonight and found a Facebook page called "Don't Forget How America Got Screwed Up". Knowing what this page was about was quick as all I had to do was read a few posts. I came across one that I truly can't even begin to understand. To me discussing anything with the person would be a loosing battle.

How do you reason with someone that thinks like this?

The discussion was about universal health care and obviously everyone should have it in her opinion. I'll never understand how you are born into the world and even if you contribute nothing...are OWED health care.

Quote:
"

What's wrong with that? Everyone SHOULD have health care. It's a human right, not a luxury. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. If you don't have health care, you will eventually die. You are not free if you aren't healthy. And you da## sure can't pursue happiness if you aren't healthy."


​

 

[O Holy P]

LOL, you don't...those are the kinds of people to ignore and hope to never have to sit next to on a plane. Never argue with an idiot, they'll just bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Greatest nation on earth should be able to provide free health care to all.

 

[m_ridgeway]

anyone thats had healthcare through the gov, would realise its an impossibility. you'll punish those that have good healthcare now and all the ones that never had it before will bog the system down with all their nonsense. there are very few people that dont have healthcare that deserve it. the gov cannot provide healthcare to vets or elderly efficiently, so what do we do? allow them to run everyones health care? that makes sense

 

[captain]

Greatest nation on earth should be able to provide free health care to all.

That's with a big assumption that people would do the right thing... They won't. Even with people that have health care they don't take care of themselves... We can't afford to offer health care to everyone for free...

 

[BusaBret]

Just ask our neighbors to the north how they like their government run health care.

 

[Twobrothersbusa]

That's the thing...it is not free. It is paid for by the people. How is it your responsibility to pay for your neighbors health care?

Greatest nation on earth should be able to provide free health care to all.

 

[O Holy P]

Greatest nation on earth should be able to provide free health care to all.

Didn't expect to see this from you. I think that is asinine. The best thing to do, IMO, is to create competition to keep it reasonable & affordable. The world will never be perfect and to think everyone should receive health care free of charge is idiotic. People need to take care of themselves, not expect it from their neighbor or the government.

 

[RYC1966]

Health care is not a right...you may have insurance and not even get what you pay for due to lag time and plan restrictions...but don't think for a second that there is not preminium care and service within the US borders...I am near CLE and the area is a hot spot for assisted living and cardio among other off shoots...I switched to the healthcare mba and the more I was exposed to it the less I desired to manage a facility under their terms.

The short problem is there is a large portion of the population that is ok...some get old and pass on...as is life...and advance in med care prolong life...so other issues become a norm. The bottle neck is that when med service is available to all...the ER's get an influx from people that have not been to a doc or a dentist in 10 -15 years which = money and time to handle them...it is simply to much to handle. There would be a three year lag time to address new patients...just to catch up with the existing citizens / people paying into taxes...not to mention those that work public assistance. Healthcare should be availble to those that need it...anytime / all the time

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

I rather pay for some undeserving persons healthcare than drop bombs on people who dont deserve it.

Imagine the amount of money we spent in Iraq. That itself would have paid for it.

Mother in law just paid over 700 for dental work. My father in law flew to Cuba and had it done for free.
She has problems with hers he doesn't. Exact same thing done to both.


I think if we as a country and as a govt truly tried it could be done and none of us would notice any difference.

 

[RYC1966]

Hot potato topic...if you can look around and help those that help you a comunity will be better off. In the comment of competition..would you take the top price or mid price for a chest x-ray...if that is what it came to...would you rather a university grad student who is well devoted to the specific disciplie..but resources are cut so he gets 30 hrs in the lab funded for big gov. It should be for the greater good

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

It's the greed that prevents it. When hospitals want to charge five bucks for an aspirin nobody be taken care of. Costs come down and become more reasonable then so would health care.

 

[RYC1966]

The joke of costs as in asprin = the person does inventory, orders it, places it in avail inv...the costs are driven up. There are more mri machines in some counties that in other countries...the healthcare (ins reform) will shake down in the next few years...there is to much money to be made and big gov wants the largest piece of the pie...so the rules are adjusted

 

[skydivr]

While Universal health care IS a NOBLE CAUSE, people who think like the post Charlie found are living in a dreamworld, kinda like saying "Communist Utopia"....It' s not free, someone is paying for it (just obviously not her)....The people who can afford it, should have the best they can afford...those that don't, unfortunatly, will receive something less than the best. But, under the current system, theirs is free anyway (ever seen an emergency room only about half in there actually speak English). Just because it's not equal doesn't make it wrong, it is what it is.

I have some friends from GB and we had a talk about it. They said, yes, everyone get's free care, but it's often not of good quality, and the waits are atrocious even for simple stuff. I asked them which system the like best, and they said the US hands down. Even if it cost more, they got better care.

Were you on MSNBC? Spend about 10 minutes reading any posts under their stories and you'll be ready to puke.

 

[PocketRocket]

wow touchy topic, always remember to balance grasshopper.. Nothing is free . Nothing .. It would be great if we could have Free health care , But someone is paying for it.. I dont mean to change the topic ( but its kind of along the same lines ) . I do not have children ( OK ) BUT I have to pay school taxes for someones else's kids to go to school . Why That is totally wrong . If they want Kid let them pay for school( taxes) .. same applies for health care. each should pay for his own. The very same thinking is I have a Hayabusa and I think people should pay for my insurance for me. ( wait wasnt it my decision to have a bike? ) The having children is no different > It is a want , not a need... Health care to me is more important than a person having kids as far as a need . Both a freedom of choice , If you want it pay for it.. Cant afford it -do without it.. If you have a medical emergency or issue , thats where volunteer doctors and good doers should step yup to bat.. LORD knows we dont need more government. The bigger its getting the more messed up things are..
On a different note ( I'll make it short ) I was in line at the local gas station a while back.. Dude was in line , wearing sandals and a superman Tshirt ..Buying pizza . Pulls out a food stamp card -gets pizza and sodas . Drives off in a NEW CHALLENGER!!! That's how I guess the system is played.
Even better take the time to look at the link and listen to the 2nd video from 60 minutes..( worth your time)
Jack Abramoff Reveals Shocking Facts on Political Lobbying

 

[captain]

Blanca, just remember you can't legislate morality. You can't make or force someone else to care.. Just like many other topics the govt wants to get in the middle of. Our government shouldnt be sending any money over to other countries to help people with floods, earthquakes or any other disaster. The government shouldn't be offering up any money outside our borders for any charity. It is the responsibility of the citizens to determine what actions will be taken. If I choose to give money for a cause it should be my decision not the governments.. Healthcare is exactly the same to me... We should take care of our neighbors as best as we can, the govt shouldn't be in the middle of the situation making the determination on who gets my money.

Off Rant.

 

[dadofthree]

Healthcare is not a right. I've worked all my life and paid my way so that I and my employer can pay for insurance that doesn't even begin to help when I need it because of all those that hit the ER every time they get a runny nose and ride there in an ambulance all for free. I pay for those rides and those visits by getting charged $30 for an aspirin and getting comped $5 by my paid for insurance.

We're broke now because of selfishness and greed alright. The selfishness and greed of those that think they have a right to education, housing, food, and health care, as well as a nice little assistance check every month.

I have never seen a government ran program that worked. Ever.

I just paid $800.00 for a root canal with dental insurance. I paid for it, no one else.

 

[Twobrothersbusa]

Please Doug let me know how you turn off rant....I remind myself of my grandmother when she would moan about being sick and tired of something...this stuff makes me sick and tired. Thanks guys for the vent. I don't agree, but appreciate perspective on things.

Blanca, just remember you can't legislate morality. You can't make or force someone else to care.. Just like many other topics the govt wants to get in the middle of. Our government shouldnt be sending any money over to other countries to help people with floods, earthquakes or any other disaster. The government shouldn't be offering up any money outside our borders for any charity. It is the responsibility of the citizens to determine what actions will be taken. If I choose to give money for a cause it should be my decision not the governments.. Healthcare is exactly the same to me... We should take care of our neighbors as best as we can, the govt shouldn't be in the middle of the situation making the determination on who gets my money.

Off Rant.

 

[captain]

Please Doug let me know how you turn off rant....I remind myself of my grandmother when she would moan about being sick and tired of something...this stuff makes me sick and tired. Thanks guys for the vent. I don't agree, but appreciate perspective on things.

What part do you not agree with?

 

[Twobrothersbusa]

Not sure I understand this question, but here goes.

When I was young my Grandmother would walk around and always seem to be moaning about something that was bothering her. I always thought it was funny to hear her whining about something. As I have grown older...I find myself doing the exact thing that I laughed at her about. I don't understand where we are going as a country. How can we be so diametrically opposed in our thoughts. If I contribute I expect reward, if someone does not they expect the same. How is this just. I am not opposed to helping someone and do when I can, but it should not be mandated by my government that I support the common good. Here's where I should be able to say "off rant", but can't.

What part do you not agree with?