Helmet....Helmet....Helmet

[GNBRETT]

investigated a fatal accident yesterday where I guy was coming thru my city at Break-neck speed (no pun intended...) and a women pulled up to a stop sign and looked right and saw a bike coming but didnt realize how fast he was going. she proceeded to go straight and then realized that he was traveling faster then she thought he was and tried to accelerate thru the intersection and the operator on the bike clipped the rear of her bumper and went head over heals and smashed his head.

his head looked like someone dropped a watermellon from a 30 story building. would the helmet have saved his life? hard to say but im betting it would have.

if ur gonna ride like an idiot thru city streets expect DEATH. this particular stop intersection is notorious for people just eating the stop sign all together but she did stop but under estimated his speed. he was hauling ass! speed limit was 25 mph and was going probably 60+ mph.

a motorcycle is a smaller mass then a car is and is much more difficult for people to guage ur speed then a car is. ur brain is use to seeing the larger mass (car, truck, etc..) and able to gauge speed much more accurately.

there is a time and a place to let her rip. city street streets is not that place. RIP

 

[black diamond busa]

Well Michigan just passed the no helmet law and I saw tons of people riding without them. I haven't ridden once without it. Sorry but not worth it.

 

[lil charlie]

RIP rider....ATGATT

 

[VaBusa]

RIP rider :down:

 

[RussellJ]

What an idiot. Too bad for his family.

And people say bikes are so dangers. The most dangerous thing about a motorcycle is the rider 95% of the time.

 

[GNBRETT]

What an idiot. Too bad for his family.

And people say bikes are so dangers. The most dangerous thing about a motorcycle is the rider 95% of the time.

u got that right! and this was a neighborhood city street with an elementary school just a couple blocks south of where he crashed with a playground adjacent to the street. not some 4 lane highway city street. houses every 25 feet or so.

some ppl just never learn.

 

[sanket_420]

What an idiot. Too bad for his family.

And people say bikes are so dangers. The most dangerous thing about a motorcycle is the rider 95% of the time.

I couldn't have said it better myself Russell. Feel sorry for the family of the rider. RIP.

 

[sixpack577]

Yes, he should have had a helmet on.
Yes, he should not have been speeding, especially in an area like that.
But because of that, suddenly it's ok that some idiot pulled out in front of him?
You can tell a car is speeding, but because it's a bike you just have no idea, right? I'm not buying it.
How many times has someone pulled out in front of any of you while you were on a bike? It's happened to myself and most every other rider countless times.
Most People just don't pay attention to bikes.
If that was your kid you wouldn't want some type of charge to the driver that pulled out in front of him? I'm not saying to ruin her life too, but something to make her aware.
Had this guy been a member here or a friend of a member would you all be so quick to condem him with a "get what you deserve" attitude? Of course he shouldn't have been speeding there, and should have been wearing a helmet; but no one here has ever went over the speed limit on a bike, and everyone always wears a helmet. Right?
He did something stupid(who can honestly say they haven't?), but he wasn't the only one at fault.
He was someone's son, family, friend. I hope the next guy this happens too isn't any of yours.
Get a better attitude folks.

 

[RussellJ]

Yes, he should have had a helmet on.
Yes, he should not have been speeding, especially in an area like that.
But because of that, suddenly it's ok that some idiot pulled out in front of him?
You can tell a car is speeding, but because it's a bike you just have no idea, right? I'm not buying it.
How many times has someone pulled out in front of any of you while you were on a bike? It's happened to myself and most every other rider countless times.
Most People just don't pay attention to bikes.
If that was your kid you wouldn't want some type of charge to the driver that pulled out in front of him? I'm not saying to ruin her life too, but something to make her aware.
Had this guy been a member here or a friend of a member would you all be so quick to condem him with a "get what you deserve" attitude? Of course he shouldn't have been speeding there, and should have been wearing a helmet; but no one here has ever went over the speed limit on a bike, and everyone always wears a helmet. Right?
He did something stupid(who can honestly say they haven't?), but he wasn't the only one at fault.
He was someone's son, family, friend. I hope the next guy this happens too isn't any of yours.
Get a better attitude folks.

Yes, I absolutely would. I know when I get on my bike, one wrong action or negligence of another could lead to severe injury so I am constantly watching and anticipating what people do while maintaining responsible speeds. I do get on the throttle and play, though rarely anymore because it is simply not worth life changing injuries to do it on any kind of public road. All that took was one minor spill on the dragon to teach me that lesson. I have gotten on my bike onces without a helmet in 5 years. And you know, if something by chance did happen to me, I would not expect anyone to think any different of me than an idiot if I were to fly at high speeds and an accident happened. Was the driver at fault for pulling out? Yes. Could the rider have saved his own life by being much more responsible and intelligent? Yes. If it were a family member it would definitely be a sad situation but that wouldn't change the fact that they were being stupid.

Note I said above that 95% of the time the rider is the most dangerous thing about a motorcycle. That means 5% of the time there are just things you absolutely cannot stop no matter how aware of your surroundings you are or how good you are.

I do feel sorry for his family and the pain they have to endure. But the guy was still an idiot or rather this should not be a shock that he died. Not wearing a helmet and high speed riding is not a recipe for success.

One last thing to add. We as riders should be looking out for ourselves 150% of the time. We just cannot expect any single driver to ever see us or respect us on the road. I always anticipate idiots to never see me or try to hit me. It doesn't make me a fearful rider, but I sure as hell am not going to get injured because of someone else's negligence as long as I can help it. Getting hurt is no fun.

 

[sixpack577]

You used to ride in the rain with no gear.
You just said your spill at the Dragon taught you a lesson.
I've done my share of stupid too.
We were fortunate enough to have a chance to learn, unfortunately this guy wasn't.
Bikes get to 60mph very fast as we all know, and it's easy to space out and not realize just how fast you're going sometimes.
I don't want to argue. I just don't want to bash anyone either, there's always two sides to every story.

 

[BusaBret]

R.I.P. fallen rider




From my dunce stool :cookoo:

 

[GNBRETT]

Yes, he should have had a helmet on.
Yes, he should not have been speeding, especially in an area like that.
But because of that, suddenly it's ok that some idiot pulled out in front of him?
You can tell a car is speeding, but because it's a bike you just have no idea, right? I'm not buying it.
How many times has someone pulled out in front of any of you while you were on a bike? It's happened to myself and most every other rider countless times.
Most People just don't pay attention to bikes.
If that was your kid you wouldn't want some type of charge to the driver that pulled out in front of him? I'm not saying to ruin her life too, but something to make her aware.
Had this guy been a member here or a friend of a member would you all be so quick to condem him with a "get what you deserve" attitude? Of course he shouldn't have been speeding there, and should have been wearing a helmet; but no one here has ever went over the speed limit on a bike, and everyone always wears a helmet. Right?
He did something stupid(who can honestly say they haven't?), but he wasn't the only one at fault.
He was someone's son, family, friend. I hope the next guy this happens too isn't any of yours.
Get a better attitude folks.

well, ive been involved in accident reconstruction for 17 years now and id say 90% of the time the biker died because of his irresponsible operation of the motorcycle. same for those that die in cars but in a car you have a seat belt and a cage to protect you.

im not making excuses for the women who pulled out in front of him. im just stating the facts from my personal experience and what I observed on scene. she will be cited but if he was still alive he would be cited as well for speeding.

its easier to gauge a cars speed then a bikes speed. that is a fact not my opinion. would the helmet have saved him? I really cant say but in all my years investigating MC accidents I can only think of a handfull that died with their helmets on and most not all but most were going so fast that even if they were in a car in a seat belt they would have likely died from impact and shock to the body and dissection of the Aortic valve which tears on impact even when wearing a seat belt.

average perception reaction time is 1.3 seconds. when a bike is traveling nearly (3) times the posted speed limit coming up a hill which is what he was doing it is very difficult to gauge a bikes speed. all we know is a minimum speed not terminal speed which was likely closer to 70 mph prior to impact.

right or wrong he is still dead and he was speeding well before she decided to proceed thru the intersection. and she was an older woman who probably doesnt see very well and her reaction time will be much slower then the average persons. sure, it could be argued that if she didnt proceed thru the intersection he would still be alive but it could also be argued if he wasnt speeding he would also be alive. which came first? his speeding came first.

we dont site fault in accidents. thats for judges and juries to decide. we site whether or not state statute was violated and what midigating factors were present if any when doing so. he had no midigating factors. she did.

the point is you have control over your own speed and whether or not you wear a helmet. you have no control over what someone else is going to do or if they see you in time. its not about attitude, its about exercising common sense and taking precations while operating a motor vehicle that offers you ZERO protection in a collision.

 

[cheferman65]

All I can say is pity the fool for thinking people in cars can see you, judge your speed or anticipate your next maneuver. I sure don't.

If you/me or anyone else riding doesn't assume the personal responsibility for their own safety then shame on you. Riding in a congested area at twice the speed limit gives you no room for error. People don't care, make an effort to see us or are completely oblivious because of distractions. You want to press your luck, then this is the result. Who the hell expects a person to be doing 2x the speed limit?

I personally give two pieces of feces if people want to wear a helmet or not. Hear enough of these stories, read it in the paper, see it on the news or have it hit home directly, smart rider"s heed thy warning.

 

[05 Busa LE]

I recall reading a study by (maybe) State Farm, which said that something like 95% of the time, motorcycle accidents occur when the motorcycle is approaching an intersection on a green light, and a car coming from the opposite direction makes a left turn at the intersection, causing the motorcycle to hit the car.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I recall reading that somewhere.

 

[sixpack577]

well, ive been involved in accident reconstruction for 17 years now and id say 90% of the time the biker died because of his irresponsible operation of the motorcycle. same for those that die in cars but in a car you have a seat belt and a cage to protect you.

im not making excuses for the women who pulled out in front of him. im just stating the facts from my personal experience and what I observed on scene. she will be cited but if he was still alive he would be cited as well for speeding.

its easier to gauge a cars speed then a bikes speed. that is a fact not my opinion. would the helmet have saved him? I really cant say but in all my years investigating MC accidents I can only think of a handfull that died with their helmets on and most not all but most were going so fast that even if they were in a car in a seat belt they would have likely died from impact and shock to the body and dissection of the Aortic valve which tears on impact even when wearing a seat belt.

average perception reaction time is 1.3 seconds. when a bike is traveling nearly (3) times the posted speed limit coming up a hill which is what he was doing it is very difficult to gauge a bikes speed. all we know is a minimum speed not terminal speed which was likely closer to 70 mph prior to impact.

right or wrong he is still dead and he was speeding well before she decided to proceed thru the intersection. and she was an older woman who probably doesnt see very well and her reaction time will be much slower then the average persons. sure, it could be argued that if she didnt proceed thru the intersection he would still be alive but it could also be argued if he wasnt speeding he would also be alive. which came first? his speeding came first.

we dont site fault in accidents. thats for judges and juries to decide. we site whether or not state statute was violated and what midigating factors were present if any when doing so. he had no midigating factors. she did.

the point is you have control over your own speed and whether or not you wear a helmet. you have no control over what someone else is going to do or if they see you in time. its not about attitude, its about exercising common sense and taking precations while operating a motor vehicle that offers you ZERO protection in a collision.

I can't disagree with this at all.
I am just tired of idiots pulling out in front of you, me, and everyone else...car, truck, or bike.
Especially just to slam the brakes to turn a couple hundred feet up the road.
These are the ones causing alot of accidents.
I wasn't trying to make excuses for a rider's irresponsibility either.
I do agree that it was probably just a matter of time before himself or someone else's carelessness did him in.
I do wish that people wouldn't be so quick to judge and bash though.
I thank GOD I survived young and stupid, but too many people in this world seem to have forgotten that they were once that way also(none of this is directed at anyone specifically).
As I said above, what if the guy was a member here? Wouldn't it be nice for the family to read the comments?
The guy could've been an accident waiting to happen who would've eventually killed someone else through his own careless disregard.
Or, he could've just not been paying attention, and didn't realize his speed or surroundings(unlikely yes, but possible).
I think a helmet should be a choice, even though I always wear one and know they save lives.

 

[GNBRETT]

I can't disagree with this at all.
I am just tired of idiots pulling out in front of you, me, and everyone else...car, truck, or bike.
Especially just to slam the brakes to turn a couple hundred feet up the road.
These are the ones causing alot of accidents.
I wasn't trying to make excuses for a rider's irresponsibility either.
I do agree that it was probably just a matter of time before himself or someone else's carelessness did him in.
I do wish that people wouldn't be so quick to judge and bash though.
I thank GOD I survived young and stupid, but too many people in this world seem to have forgotten that they were once that way also(none of this is directed at anyone specifically).
As I said above, what if the guy was a member here? Wouldn't it be nice for the family to read the comments?
The guy could've been an accident waiting to happen who would've eventually killed someone else through his own careless disregard.
Or, he could've just not been paying attention, and didn't realize his speed or surroundings(unlikely yes, but possible).
I think a helmet should be a choice, even though I always wear one and know they save lives.

im not saying ur wrong cause cars do pay less attention to bikes but thats kinda the point of this thread. does it really matter who is responsible when your dead? not really.

I have a passion for motorcycles and have my whole life. just reminding members that death came come very quick on a motorcycle and I see it often. I see it almost as often as I see homicides and thats often.

im just speaking from my experiences. im sure the kid had a family and people that loved dearly and maybe he was a great kid who got straight A's in highschool and its areal shame. or maybe he was some chithead. either way your dead.

im not bashing his death but death is final and you dont get a second chance to approach that stop sign defensively. and when ur taking the actions of others for granted your life is no longer in ur control. potholes, wet pavement, oil spills, etc.... cant control that I know. yes idiots are everywhere. in cars and on bikes.

if one member reads this and remembers this post and backs his hand off that throttle in similar sorrundings when 99% of the time he would be fine. well, then all I can say is sorry but I dont tend to sugarcoat things and speak cadidly. I posted it in the accident section where ppl often come to remind themselves how important gearing up is. I know I have.

I reside in a state that does not require one to wear a helmet. im not gonna lie I have struggled not wearing one in the past. it was a nice day today and few wear them around here. but if im not wearing one im certainly not gonna ride like he was. when its mandatory by ur state its easy to wear cause u have to. like the title says "Helmets...." I would say only 10% of the riders around here wear a helmet.

I too think a helmet should be ones choice just as think a seatbelt is as long as its not ur child who is not buckled up.

ppl often look over at me at a red light and that oh-chit look on their face :oh: kicks in cause there not wearing their seatbelt and scramble to put it on.??? I roll my window down and say its ur face going thru the windshield not mine. you dont want to wear dont wear it. what do you think ur face is gonna look like after going thru glass? ???

then its the deer in the headlight look..... that tends to sink in a lot better then writing someone a ticket. sometimes words have a way of saving people a lifetime of misery.

RIP.

 

[newman]

RIP rider.

 

[1busa]

Yes, he should have had a helmet on.
Yes, he should not have been speeding, especially in an area like that.
But because of that, suddenly it's ok that some idiot pulled out in front of him?
You can tell a car is speeding, but because it's a bike you just have no idea, right? I'm not buying it.
How many times has someone pulled out in front of any of you while you were on a bike? It's happened to myself and most every other rider countless times.
Most People just don't pay attention to bikes.
If that was your kid you wouldn't want some type of charge to the driver that pulled out in front of him? I'm not saying to ruin her life too, but something to make her aware.
Had this guy been a member here or a friend of a member would you all be so quick to condem him with a "get what you deserve" attitude? Of course he shouldn't have been speeding there, and should have been wearing a helmet; but no one here has ever went over the speed limit on a bike, and everyone always wears a helmet. Right?
He did something stupid(who can honestly say they haven't?), but he wasn't the only one at fault.
He was someone's son, family, friend. I hope the next guy this happens too isn't any of yours.
Get a better attitude folks.

Totally agree with sixpack on this 1, sure this guy on the bike was all kinds of wrong but bashing him wont make it right nor bring him back to life. Everybody that owns a motorcycle has a little recklessness in them............. thats part of the appeal of being on 2wheels. We all have had close calls and maybe coulda or shoulda did something a lil more safer. Talkin on the phone while driving, changing a CD, or stuffing your face with a Big Mac, the point is mistakes are made and accidents happen. Some are lucky to learn from them and some are not, either way somebody is not coming home to thier family as a result of this. Thats the bottom line........................

 

[sixpack577]

im not saying ur wrong cause cars do pay less attention to bikes but thats kinda the point of this thread. does it really matter who is responsible when your dead? not really.

I have a passion for motorcycles and have my whole life. just reminding members that death came come very quick on a motorcycle and I see it often. I see it almost as often as I see homicides and thats often.

im just speaking from my experiences. im sure the kid had a family and people that loved dearly and maybe he was a great kid who got straight A's in highschool and its areal shame. or maybe he was some chithead. either way your dead.

im not bashing his death but death is final and you dont get a second chance to approach that stop sign defensively. and when ur taking the actions of others for granted your life is no longer in ur control. potholes, wet pavement, oil spills, etc.... cant control that I know. yes idiots are everywhere. in cars and on bikes.

if one member reads this and remembers this post and backs his hand off that throttle in similar sorrundings when 99% of the time he would be fine. well, then all I can say is sorry but I dont tend to sugarcoat things and speak cadidly. I posted it in the accident section where ppl often come to remind themselves how important gearing up is. I know I have.

I reside in a state that does not require one to wear a helmet. im not gonna lie I have struggled not wearing one in the past. it was a nice day today and few wear them around here. but if im not wearing one im certainly not gonna ride like he was. when its mandatory by ur state its easy to wear cause u have to. like the title says "Helmets...." I would say only 10% of the riders around here wear a helmet.

I too think a helmet should be ones choice just as think a seatbelt is as long as its not ur child who is not buckled up.

ppl often look over at me at a red light and that oh-chit look on their face :oh: kicks in cause there not wearing their seatbelt and scramble to put it on.??? I roll my window down and say its ur face going thru the windshield not mine. you dont want to wear dont wear it. what do you think ur face is gonna look like after going thru glass? ???

then its the deer in the headlight look..... that tends to sink in a lot better then writing someone a ticket. sometimes words have a way of saving people a lifetime of misery.

RIP.

Your seatbelt warning as opposed to a ticket is impressive sir.
There are good and bad citizens, as well as cops.
It's always nice to hear of an officer with common sense and a little Andy Griffith justice.

 

[MikesGSX1300RK9]

MSF Safety Course. And experience bears that out. Drivers aren't paying attention.