From the farm to your fridge

[MelodicMetalGod]

This is not ment to be funny or a poke at you, but laws governing the treatment of cats and dogs are not the same in every country. Go to an open market or breeding farms in Korea, the Phillipines or most Far East or underdeveloped countries and you will see what I mean.

We have a different view of certian animals and how they should be treated. The entire world doesn't share our sentiment.

True. Yet, no restaurant in the US serve dog or cat (or if they do, they are VERY few and far between). The question is why, in this country, do we protect one species and almost completely disregard others?

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Ok, let me put it this way: If we were all vegiterians or vegans, there would be people outside of Walmart protesting the use of pesticides, fertilizers and genetic engineering on our food.

I can see that as a likely. There are probably even such people today. However, I don't see the relevance to how we choose to treat animals.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Mmmmmmmmmm

Never said it didn't taste good. However, even when I ate meat, I'm pretty sure this would've made me puke from the sheer amount of fat alone. lol

It's not that I don't like meat as food, I do. I simply cannot justify the pain it causes to animals that have done nothing to deserve such.

Here's a thought: We take FAR better care of violent criminals than we do animals that have done nothing other than be born. Why?

 

[Schexy1]

True. Yet, no restaurant in the US serve dog or cat (or if they do, they are VERY few and far between). The question is why, in this country, do we protect one species and almost completely disregard others?

We are a country of causes. What is important to one is not important to others. Who ever has the most political muscle gets their way.

At one time there used to be rooster and dog fighting everywhere. Some politician's wife gave her husband a choice and it became illegal.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

We are a country of causes. What is important to one is not important to others. Who ever has the most political muscle gets their way.

At one time there used to be rooster and dog fighting everywhere. Some politician's wife gave her husband a choice and it became illegal.

With all due respect, I am not debating the politics of politics. I am simply posing a question of ethics with regard to animals. Do you have an answer?

 

[Pardini]

The short answer is, they would live natural lives.

I'm speculating that you're implication is that if 100% of humans stopped eating meat, then we'd have too many animals to manage and no place to keep them or means to support them. And that's probably a likely outcome...IF 100% of humans stopped eating meat at the same time.

What's more likely is that humans reduce their meat consumption gradually over time. The industry would react by gradually reducing their breeding over time. Eventually, population of animals currently bred for food would normalize just like any other animal found in nature.

For answers to question like yours, and many other:
Answers to Vegan FAQs

Well, ok I'll quit the meat habit, but it just seems a shame to murder cattle just for belts, wallets and boots. Hopefully, stem cell research will enable us to clone them new hides.

 

[Strife]

Where do we draw the line then? I mean insects are killed every day. They have thought and feel pain. Not the same was as us,but they certainly do. Ganglion...

 

[smac]

PETA's Dirty Secret - Peta Kills Animals

 

[Schexy1]

True. Yet, no restaurant in the US serve dog or cat (or if they do, they are VERY few and far between). The question is why, in this country, do we protect one species and almost completely disregard others?

Nothing happens over night. It is an evolution. Look how long it took us to treat humans the right way in this country. Some would argue that we still haven't got that right.
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[RussellJ]

Plants have feelings to you know!

 

[PocketRocket]

Part of the problem is over population of our species.. We all dont/ cant raise our own food due to lack of room and city life.. In some ways we've evolved and gotten smarter Yet in other ways we've really grown stupid and dependent on Junky resources. We're our own worst enemy IMO to our planet ... Now my next statement will seem a Lil rough and I mean no disrespect But IMO most people make babies have 2-3 kids before they can even afford a roof over their head and food in the frig... the cry GOV. give me a hand-out. So my solution when I become Prez. Have Busa's rather than babies & get a tax credit for buying one/two etc... grow a garden at home get a tax credit based on square footage. Buy Veggie burgers or Grillers/ harvest burgers in the local Store ( they do taste good buy the way ) take the food off your taxes...

 

[BlueHaya]

Part of the problem is over population of our species.. We all dont/ cant raise our own food due to lack of room and city life.. In some ways we've evolved and gotten smarter Yet in other ways we've really grown stupid and dependent on Junky resources. We're our own worst enemy IMO to our planet ... Now my next statement will seem a Lil rough and I mean no disrespect But IMO most people make babies have 2-3 kids before they can even afford a roof over their head and food in the frig... the cry GOV. give me a hand-out. So my solution when I become Prez. Have Busa's rather than babies & get a tax credit for buying one/two etc... grow a garden at home get a tax credit based on square footage. Buy Veggie burgers or Grillers/ harvest burgers in the local Store ( they do taste good buy the way ) take the food off your taxes...

I have to agree...those mushroom veggie burgers arent too bad. Yes I have eaten them.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Well, ok I'll quit the meat habit, but it just seems a shame to murder cattle just for belts, wallets and boots. Hopefully, stem cell research will enable us to clone them new hides.

Excellent! Every little bit helps considering the per capita consumption of meat in the US is over 200 lbs a year.

For the record, I have purchased my last leather products as well.

Regards

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Where do we draw the line then? I mean insects are killed every day. They have thought and feel pain. Not the same was as us,but they certainly do. Ganglion...

I try not to kill those either. I have been known for years to capture them and take them outside.

However, I will say that any mosquito that attacks me or mine will meet a quick end. I will defend myself against any animal, including humans, that intends harm on me or mine.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

PETA's Dirty Secret - Peta Kills Animals

First, let's consider the source of that website:
Center for Consumer Freedom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The group, CCF, is little more than a counter propaganda group setup by the vice industries (smoking, alchohol) and animal processing industries. They have had their own scandals. Here are some of the CCF's targets:

"CCF has campaigned against a number of organizations, such as the Centers for Disease Control, the Center for Science in the Public Interest, Mothers Against Drunk Driving, People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, and Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine, and maintains several websites devoted to criticizing them."



As I said, I've worked with PETA as a volunteer on the circus animal issue (I am not a PETA member), but I was not familiar with this shelter issue.

That said, I think EVERYONE that cares to be is aware of the issue of the overpopulation of pets and that the real issue is that because of human irresponsibility with pets the issue continues to worsen.

ATM I would speculate (I'll be looking into this issue now that I've been made aware) that PETA's killing of these animals is not simply putting down "Fluffy" b/c they can't be bothered to find them a home. The matter is almost certainly more complex than the website linked depicts. Animals in shelters all over the country are killed everyday because there is no one to take them and the shelters are simply beyond capacity on a daily basis.

Humans could do A LOT to mitigate the issue of pet overpopulation:
1) Spay and neuter. Simple, inexpensive and very often not done.
2) Adopt a pet, don't buy it from a store or breeder. For every pet purchased, another animal in a shelter dies. When little Joey just has to have a puppy or a kitty and Mommy and Daddy just have to have a fresh new animal from a breeder or store, that encourages more breeding and less adopting. Still boggles the mind that people are intentionally making more life to take care of when we already can't suppor the lives that exist. Of course, humans do this with their own offspring as well and our gov't supports that, so it's not really a surprise that humans do so with pets.
3) Don't abandon pets. Many of these animals in shelters are brought in by the owners themselves or found abandoned by their owners. Why? It's too expensive, they're moving, the animal got bigger, the animal is untrainable, etc. All BS excuses by humans that are rationalizing why it's no big deal to leave an animal to die that has come to rely on them for everything. We don't do this with our kids (well, most of us don't) and if we do it's considered the height of being a poor human being. Yet with pets, it's no more dramatic than having breakfast. Sad.

Bottom line, while it's unfortunate that PETA has a kill shelter, I suspect there's more to that story and I'll be looking into it for sure. However, the work that PETA does goes much farther to save and protect animals than to killing them. And, realize that humane euthanization is a far better fate than dying on the road of starvation or at the hands of a scientist in a medical experiment. That said, if PETA's policies are truly hypocritical at their shelter, shame on them. But for a an industry that breeds billions of animals a year and slaughters them by the millions per day to counter with that website is fairly ludicrous.

Regardless of PETA's behavior, the issue remains the same: We don't need to exploit animals for food or anything else to live a healthy and complete life.

 

[smac]

My point exactly, a much more complex issue. I am a hunter, trapper and for a time a nuisance control agent for many city and county agencies. I know all sides. Alot of these so called no kill agencies send aminals to different agencies to maintain their status. We have had many discussions on how to humanely kill animals. I saw a horse that had to be euthanized and it was a horrible sight, done by a licensed vet, sure looked like the horse suffered. BUT I STILL EAT MEAT!

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Nothing happens over night. It is an evolution. Look how long it took us to treat humans the right way in this country. Some would argue that we still haven't got that right.
Posted via Mobile Device

Once again, we diverge from the issue. The fact that we have yet to treat humans well in some regards and the fact that change often takes time is irrelevant to how each of us chooses to treat animals through our own choices.

Because we cannot rid the world of all suffering should not be taken to mean that we should do nothing to end the suffering that is in our power to do so.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

Part of the problem is over population of our species.. We all dont/ cant raise our own food due to lack of room and city life.. In some ways we've evolved and gotten smarter Yet in other ways we've really grown stupid and dependent on Junky resources. We're our own worst enemy IMO to our planet ... Now my next statement will seem a Lil rough and I mean no disrespect But IMO most people make babies have 2-3 kids before they can even afford a roof over their head and food in the frig... the cry GOV. give me a hand-out. So my solution when I become Prez. Have Busa's rather than babies & get a tax credit for buying one/two etc... grow a garden at home get a tax credit based on square footage. Buy Veggie burgers or Grillers/ harvest burgers in the local Store ( they do taste good buy the way ) take the food off your taxes...

You are not incorrect and, IMHO, your statements are not harsh but only true. Still...

...this speaks directly to the consumption of animals. It is estimated that the raising of animals for food consumes enough grain/plant food to support far more than the total human population that exists today.

By simply ceasing to eat meat/eating only plant foods, we have MORE than enough food to sustain the population. Wow.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

I have to agree...those mushroom veggie burgers arent too bad. Yes I have eaten them.

Nice! Funny thing about plant based foods is that we often assume they're awful and that as meat eaters we couldn't possibly find anything tasty. But many meat eaters ALSO enjoy vegetables and plant based "mock" meat products simply for their taste.

Every meal that includes plant based foods helps to reduce the suffering to animals.

 

[MelodicMetalGod]

My point exactly, a much more complex issue. I am a hunter, trapper and for a time a nuisance control agent for many city and county agencies. I know all sides. Alot of these so called no kill agencies send aminals to different agencies to maintain their status. We have had many discussions on how to humanely kill animals. I saw a horse that had to be euthanized and it was a horrible sight, done by a licensed vet, sure looked like the horse suffered. BUT I STILL EAT MEAT!

At the very least, if one chooses to eat meat, choosing to humanely raise and end the life of the animal would seem to be the minimum acceptable level of treatment to another innocent life that desires to survive. In the end, killing without a need to do so is a choice and killing in a non-humane manner is a choice to disregard the suffering of another life. Were it done to a cat or dog, it would be considered criminal. Were it done to a human, it would be considered worth of a death sentence.

Why then is it so acceptable to inflict such suffering on other animals?