Counter productive, Dr. Fauci?

[captain]

And that is true Cap, no doubt...just find the timing odd, that they are censoring NOW and like they never have before, as is Google, heavily...

Yet the child trafficking is OK...things that just make you really REALLY wonder...at the end of the day, it's getting VERY hard to do any fact finding anymore, anywhere. It's sad...

Listen sister... My opinion or perspective hasn't changed since I was 18 yrs old. The only person that has me and my family in focus as in the best interest for us is ME... I listen, read, analyze and sometimes go with the grain and often times I will do more, sometimes less. Too many politicians, too much emotion and too many ignorant people to make anything work...

Educate and discern the best actions for you...

I don't have enough time to try to police this social media much less Facebook and Google.

Cap

 

[Mr Brown]

And that is true Cap, no doubt...just find the timing odd, that they are censoring NOW and like they never have before, as is Google, heavily...

All media companies have a vested interest in people staying home, they're simply trying to leverage the situation to their advantage.

Yet the child trafficking is OK...things that just make you really REALLY wonder...at the end of the day, it's getting VERY hard to do any fact finding anymore, anywhere. It's sad...

Fact finding has never been easy. Consider how hard organized religion has fought science, and for how long.
Whoever controls access to information controls truth.

 

[VaBusa]

Listen sister... My opinion or perspective hasn't changed since I was 18 yrs old. The only person that has me and my family in focus as in the best interest for us is ME... I listen, read, analyze and sometimes go with the grain and often times I will do more, sometimes less. Too many politicians, too much emotion and too many ignorant people to make anything work...

Educate and discern the best actions for you...

I don't have enough time to try to police this social media much less Facebook and Google.

Cap

That's how I feel, but look around us now. We can't actively do what's best for our families, can't even research, because we're being told by our government where the line is. I had to remind my youngest a few weeks ago that this isn't business as usual, nothing feels right. He was saying "this isn't any different than normal, except you're working from home" and I cited all of the things we can't do now, even if we wanted to...that's when it clicked, and weeks later, both of my kids are so over this, as are we, as is everyone...

Just unreal to see where this country sits right now, people being thrown in jail for working, citations for not wearing masks, for taking their kids to parks...and look how easy it was to get us here. Will it be easier or more difficult the next time?

Gotta keep this place open, like you always have Might be all that's left one day -

 

[VaBusa]

All media companies have a vested interest in people staying home, they're simply trying to leverage the situation to their advantage.

Fact finding has never been easy. Consider how hard organized religion has fought science, and for how long.
Whoever controls access to information controls truth.

I disagree with that last statement - they don't control the truth, they control THEIR truth - big difference...

All media companies have a vested interest in people staying home, they're simply trying to leverage the situation to their advantage.

Fact finding has never been easy. Consider how hard organized religion has fought science, and for how long.
Whoever controls access to information controls truth.

You mean they control THEIR truth

 

[Mr Brown]

I disagree with that last statement - they don't control the truth, they control THEIR truth - big difference...


You mean they control THEIR truth

So you think an absolute Truth with a capital T is out there somewhere, free of perspective and bias?

 

[VaBusa]

So you think an absolute Truth with a capital T is out there somewhere, free of perspective and bias?

Not sure there ever could be anything free of perspective and bias in media, however I do feel there could be statements of fact, but will we ever just have a place to go for that? Doubtful - every effort I know of right now is still open-source, and there are some great plans in the works I feel, huge efforts to get away from platforms that are restrictive and absolutely controlling content so the content is always narrowed to fit the agenda. The problem with open-source is that you'll always have insane memes and crazy "facts" that aren't fact at all, so you're still left sifting through garbage for truths. There's never a ground-zero on fact anymore, unless you were there, recorded it live and it was streaming for all to see, then maybe that's a truth...maybe...

One effort to open-source info, unfiltered, that I find interesting: Uncensored Platform | The Mirror Project

 

[captain]

Chelle have I mentioned you look great and it's good to see that you remembered your password here

 

[VaBusa]

Chelle have I mentioned you look great and it's good to see that you remembered your password here

Awww, I miss you guys! I never forget my password for the oRg!! And do you realize my Busa is now 17 years old

 

[Mr Brown]

Not sure there ever could be anything free of perspective and bias in media, however I do feel there could be statements of fact, but will we ever just have a place to go for that? Doubtful - every effort I know of right now is still open-source, and there are some great plans in the works I feel, huge efforts to get away from platforms that are restrictive and absolutely controlling content so the content is always narrowed to fit the agenda. The problem with open-source is that you'll always have insane memes and crazy "facts" that aren't fact at all, so you're still left sifting through garbage for truths. There's never a ground-zero on fact anymore, unless you were there, recorded it live and it was streaming for all to see, then maybe that's a truth...maybe...

One effort to open-source info, unfiltered, that I find interesting: Uncensored Platform | The Mirror Project

That's my point. What you seek is something unknowable. I firmly believe that outside of hard science, reality is a matter of perception, and that what we call truth is a collection of agreed upon experiences.

 

[VaBusa]

That's my point. What you seek is something unknowable. I firmly believe that outside of hard science, reality is a matter of perception, and that what we call truth is a collection of agreed upon experiences.

Agreed, but I would like the option to have ALL available info uncensored...

 

[HayaWakened]

I loathe these political discussions, yet find myself reading every word of them, fascinated to learn how my fellow Hayabusa purists feel about such things. Call me conflicted in that regard.

Let me propose here a hypothetical situation: a large well-funded entity (gov’t, corporate, institution, et al) offers me a significant amount of money (7, 8, 9 figures? I’ll get to that point in a moment) to advocate owning a Hayabusa as a cure, or a preventative.

Are you kidding? I would acquire the data, build the science, manipulate that data, misapply that science with feral diligence in order to underscore my advocacy. Because there’s money in it for me. Lots of money. And perhaps prestige (which increases my earning potential).

At which point someone would be bound to ask, “But John, have you no morals, no ethics? Motorcycles will not prevent the spread of the common cold, much less viral infections.”

At which point an informational door has been opened, and out pours all of that accumulated data, which, if assembled properly, is part empirical fact (helmets are a form of protective cover), but largely contextual conjecture (any protective cover reduces the chance of exposure). The argument becomes protracted; salient points get fuzzy, focus is lost, and I have essentially proven that my advocacy might have at least some merit, which is a win, these MSM days.

…a significant amount of money …

Everybody has a number, the mentioned number where we stop, think, consider.

It’s an old joke: I once asked a co-worker if they’d sleep with the boss for a million bucks. They considered that proposition for a moment, then said yes. So I then asked if they’d sleep with me for a hundred bucks. My co-worked feigned astonishment. “What do you think I am??” To which I responded, “That’s already been answered; now we’re just negotiating.”

Name the category of person who is exempt from this scenario and I will tell you to ask again and offer them more money.

 

[VaBusa]

This is pretty funny, sadly

What It's Like to Believe Everything the Media Tells You

 

[VaBusa]

I loathe these political discussions, yet find myself reading every word of them, fascinated to learn how my fellow Hayabusa purists feel about such things. Call me conflicted in that regard.

Let me propose here a hypothetical situation: a large well-funded entity (gov’t, corporate, institution, et al) offers me a significant amount of money (7, 8, 9 figures? I’ll get to that point in a moment) to advocate owning a Hayabusa as a cure, or a preventative.

Are you kidding? I would acquire the data, build the science, manipulate that data, misapply that science with feral diligence in order to underscore my advocacy. Because there’s money in it for me. Lots of money. And perhaps prestige (which increases my earning potential).

At which point someone would be bound to ask, “But John, have you no morals, no ethics? Motorcycles will not prevent the spread of the common cold, much less viral infections.”

At which point an informational door has been opened, and out pours all of that accumulated data, which, if assembled properly, is part empirical fact (helmets are a form of protective cover), but largely contextual conjecture (any protective cover reduces the chance of exposure). The argument becomes protracted; salient points get fuzzy, focus is lost, and I have essentially proven that my advocacy might have at least some merit, which is a win, these MSM days.

…a significant amount of money …

Everybody has a number, the mentioned number where we stop, think, consider.

It’s an old joke: I once asked a co-worker if they’d sleep with the boss for a million bucks. They considered that proposition for a moment, then said yes. So I then asked if they’d sleep with me for a hundred bucks. My co-worked feigned astonishment. “What do you think I am??” To which I responded, “That’s already been answered; now we’re just negotiating.”

Name the category of person who is exempt from this scenario and I will tell you to ask again and offer them more money.

Would you take *insert any amount of money you desire* at the expense of an entire economy, of businesses, of families, risking so many others' lives? For money? I wouldn't...don't care how much, there's no amount, so your scenario points directly to the moral dilemma that I feel has played out for generations. Not everyone can be bought, believe it or not, not if the cost to society is factored in. It's one thing to get a payment for something, but it's an entirely different monster to get money, funding, endorsements or whatever AND play a pivotal role in bringing down the global economy.

That anyone can be bought is not what's being questioned; we already know that's happening and happens all of the time - but how heavy a price is absolutely unacceptable? Millions of lives? One life? Is there a difference? Loss of everything, including our freedoms at this point is such a slippery slope to actively be ON right now, I can't even believe we're here, yet we are.

I do like your joke

 

[Mr Brown]

I loathe these political discussions, yet find myself reading every word of them, fascinated to learn how my fellow Hayabusa purists feel about such things. Call me conflicted in that regard.

Let me propose here a hypothetical situation: a large well-funded entity (gov’t, corporate, institution, et al) offers me a significant amount of money (7, 8, 9 figures? I’ll get to that point in a moment) to advocate owning a Hayabusa as a cure, or a preventative.

Are you kidding? I would acquire the data, build the science, manipulate that data, misapply that science with feral diligence in order to underscore my advocacy. Because there’s money in it for me. Lots of money. And perhaps prestige (which increases my earning potential).

At which point someone would be bound to ask, “But John, have you no morals, no ethics? Motorcycles will not prevent the spread of the common cold, much less viral infections.”

At which point an informational door has been opened, and out pours all of that accumulated data, which, if assembled properly, is part empirical fact (helmets are a form of protective cover), but largely contextual conjecture (any protective cover reduces the chance of exposure). The argument becomes protracted; salient points get fuzzy, focus is lost, and I have essentially proven that my advocacy might have at least some merit, which is a win, these MSM days.

…a significant amount of money …

Everybody has a number, the mentioned number where we stop, think, consider.

It’s an old joke: I once asked a co-worker if they’d sleep with the boss for a million bucks. They considered that proposition for a moment, then said yes. So I then asked if they’d sleep with me for a hundred bucks. My co-worked feigned astonishment. “What do you think I am??” To which I responded, “That’s already been answered; now we’re just negotiating.”

Name the category of person who is exempt from this scenario and I will tell you to ask again and offer them more money.

Everybody may well have a number, but not everything does. There are things which I would not do, no matter how large the amount of money offered, and I suspect that others also have such limits, although they're probably going to be quite different.

 

[HayaWakened]

Would you take *insert any amount of money you desire* at the expense of an entire economy, of businesses, of families, risking so many others' lives? For money? I wouldn't...don't care how much, there's no amount, so your scenario points directly to the moral dilemma that I feel has played out for generations. Not everyone can be bought, believe it or not, not if the cost to society is factored in. It's one thing to get a payment for something, but it's an entirely different monster to get money, funding, endorsements or whatever AND play a pivotal role in bringing down the global economy.

That anyone can be bought is not what's being questioned; we already know that's happening and happens all of the time - but how heavy a price is absolutely unacceptable? Millions of lives? One life? Is there a difference? Loss of everything, including our freedoms at this point is such a slippery slope to actively be ON right now, I can't even believe we're here, yet we are.

I do like your joke

Everybody may well have a number, but not everything does. There are things which I would not do, no matter how large the amount of money offered, and I suspect that others also have such limits, although they're probably going to be quite different.

You realize both of you are legend-status, right? I mean, I've been a member here for about a year, so ...

Anyway...

The answer to the allure of [any amount of money] is yes, for 2 reasons, reasons which address both of the above-quoted arguments:

• Greed: Because it is not the 'entire economy'; it is someone else's entire economy. My economy will be just fine, thank you very much, and yes, I am shortsighted enough not to see the big picture because all I can see at the moment is the big pile of money in front of me. Yes, I'm greedy and this kinda looks like a zero-sum thing anyway ...

• Belief: There are things we would never do for any amount of money due to our beliefs, and therefore things we would do for nothing because we believe it is the right thing to do. Belief systems are famous for their motivational power. Limits, therefore, are a matter of perspective.

Yes, I am mismatching my arguments, or conflating them, as I see our current dilemma to be a mixture of both greed and beliefs. Personally, I am in agreement with both of you, but am struggling to understand the mindset of those who do not agree, and thus am sounding out this argument in the hopes it may assuage some of my personal COVID/MSM angst. I am not a pessimist, and fear my world may be ending soon for ever thinking that I was.

 

[VaBusa]

You realize both of you are legend-status, right? I mean, I've been a member here for about a year, so ...

Anyway...

The answer to the allure of [any amount of money] is yes, for 2 reasons, reasons which address both of the above-quoted arguments:

• Greed: Because it is not the 'entire economy'; it is someone else's entire economy. My economy will be just fine, thank you very much, and yes, I am shortsighted enough not to see the big picture because all I can see at the moment is the big pile of money in front of me. Yes, I'm greedy and this kinda looks like a zero-sum thing anyway ...

• Belief: There are things we would never do for any amount of money due to our beliefs, and therefore things we would do for nothing because we believe it is the right thing to do. Belief systems are famous for their motivational power. Limits, therefore, are a matter of perspective.

Yes, I am mismatching my arguments, or conflating them, as I see our current dilemma to be a mixture of both greed and beliefs. Personally, I am in agreement with both of you, but am struggling to understand the mindset of those who do not agree, and thus am sounding out this argument in the hopes it may assuage some of my personal COVID/MSM angst. I am not a pessimist, and fear my world may be ending soon for ever thinking that I was.

First, legend status, well, I mean......we've put in a lot of time here, for very little pay

I am honestly struggling to understand how anyone, right now, with all that we see going on (assuming we all see it) are OK with just waiting for the next steps. I'm questioning EVERYTHING now, and I was never really that person, EVER. I'm not alone either...I see it and feel it, watch it unfold in small segments of the Internet as long as it's allowed - people are asking WTF is going on and how did we get here, and those rabbit holes run so deep, you get lost, and if you're like me, then you pull yourself back up and say "pfft, no way.....I cannot become that person that now believes *that thing*..." But, then you follow another rabbit hole, and another, and another and they are all leading to some very corrupt, long standing and scary things I almost wish I hadn't found.

Instead of arguing the validity of those points here, or with anyone because I've always tried to not discuss politics or religion with people, I find myself more upset that I am being kept from finding more, that I actively see the censorship happening as I'm watching or sharing something, and that makes me really question why - then I'm right back down a rabbit hole again.

I'm a nobody, we all are, but a bunch of nobodies might want to start considering waking up before we are told how to dress, what to drive, which screw to turn and that today is toilet paper-getting day.

Or, I'm just old and cranky....could also be that

 

[Mr Brown]

You realize both of you are legend-status, right? I mean, I've been a member here for about a year, so ...

Anyway...

The answer to the allure of [any amount of money] is yes, for 2 reasons, reasons which address both of the above-quoted arguments:

• Greed: Because it is not the 'entire economy'; it is someone else's entire economy. My economy will be just fine, thank you very much, and yes, I am shortsighted enough not to see the big picture because all I can see at the moment is the big pile of money in front of me. Yes, I'm greedy and this kinda looks like a zero-sum thing anyway ...

• Belief: There are things we would never do for any amount of money due to our beliefs, and therefore things we would do for nothing because we believe it is the right thing to do. Belief systems are famous for their motivational power. Limits, therefore, are a matter of perspective.

Yes, I am mismatching my arguments, or conflating them, as I see our current dilemma to be a mixture of both greed and beliefs. Personally, I am in agreement with both of you, but am struggling to understand the mindset of those who do not agree, and thus am sounding out this argument in the hopes it may assuage some of my personal COVID/MSM angst. I am not a pessimist, and fear my world may be ending soon for ever thinking that I was.

Legend? That Vabs chick is, but I'm just a peon in comparison....

I struggle with many things, but the viewpoint of people who reject scientific evidence is not part of that struggle. I stake my claim not on certainty, but rather on likelihood of outcome. I base my actions on what I know, and what I know is based in turn on what I can explain. If I want to find something out, I turn to empirical research. There are rules to how such research is conducted, and those rules directly affect its validity. Wanna know what people think about greed or beliefs? Those are empirical questions that can be asked, answered, and given a large enough sample, generalized across a group. People say statistics lie, but they don't. Math cannot lie, it's impossible. People using statistics can lie, and often do, but if you can get your hands on the actual numbers and process, you can find out the likelihood of a given outcome.
That's my truth.

 

[Mr Brown]

Also, if you want to find out who's behind the curtain, follow the money.

 

[michael parris heuberger]

Also, if you want to find out who's behind the curtain, follow the money.

Hi. Look into Dr Fauci and the Clintons. Look into Dr Fauci and the funding of the Wuhan lab.

 

[RedBull]