Can You Really Blame Israel?

[masterblaster]

This is a whole different deep, real deep topic.

Why do people keep referring to palestinians as if they are a country?

 

[nabusa]

All I said was violence begets violence. And at this stage it's impossible for anyone to remember who fired first or who killed who first.

Blanca come on man, if someone slapped you across the face, then spit on you, then pee'd on you would you just say thank do it again? Israel is constantly getting attacked any country will defend themselves. Violence does beget violence but these people are want Israel wiped out and exterminated period. There is no having peace with them.

 

[skydivr]

Well, they've brokered a cease fire...I guess Hamas ran out of missiles....sad but true...

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Well, they've brokered a cease fire...I guess Hamas ran out of missiles....sad but true...

Unfortunately that is probably no where near the truth. You know as well as I they have 1000s more and this current peace will not last long. Nothing has changed.

Blanca come on man, if someone slapped you across the face, then spit on you, then pee'd on you would you just say thank do it again? Israel is constantly getting attacked any country will defend themselves. Violence does beget violence but these people are want Israel wiped out and exterminated period. There is no having peace with them.

Lets look at a little history. Please read...>>> Past Zionist-Jewish Terrorism - Some Historical Facts <<<

It is history and documented. People that are praised now were once guilty of the same types of atrocities being committed now. Those people committed the acts against their occupiers. Many were done in an effort to gain independence. Same style acts done then and people later are awarded Nobel Peace prizes whereas now the people doing similar are terrorists. Again no way a justification for then or now only to point out the history of the area is rich with explosive events and how things are looked at differently sometimes. Heroes they were, terrorists they are, both fighting for independence.

 

[skydivr]

Unfortunately that is probably no where near the truth. You know as well as I they have 1000s more and this current peace will not last long. Nothing has changed.

Maybe true. Hezbollah just got Hamas to test out the limits of Iron Shield for them.

 

[masterblaster]

Both groups are ancient brothers, they need to follow Rodney Kings advice. Unfortunately the Jews and Palastinians have a remarkable history of getting slaughtered (Palestinians by other middle easterners and the Jews by everybody), if they would get together they might be able to break a long chain of history. I been to a few Palestinian weddings and many weddings & funerals of Jews, its remarkable how close they are traditionally and culturally.

 

[GNBRETT]

Lets look at a little history. Please read...>>> Past Zionist-Jewish Terrorism - Some Historical Facts <<<

It is history and documented. People that are praised now were once guilty of the same types of atrocities being committed now. Those people committed the acts against their occupiers. Many were done in an effort to gain independence. Same style acts done then and people later are awarded Nobel Peace prizes whereas now the people doing similar are terrorists. Again no way a justification for then or now only to point out the history of the area is rich with explosive events and how things are looked at differently sometimes. Heroes they were, terrorists they are, both fighting for independence.

lets look at some REAL terroist facts vs. terroists killed for acts of terroism. and these are only from 1993! Major Palestinian Terror Attacks Since Oslo

why is it anywhere around the world when there are SUICIDE bombers and TERROR attacks its almost always ARAB'S carring them out?

more then 100 SUICIDE BOMBER attacks since 2000 in Israel. any you wonder why Israel doesnt want to do business with them nor allow them into their country. here is the full list.....Terrorism Against Israel: Listing of Fatalities

and once again lets cut thru all the BS here and get to the real facts which are MOST of the ARAB'S in that part of the world have no interest in negoiating with Israel. this is a HOLY WAR and they will not stop launching rockets and sending in suicide bombers into Israel until all jews are DEAD. those are the real FACTS and you know it!

ARAB terroists do this to Israel or anyone else who supports Israel and openly admit it! their a bounch of f-en COWARDS!

like many ARAB'S you pretend to not be anti-semitic but deep down you absolutely are. the real truth is your a supporter of terroists. the same terroists that attcked our own country several times and will attack again at some point.

there is no dealing with these people. this cease fire is smoke and mirrors. in fact, most Israili people do not want a cease fire cause they know dam well it will only be a matter of time before they are pelted with unguided missles from terroists again. they will not stop until they claim Jerusalem which is NEVER going to happen so the only alternative is going to be Israel turning Gaza into dust!

 

[skydivr]

I still remember video of Palestinians celebrating in the streets after 9-11....so I don't have much sympathy...

 

[masterblaster]

Yeah and that was Detroit.

Celebrating 9/11 - YouTube[/url]

I still remember video of Palestinians celebrating in the streets after 9-11....so I don't have much sympathy...

 

[nabusa]

Unfortunately that is probably no where near the truth. You know as well as I they have 1000s more and this current peace will not last long. Nothing has changed.




Lets look at a little history. Please read...>>> Past Zionist-Jewish Terrorism - Some Historical Facts <<<

It is history and documented. People that are praised now were once guilty of the same types of atrocities being committed now. Those people committed the acts against their occupiers. Many were done in an effort to gain independence. Same style acts done then and people later are awarded Nobel Peace prizes whereas now the people doing similar are terrorists. Again no way a justification for then or now only to point out the history of the area is rich with explosive events and how things are looked at differently sometimes. Heroes they were, terrorists they are, both fighting for independence.

There is a difference between Muslim terrorists and what the rest of the world does. Do we as a country go killing in the name of God? Does Israel? Does anyone else other them Islam do that? Only Muslims murder and willingly commit themselves to kill anyone that is a friend to the Jewish people. They hate Israel with every fiber in their being. They want ever Jewish person wiped out period, not even as slaves do they want them. They want Jerusalem so bad and if you read the Bible it will not happen again. What does Islam teach? It's not flowers and roses let me tell you. As a believer we should stand with Israel period but it seems like you are defending these Islamic terrorists and labeling Israel as terrorists. How can anyone believer or not possibly defend what Muslim terrorist are doing?

 

[masterblaster]

Unfortunately most of the world thinks Israel is a terrorist country. If you read foreign press, the hatred of Jews is almost equal to the blind hatred the people in the Gaza strip have for them. Only the German press treat the Jews fairly outside the US in my experience (ironic huh). Sometimes I think we should make Israel a state instead of Puerto Rico.

There is a difference between Muslim terrorists and what the rest of the world does. Do we as a country go killing in the name of God? Does Israel? Does anyone else other them Islam do that? Only Muslims murder and willingly commit themselves to kill anyone that is a friend to the Jewish people. They hate Israel with every fiber in their being. They want ever Jewish person wiped out period, not even as slaves do they want them. They want Jerusalem so bad and if you read the Bible it will not happen again. What does Islam teach? It's not flowers and roses let me tell you. As a believer we should stand with Israel period but it seems like you are defending these Islamic terrorists and labeling Israel as terrorists. How can anyone believer or not possibly defend what Muslim terrorist are doing?

 

[chrisjp]

there has been more killing in the name of one god since the concept was developed.

 

[GNBRETT]

I dont understand the celebration???? other then running out of rockets to launch so they can re-up..... and then the Hamas leaders tell their brainwashed people Israel is waiving the white flag. that is the stupid chit those moron's say to the rest of the world thinking Israel has somehow surrendered to them....

how do you think Hamas would respond or even the rest of the world if Israel said "Hamas is waiving the white flag which is why there is now a ceasefire". Hamas would be sending in more rockets and Israel would be condemed for such comments but the world expects these cowards to say things like that and ignores it or down plays it.

you know what strikes me most by terroism is its 100% FAILURE rate! not only do the terroists always fail at what their after but they end up strengthing whatever it is their against.

 

[GNBRETT]

Unfortunately most of the world thinks Israel is a terrorist country. If you read foreign press, the hatred of Jews is almost equal to the blind hatred the people in the Gaza strip have for them. Only the German press treat the Jews fairly outside the US in my experience (ironic huh). Sometimes I think we should make Israel a state instead of Puerto Rico.

the rest of the world does not think Israel is a terroist country. the rest of the Arab world maybe but not the US, Canada, South America, UK, Austrailia, Japan, China, Russia or any other European country.

the jews may not be liked by many people from many places but their hardly thought of as terroists. but I do think its funny that after being hated so much by the German ppl at one time that the German press would not blast them every chance they get. that is ironic I agree.

those who are antisemitic may throw that out there to justify their hate towards jews but ppl from around the world do not think Israel is a terroist country.

 

[masterblaster]

Terrorist was probably not the right word, inconvenient, or not missed if they were disappeared, would be more appropriate. That gos for all the European countries except Germany and maybe Japan in Asia.

 

[nabusa]

What happened on September 11, 2011 when terrorists knocked down the twin towers? We went to war immediately. Ask any New Yorker, close to 100% was in agreement. Now what would happen if the Hamas would fire a single rocket at the United States and blew something up? Instant war. Yet Israel has been bombarded with hundreds of missiles this month alone, trying to belittle Israel for fighting back is just mind blowing to me.

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

I haven't belittled Israel for defending themselves. I have said they have the right to do so.
Didn't call them terrorists either. Simply pointed out that when the people who are leading them now were blowing up hotels sixty yrs ago they were doing same that is being done now, killing innocent people.
And Brett those acts I linked did wind up accomplishing the Stern gangs desires, they resulted in the British leaving the Middle East. So it is easy to see where the examples came from which are being used now by Hamas. I don't support either sides killing of innocent people.

As an outsider and one who's not biased toward either side I don't see much difference in these:

July 2, 1946: The King David Hotel in Jerusalem was bombed, killing 91 people.

Menachem Begin, who was later awarded the Nobel Prize for peace, is the same man who planned the destruction of the King David Hotel and the massacre of Deir Yassin. Ex prime minister, Shamir, was originally a member of the Jewish terrorist gang called Irgun, which was headed by none other than Menachem Begin. Shamir later moved over to the even more radical "Stern Gang," which committed many vicious atrocities.

April 9, 1948: A combined force of Irgun and Stern Gangs committed a brutal massacre of 260 Arab residents of the village of Deir Yassin. Most of whom were women and children. The Israeli hordes even attacked the dead to satisfy their bestial tendencies. In April, 1954, during Holy Week, and on the eve of Easter, The Christian cemeteries in Haifa were invaded, crosses broken down and trampled under the feet of these miscreants, and the tombs desecrated. The Israeli military conquest, therefore was made against a defenseless people, who had been softened up by such earlier massacres as Deir Yasin (where 250 Arabs; men, women and children were massacred).

May 1948: The U.S. appointed Count Folke Bernadotte of Sweden to mediate between the Arabs and the Israelis. In his first progress report (of Sept. 16, 1948) he recommended that the U.N. should affirm "the right of the Arab refugees to return to their homes in Jewish controlled territory at the earliest possible date." The Israelis responded in their own quiet way. The following day Bernadotte was murdered in Jerusalem.

Responsibility for the spectacular assassination, which caused an international outcry, was claimed by an unknown group, "Fatherland Front," which was actually a cover for Shamir's Stern Gang. Yoshua Zeitler and Meshlam Markover of Stern told Israeli television in 1989 that they respectively directed and led the operation that killed the Swedish diplomat and his French aide-de-camp. Zeitler, 71, said he decided to speak now because of fear that the U.N. and the "goyim" (non-Jews) are again trying to force Israel into concessions.

October 14-1 5, 1953 -- Under the command of Ariel Sharon, Israeli squads attacked the unarmed Arab village of Qibya in the demilitarized one. Where they blew up 42 houses and killed more than 60 residents who were trapped inside. The details were so gruesome that the U.S. joined in a U.N. condemnation of the Israeli action, and for the first and only time, suspended aid to Israel in reprisal.

And the ones being committed today by Muslims. So since they were Jews back then they were what?
And since they are Muslims today they are what? Seems to me the same term would apply whatever you want to call them. Israel is not so perfectly clean and innocent is all I'm saying. Should not be considered anti Semitic to recant the truth and history. You wonder where the desire to eliminate Israel comes from, read a history book. It will not change ever.

 

[GNBRETT]

What happened on September 11, 2011 when terrorists knocked down the twin towers? We went to war immediately. Ask any New Yorker, close to 100% was in agreement. Now what would happen if the Hamas would fire a single rocket at the United States and blew something up? Instant war. Yet Israel has been bombarded with hundreds of missiles this month alone, trying to belittle Israel for fighting back is just mind blowing to me.

that seems to be the opinion of most civil minded people. or at least the ones that dont hide behind their antisemitic views who chomp at any reason to say the jews are evil for defending themselves which to me is mind blowing as well.

and its not just the USA that would respond to rocket attacks. its any civilized nation on earth. I can assure you if rockets were being launced into China from Afganistan China would fire back and no one would question that for a second. and it wouldn't be an eye for an eye either nor should it be.

when your country is attacked by terroists your not supposed to respond back evenly. your supposed to eliminate that threat period so it dosent happen again against innocent people just trying to live life without eating rockets for breakfast every morning.....

and rockets are only one aspect of their terror. the fact that another bomb was set off on a bus last week only serves to prove that Israel is the real victim here.

no one from Israel is sneaking into Gaza to set bombs off on buses targeting civilians.

there is only one way to deal with terroists and that is FORCE. they resond to nothing else and never have.

 

[masterblaster]

For clarity, I don't think anyone here is calling anyone else on this forum antisemitic.

Just having n energetic discussion, not blowing each other up, the way we do things here.

 

[nabusa]

I haven't belittled Israel for defending themselves. I have said they have the right to do so.
Didn't call them terrorists either. Simply pointed out that when the people who are leading them now were blowing up hotels sixty yrs ago they were doing same that is being done now, killing innocent people.
And Brett those acts I linked did wind up accomplishing the Stern gangs desires, they resulted in the British leaving the Middle East. So it is easy to see where the examples came from which are being used now by Hamas. I don't support either sides killing of innocent people.

As an outsider and one who's not biased toward either side I don't see much difference in these:








And the ones being committed today by Muslims. So since they were Jews back then they were what?
And since they are Muslims today they are what? Seems to me the same term would apply whatever you want to call them. Israel is not so perfectly clean and innocent is all I'm saying. Should not be considered anti Semitic to recant the truth and history. You wonder where the desire to eliminate Israel comes from, read a history book. It will not change ever.

We don't even need a history book to know why there is a desire to eliminate Israel. Everyone knows that Islam wants to eliminate Israel because of what Muslims believe in. They believe everything the Quran states and whatever Mohammad had told them. It is a Holy war going back for centuries. It is not because Israel killed anyone but solely because Israel is just simply breathing. Islam's God is different the Israel's God. And God said Israel wins hence the pure desire to wipe out Israel from the Islamic stand point. Israel can give up every weapon, wave a white flag and apologize a million times and even offer themselves up for slavery and Islam would say no, just die. Now that is the reality.