2nd Gear Problems and "Powershifting"

Skowinski

Registered
I bought a clean low mileage 04 last April, and during the hunt read many warnings about this 2nd gear "problem" with Hayabusa's. Been reading around on here, but not really coming up with a clear answer to the question in my head, which is:

Is this problem related to people doing powershifting, clutchless shifting, whatever you want to call it, without a quickshifter installed. A quickshifter cuts the throttle momentarily and at exactly the right time to allow the gearbox to unload, which allows the shift to occur without banging the engagement dogs together. Doing it by simply trying to time the right hand throttle with your left foot can lead to gearbox damage if not done correctly. I know because I've been into a few bikes I've bought used and seen the damage, rounded off engagement dogs on the gears and bent shift forks.

My bike had the original owner, 60 year old guy, only ~6000 miles, and he babied it, no powershifting, in fact it still had the original tires, so I know it wasn't run hard. It is just fine, no problems at all with the gearbox.
 
I cant answer your question, but from what I read here about it, sounds more like it was a design flaw..IDK, hope someone can clarify.
I thinks when I getonit, I go WOT, and dont let off, but bang through the gears shifting just shy of redline using the clutch....I`ll have to pay attention more, `cause I`m not sure if I cut the throttle at all or not..I think no???

ETA- and I find this strobe light on the new machine a little anoying.
 
That's a lot of miles! I've got a 1979 GS1000 that barely has more than that... Do you use the clutch to shift, and do you know if the PO's did or not?

I always use the clutch. I'm the only owner, picker her up with 0 miles. I don't believe its a design flaw. Too many Busa's don't have any transmission problems.
 
its more of a drag race problem than just an every day normal riding problem. if you ride the bike hard(like a drag racing situation) without an air shifter. YOU WILL miss shifts, it just happens and the dogs will go. under normal riding conditions i dont think you would ever see a problem.

design flaw, maybe, maybe not. im sure suzuki motor corp has had to replace enough of these under warranty that they see there is a problem with the design and the way a lot folks ride the bike. in case you dont know the busa is a 1/4 mile LEGEND.

you'll hear a lot of people say that if your 2nd gear went out you cant ride, blah, blah, blah. but if you ride the bike hard(dragrace) without an air shifter. you are riding on borrowed time.

my .02
 
Thanks for the comments guys. I asked because jumping out of second gear under power is not just something that Hayabusas might do. I've seen the problem with street bikes, dirt bikes, different brands, and it's always traced to the exact same thing in the gearbox, rounded off gear engagement dogs and/or bent shift forks (usually the dogs). And, that is the exact problem that shifting without the clutch, if done improperly, will cause. The first to second gear shift is the one most likely to cause damage also....

Interested in hearing anyone elses experience! :beerchug:

(oh, and I don't understand what you mean by "if it aint broke don't fix it". :dunno: Maybe more coffee is in order.
 
I was actually wondering this myself.

This is my first Zook. I had Hondas and Yamahas that I slip shift all the time.
My 750 Yamaha actually prefered slip shifting, otherwise it would pop back out of gear. (yeah it was that worn)

I've never had the problems of missing a gear like I do on the busa. (clutch and slip shifting) I've got it stuck inbetween 5th and 6th once. I've never had that happen on any other bike ??? Usually it would go back into 5th.

Also whats up with having to feather the clutch and be rolling to get it in 1st gear sometimes..

I dont think I'm that bad at riding. This thing makes me look like a more bigger idiot. :whistle:
 
Actually, the problem arises when babying the shifter (not pressing hard enough) or when using the clutch, or doing both together. The first makes the dogs not go all the way in (so they often pop back out), while the second guarantees that you will almost never match the rpm when you shift (although the tranny is not under load, the dogs are still being banged upon slightly by the gears).

Clutchless upshifting combined with positive pressure on the shift lever is the only way which guarantees that the shift will occur at the exact moment when rpm matches. Why? Because the dogs are released from their current gear only when the rpm matches (and what's more important that the dogs are not under load at that moment). And since the shifter is preloaded with a good force, at that exact moment not only dogs get released from their current gear, but they are also pushed forcefully into the new gear. The whole affair becomes a single click action - good for the rider, good for the tranny.
 
IMHO all the 2nd gear problems associated with the Gen I were the result of abuse. The Gen II tranny was changed; nothing earth shattering, but I haven't heard anyone complaining about a second gear issue on one and we're almost through the first three years of the new model.

Grip It and Rip It :thumbsup:
 
I drag raced my bike 2 full seasons with the stock transmission. At least a couple of hundred passes. Foot shifted the first year and air shifted the second year. I had a spare that was prepped just in case but never had to use it. When I did swap it out prior to the third season, the old transmission looked great. I'd put it back in a bike without a second thought.
 
I was actually wondering this myself.

This is my first Zook. I had Hondas and Yamahas that I slip shift all the time.
My 750 Yamaha actually prefered slip shifting, otherwise it would pop back out of gear. (yeah it was that worn)

I've never had the problems of missing a gear like I do on the busa. (clutch and slip shifting) I've got it stuck inbetween 5th and 6th once. I've never had that happen on any other bike ??? Usually it would go back into 5th.

Also whats up with having to feather the clutch and be rolling to get it in 1st gear sometimes..

I dont think I'm that bad at riding. This thing makes me look like a more bigger idiot. :whistle:

Suzuki transmissions are not as refined as Yamaha or Honda. They require a different technique to change gears smoothly. I think alot of the hurt transmissions are from folks coming from the other brands. I've had 5 different Suzuki models over the years and they all shift the same.
 
I use the clutch all the time and it shifts pretty smooth. I'm probably not thrashing the bike hard enough to mess up the trans.
 
Suzuki transmissions are not as refined as Yamaha or Honda. They require a different technique to change gears smoothly. I think alot of the hurt transmissions are from folks coming from the other brands. I've had 5 different Suzuki models over the years and they all shift the same.

Thats what I was thinking but wanted someone to confirm.
The last few bikes my friend has owned has been Suzuki. I said something to him about the noise I was hearing when I first got it. He said "Does it sound like crickets? Yeah, thats a Suzuki noise.."
Now I'm used to it and tune it out..
 
Get you 2nd gear undercut and change any bad forks or bad parts in the tranny. Some Gen 1 hayabusa have this problem with 2nd gear. On my 06 busa my 2nd went at 8000 miles and my buddy with a 07 busa at 5000 miles. My other friend with a 2000 busa never had one problem with is tranny and he as over 34500 miles, hes bike is also pushing 190 hp at the rear wheel. If you are the type of rider whos hard on the gas this will be your best bet. APE APE will do transmission service to undercut your gear. My mechanic tells me hayabusa transmission are almost bullet prof after undercuting the 2nd gear.
 
Suzuki transmissions are not as refined as Yamaha or Honda. They require a different technique to change gears smoothly. I think alot of the hurt transmissions are from folks coming from the other brands. I've had 5 different Suzuki models over the years and they all shift the same.

I agree! Sometimes I feel like my 1981 Honda CB900F Supersport shifted better than my Busa does now. Not that I would EVER go back to an inferior bike...:tongue4:
 
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