JINKSTER ATTACKS "SUSPENSION"
- Thread starter JINKSTER
- Start date
hey jink question lets say someone wanted to replace their fork springs but they didnt have the money and they knew someone who was replacing their perfectly good stock springs for some after market ones. Now would this person be able to use those stock springs to replace his worn out springs and what else would need to be purchased to do this
him & FAKK2...I think I found the answers to your questions here...
http://www.cerbslair.com/ltcc/crash_course.html
L8R, Bill.
http://www.cerbslair.com/ltcc/crash_course.html
L8R, Bill.
Guess you gave us the right answer
get better info here ...him...
http://www.racetech.com/evalvin....english
Get better advice and expertiese off the web than getting is via a cut paste job... lol... almost fell for him knowing what he was talking about...
L8R
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get better info here ...him...
http://www.racetech.com/evalvin....english
Get better advice and expertiese off the web than getting is via a cut paste job... lol... almost fell for him knowing what he was talking about...
L8R
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Reason for Edit: None given...|1116332791 -->
The 2nd link has better info that I was looking for. They made a little chart that describes some factors and how they relate. Unfortunately, damping is a "feel" thing with no measurements to take or see. It'd be great to know exactly how much damping provides the best traction and feeling of control. So I guess its trial and error with some advice for initial settings is all we have to work with...Charles...here's two excellent articles that word things probably much clearer than I can...
http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/howto/suspensionadjust/
and...
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9604_tech/
Some light reading never hurt anybody!
L8R, Bill.
JINKSTER do you know of or can you recommend any damping settings for a certain body weight and certain Preload with stock suzuki suspension? I doubt Suzuki has recommended damping settings based on different body weights and different Preloads.
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Charles...I wish I did but I don't..and as you saw/read in the articles the damping adjustments aren't even linear..as the article touched on the fact that you do not get "Same/Same" for each click..and that typically the first few clicks yield far more bypass value than do the last few clicks.The 2nd link has better info that I was looking for. They made a little chart(below) that describes some factors and how they relate. Unfortunately, damping is a "feel" thing with no measurements to take or see. It'd be great to know exactly how much damping provides the best traction and feeling of control. So I guess its trial and error with some advice for initial settings is all we have to work with...Charles...here's two excellent articles that word things probably much clearer than I can...
http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/howto/suspensionadjust/
and...
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9604_tech/
Some light reading never hurt anybody!
L8R, Bill.
JINKSTER do you know of or can you recommend any damping settings for a certain body weight and certain Preload with stock suzuki suspension? I doubt Suzuki has recommended damping settings based on different body weights and different Preloads.
Another aspect that many seem to overlook is this...
"Increased Rider Weight Can Actually Seem To 'ACT' As More Compression Damping"
In other words...the heavier a riders body weight is?..the more affect it will have on readily subduing a spring..into what feels like a damped state..like when you take on a pillion rider..and the spring compresses itself into a higher stacked compression rate...and then suddenly your bike "feels" more solid and planted...as the added rider weight is now serving to add a damped feel to the springs compression and rebound because...
a. It's more compressed under load and..
b. It's not able to REBOUND and recover quite as quickly under the weight of two riders vs one.
So everything becomes a variable...with only "suggested" starting points from which to begin the suspension tuning process from...and all the pro's do agree on one thing...the best place to start is with a properly sprung bike..by setting static sag #'s accordingly...with adjustments made via spring preload or (if necessary) by swapping out springs to attain appropriate compression rates...and then and only then can "the damping tuning" process begin in an accurate fashion...preferably 1 click at a time..whilst keeping in mind that the first few clicks yeild the most affect.
And this is where the "Straight Rate Springs" shine over "Progressive Rate Springs" as while the progressive rate springs build and stack up much quicker than the straight rate springs?...it is that very progressive nature which makes them so difficult to attain proper sag and damping...as "The Sweet Spot Of Travel" is greatly diminished with the progressive rate springs...as you attempt to adjust what is "FINITE" damping values...and this is where progressive rate springs can make a suspension tuning perfectionist pull his freaking hair out as opposed to tuning what is finite damping for the "far easier to tune" straight rate springs...which will yeild a far greater...
"Sweet Spot Of Travel"
L8R, Bill.
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ALL_N_TIME
Registered
Can the busa be lowered with these adjustments you mentioned here. Or will I have to get a Kit. I'm about 5 7" and my legs are short so this is an issue. Help!
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i think you will have to get some kind of device be it tripple tree, spacers, bar risers, lowring links
Jinkster,
Just tried your setup on my 05 and I thought it was good before but the difference is amazing. Thanks for the good solid info.
Just tried your setup on my 05 and I thought it was good before but the difference is amazing. Thanks for the good solid info.
I'll give your settings a try Jinxster... Looks like you've done the hard work for setting up the Busa for a 240lb guy.
Here's a thinker though, what if I want a plush, non-jarring ride but I still want it to handle in the twisties? Are these mutually exclusive things? Is there any way to have a plush shock free ride and still handle well?
Anyway, great info man, and I look forward to giving your settings a try.
Rev
Here's a thinker though, what if I want a plush, non-jarring ride but I still want it to handle in the twisties? Are these mutually exclusive things? Is there any way to have a plush shock free ride and still handle well?
Anyway, great info man, and I look forward to giving your settings a try.
Rev
FL Knifemaker
Registered
I weigh about 280lbs and just did some tweeking on mine. I added just a little bit more to the Jinxter formula and the results are excellent. It feels like a different bike. It feels a LOT more stable and less twichy when cornering hard. It also feels a lot more confident under hard braking. I need to go with the heavier springs but for now, it's WAAAAAAAAAAY better. I'll probably do the springs, tires, wavey rotors and braided lines all in one shot once, I get all the stuff together.
Thanks Jinxter for all the effort you put into this. It sure makes my riding alot more enjoyable!!
Thanks Jinxter for all the effort you put into this. It sure makes my riding alot more enjoyable!!
Thanks Jinkster!! Tuned the suspension this morning and took it out to the twisties. Huge difference in the confidence I have with the bike carving the corners. Since my @$$ is about the same size as yours, I was able to take a few shortcuts thanks to your tutorial. My final tune:
Front:
Spring Pre-Load - 5 full rounds more than stock
Rebound - 1 click stiffer than stock
Compression - 3 clicks stiffer than stock
I have the rear set up exactly as you recommended in your tutorial.
Front:
Spring Pre-Load - 5 full rounds more than stock
Rebound - 1 click stiffer than stock
Compression - 3 clicks stiffer than stock
I have the rear set up exactly as you recommended in your tutorial.
I was out pounding on my rear shock adjusting collar with a drift when I wondered what tire pressure you all were running? I have dropped to 36/36 from the recommended 42/42 so stiffening the suspension up some seemed to be a good idea since the bike definitely was softer feeling after I took the tires down from 42/42. But, wouldn't tire pressure have some impact on the settings?
Hey Jinkster, quick question. I took off my side panels a couple of weeks ago for a thorough cleaning and found that I had apparently touched the front lowest part of the panel to the ground possibly through the Gap. With the stock suspension (soft and mushy), is that likely? The ride's stiffer and making my run up to Wyoming was a lot better in the turns but I'm curious on just how bad the stock suspension is.
Thanks again for the work you did and the tips. It's about time for new fork oil (22k miles) and I'm thinking of replacing the springs at the same time.
Later.
Carl
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Thanks again for the work you did and the tips. It's about time for new fork oil (22k miles) and I'm thinking of replacing the springs at the same time.
Later.
Carl
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Update from yesterday's post. I am running the tires at 42/42. I was having some fun this morning with the new setup. I'm carring an EXTRA 10 MPH through the corners than I was able to with the stock setup. I'm sure that number will go up some more as I get used to the new feel. Thanks again Jinkster!
Thanks folks and you're very welcome...my pleasure.
And yes...as some of you have already noticed?...now that your suspension is taunt enough to GET some feedback?...you will now be able to notice the affects of subtle tire psi changes and be able to fine tweak the psi to your liking, tastes and preferences as well.
L8R, Bill.
And yes...as some of you have already noticed?...now that your suspension is taunt enough to GET some feedback?...you will now be able to notice the affects of subtle tire psi changes and be able to fine tweak the psi to your liking, tastes and preferences as well.
L8R, Bill.
JINKSTER
Im a 215Lb - 5'11" rider. I used your suspension settings for my 05 Busa today and dig the new setup but have a few questions for you. Here are my settings.
Im getting some different settings on my front Preload than you. I used a 17mm socket, marked a line on the socket, and find Im getting about 15 full Revs before I'm full out. You stated I believe 12 is full out. so I did it a few times and got the same results. Am I measuring wrong- First full turn I count as 1 and when I get to 10 revs, I counted 10 full revs / thus starting with another rev would be working on 11. Im also finding that when I'm bottomed out on my Preload I see that my left and right side compression adjusters when set at zero do not share the same vertical/ horizontal pattern - is this normal---meaning both lines are not level with eachother, but both are still bottomed out.
Also, in reguards to compression and rebound, when bottomed out, do you count that as 1, or your are you counting your first click as 1?
so here are my settings, should I change anything, am I running to much pre-load on the front?
Front Preload- 12 Revs In ( As stated it seems like I have a full 15 Revs in from bottom)
Compression - 4 clicks out
Rebound- 3 clicks out
Rear Preload- 2 full Revs on the collar clockwise
Compression- 7 clicks out
Dampening- 10 clicks out
I Very much appreciate all your time, I read this thread about 6 times, and found this information and your pictures completely awesome. Thanks for helping a guy out.
Im a 215Lb - 5'11" rider. I used your suspension settings for my 05 Busa today and dig the new setup but have a few questions for you. Here are my settings.
Im getting some different settings on my front Preload than you. I used a 17mm socket, marked a line on the socket, and find Im getting about 15 full Revs before I'm full out. You stated I believe 12 is full out. so I did it a few times and got the same results. Am I measuring wrong- First full turn I count as 1 and when I get to 10 revs, I counted 10 full revs / thus starting with another rev would be working on 11. Im also finding that when I'm bottomed out on my Preload I see that my left and right side compression adjusters when set at zero do not share the same vertical/ horizontal pattern - is this normal---meaning both lines are not level with eachother, but both are still bottomed out.
Also, in reguards to compression and rebound, when bottomed out, do you count that as 1, or your are you counting your first click as 1?
so here are my settings, should I change anything, am I running to much pre-load on the front?
Front Preload- 12 Revs In ( As stated it seems like I have a full 15 Revs in from bottom)
Compression - 4 clicks out
Rebound- 3 clicks out
Rear Preload- 2 full Revs on the collar clockwise
Compression- 7 clicks out
Dampening- 10 clicks out
I Very much appreciate all your time, I read this thread about 6 times, and found this information and your pictures completely awesome. Thanks for helping a guy out.
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