If your Hayabusa starter will not turn over... or the clutch will not disengage (2 separate problems):

R

RobBeck

Registered
I bought a very lightly used 2009 Hayabusa several years back. This bike was basically brand new, barely ridden anyway, as I bought it in 2019 with 250 miles. Not being much better than the first owner, in the past several years I only put 100 miles on it as I have too much stuff and not enough time for it all. I do have a bit of an additional excuse in that it seemed to develop a problem a the next season after I bought it, so until now I'd just walked away from it.

Anyway after that first season of sitting directly after purchase, the clutch stopped working (it would not disengage). I did all of the common checks and it was not the lack of function of the master/slave cylinders or bleeding or blah blah blah. Went through diagnosing all of it anyway and still nothing, but then realized I could see the movement of the clutch basket by removing the oil cap. At this point it was confirmed that the clutch steels/fibers must've become adjoined or fused together somehow. I tried all I could to get them to break free, even try riding it around with the clutch zip tied, WOT pulls/wheelies you name it and this clutch was not going to break free for anything. Someday I guess I'd pull it apart and look at it.

So I gave up on it until the last year and went to mess with it again and then to add further salt into the wounds it would not even try to start. Admittedly I did put the starter through some hell in the process above as each time I'd crank it in gear with the prior problem the bike would be lunging forward as the clutch was locked, which no doubt put the starter through some trauma.

Today finally pulled it all apart. The clutch steels and fibers were absolutely 100% fused to one another, most every one of them actually having to be pried apart. So I ordered a new OE clutch kit to just end the saga there. Everything looked pretty clean aside for the steels/fibers, so that was a relief.

Now onto the lack of Starter function. I tested the relay, which was clicking, and all was well. 12v was making it to the starter, just doing nothing for the starter. This was confirmed when removed and bench tested as well. The new OEM starters are about $400 new so I figured I'd see what I could do with hopefully servicing it. So I took it all apart which was rather simple, lightly bead blasted the insides of the mid case and rear brush plate. Cleaned up all parts with solvent and compressed air, everything looked pretty much new. Even took the rotor/windings and polished up the copper contact portion with a dremel very fine buffing wheel, which looked new as well when done. Put it back together, still didn't work. Took back apart again and realized the brushes actually were seized and not "springing" down back onto contact with the rotors conductor. So pushed them down and worked them back and forth again and they freed up and the spring action was working to the point where they were then making solid contact. Upon reassembly and testing the unit now works perfectly, seized brushes being the actual issue.

Keep in mind the bike was always stored indoors, but that still did not help much in this case apparently and lack of use simply caught up to me. Anyway just wanted to share in case anyone else comes across similar issues, which in this case I feel like are 2 pretty whacky ordeals in one, but both pretty easy fixes each way.

Rob
 
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The joys of something sitting for a long period of time....in this case that bike should have been treated as a preservation project..

I had a similar yet different experience years ago with a garden tractor....this was in 2017 and the tractor was an '89...it was brand new and had never cut grass....a dealership brought it in new and they were overstocked so they put it in a storage area and basically forgot about it...

The owner died and his son took over the business and put it up for sale....I was pretty excited to get it as I had the same one only almost wore out...I asked my brother if this was a good deal and he told me to leave it right where it was....after sitting that long everything that could stick together or dry out would and I would spend a lot of time and money getting it working properly.

Now I'm always leery of anything older with very low miles....
 
@RobBeck

some hints
1. place the busa vertically using the rear or middle jack (through the swing arm axis)
2. Let the oil drain and drip out for at least 20 minutes
3. Take off the oil filter and throw it in the trash
4. Put in a new filter and new oil (3.5-3.7 liters)
5. battery new and in (if dead)
6. shift when lifted by hand and moving the rear wheel by hand a bit into neutral (green light in the speedo)
7. start the engine with trans in neutral

Then if the rear wheel turns quickly and you can't stop it with the rear brake, the clutch discs will most likely be very sticky so that they can no longer be separated.

If so, take off the clutch cover, take out all the clutch plates, separate them, re-oil them and put everything back together.
If the clutch system is still working reasonably well, you should now be able to shift gears again with the engine running but the rear wheel braked.

AND if not done yet , download the gen2 (2009) manual here and read and read
 
Berlin Germany said:
@RobBeck

some hints
1. place the busa vertically using the rear or middle jack (through the swing arm axis)
2. Let the oil drain and drip out for at least 20 minutes
3. Take off the oil filter and throw it in the trash
4. Put in a new filter and new oil (3.5-3.7 liters)
5. battery new and in (if dead)
6. shift when lifted by hand and moving the rear wheel by hand a bit into neutral (green light in the speedo)
7. start the engine with trans in neutral

Then if the rear wheel turns quickly and you can't stop it with the rear brake, the clutch discs will most likely be very sticky so that they can no longer be separated.

If so, take off the clutch cover, take out all the clutch plates, separate them, re-oil them and put everything back together.
If the clutch system is still working reasonably well, you should now be able to shift gears again with the engine running but the rear wheel braked.

AND if not done yet , download the gen2 (2009) manual here and read and read
Click to expand...

All of that was stuff done first off. Not wanting to give up the next up was zip tying clutch and riding around doing WOT passes and wheelies, hard rear wheel braking, etc. I was in disbelief that nothing would break it loose, the heat and torque/etc, and in the moment of life just had to walk away from it and save it for another day. During some of these escapades I'd used the starter to get it going again, which surely didn't help its cause and more than likely led to the 2nd problem.

Sure enough the clutch fibers were imbedded into the steels unlike anything I've ever seen before, they can not be re-used as the organic matter is embedded on the steels after separation. If there is any interest I can post up some pics, but it is certainly beyond repair and I am ok with purchasing the new $140 OEM clutch kit at this point.

I currently have 9 other bikes many of which have sat years at a time, and have had many other bikes over the course of my life of which had gone unused for years at a time. They always are indoors in temperature controlled environments and have always been fine. I was just sharing this about the Busa here so the next guy to google for a similar issue gets his reassurance of the possibility. It seems the Busa's clutch sits well out of the oil bath, especially when on side stand, so that the clamping force of the pressure plate over much time just can lead to the this issue.

Overall the bike is still a Gem and all else inside and out looks perfect, definitely no regrets buying the low mile never used bike and it is a very low dollar fix.

Also yes someone else mentioned above I'll definitely go through the brake fluids and coolant, although all else (aside the sticky clutch) seems to be mint.
 
Bumblebee said:
The joys of something sitting for a long period of time....in this case that bike should have been treated as a preservation project..

I had a similar yet different experience years ago with a garden tractor....this was in 2017 and the tractor was an '89...it was brand new and had never cut grass....a dealership brought it in new and they were overstocked so they put it in a storage area and basically forgot about it...

The owner died and his son took over the business and put it up for sale....I was pretty excited to get it as I had the same one only almost wore out...I asked my brother if this was a good deal and he told me to leave it right where it was....after sitting that long everything that could stick together or dry out would and I would spend a lot of time and money getting it working properly.

Now I'm always leery of anything older with very low miles....
Click to expand...
I agree with that, low miles does not always equate most ideal. Makes you wonder about all of these collector cars, some 30+ years old with less than 1k miles. A good use or two every year and fluid changes every couple/few years is very much needed.
 
The fluid in the resivors may be clean enough looking, but what is behind the caliper pistons is likely dark brown and sludgey.
The hydraulic system, even though it's fluid filled with idealy no air, the fluid tends to just move back and forth in the lines like a solid object, so the fluid behind the pistons basically all stays in there in that one place in the system.
It is subjected to the most heat, and breaks down sooner.
The more the fluid breaks down(from heat, and moisture contamination), the more caustic it becomes, and it eats the piston seals, causing them either to leak, or more commonly, gum up and sieze one by one, usually on one side at a time.
I have rebuilt Many old and neglected caliper and master cylinders, and the fluid is always worse in the calipers.
So vacuum All the fluid out, and flush new through the lines before starting to bleed them.
This is my '03 Gsxr1k's front calipers(I got the bike this way and am currently restoring and modifying it all).
A couple pistons were siezed in each caliper, pads were good, calipers were filthy, rotors shot, but clean fluid in the MC, and clean fluid in the lines...but this was no suprise to see..
Your nice brakes are currently doing this too, as the fluid is about 15 years old, and has a 2-3 year service life.

20231105_195504.jpg
 
sixpack577 said:
The fluid in the resivors may be clean enough looking, but what is behind the caliper pistons is likely dark brown and sludgey.
The hydraulic system, even though it's fluid filled with idealy no air, the fluid tends to just move back and forth in the lines like a solid object, so the fluid behind the pistons basically all stays in there in that one place in the system.
It is subjected to the most heat, and breaks down sooner.
The more the fluid breaks down(from heat, and moisture contamination), the more caustic it becomes, and it eats the piston seals, causing them either to leak, or more commonly, gum up and sieze one by one, usually on one side at a time.
I have rebuild Many old and neglected caliper and master cylinders, and the fluid is always worse in the calipers.
So vacuum All the fluid out, and flush new through the lines before starting to bleed them.
This is my '03 Gsxr1k's front calipers(I got the bike this way and am currently restoring and modifying it all).
A couple pistons were siezed in each caliper, pads were good, calipers were filthy, rotors shot, but clean fluid in the MC, and clean fluid in the lines...but this was no suprise to see..
Your nice brakes are currently doing this too, as the fluid is about 15 years old, and has a 2-3 year service life.

View attachment 1674479
Click to expand...

Just my experience but that is from a combination of usage, heat, and neglect; not from a bike that was sitting unused in a temperature controlled indoor environment. Not to say my fluid couldn't stand a change as it surely has some moisture and breakdown and thus it will be done, but I'd bet anything it is not black or sludge (even if I popped out the pistons and looked). I'd agree that old unused and otherwise clean brake fluid when/if heated/used is much more likely to quickly end up like that over new fluid if not addressed though.

Going back to the clutch issue the first thing I'd mentioned I'd done was flush and bleed the hydraulic clutch, as I thought that was the cause for the problem. When I flushed it, all looked perfect, but I had started the process and just finished it anyway. Later I realized you could see the clutch moving with the oil cap removed, which at that point knew for sure the clutch itself was stuck together somehow. Point is that the hydraulic clutch was working perfect the entire time and looked perfect too, even though the clutches brake fluid was ~12 years old.

Unfortunately i think I painted a picture that this bike is a wreck, but could not be the furthest thing from the truth. The insides of the cases are shiny like new. It literally is a showroom looking 2nd gen inside and out. The only thing that happened was the pressure plate fused the organic matter to the steels in the time of sitting.
 
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No, I did not expect the calipers to be anywhere near as bad, nor meant to imply that.
But simply that the fluid needs flushed, as it doesn't age well.
If you start riding on it now, that fluid will deteriorate much quicker than you may think.
I have worked on the low mileage bikes that sat long term too...and it's always a gamble as to what went bad and what didn't.
 
sixpack577 said:
No, I did not expect the calipers to be anywhere near as bad, nor meant to imply that.
But simply that the fluid needs flushed, as it doesn't age well.
If you start riding on it now, that fluid will deteriorate much quicker than you may think.
I have worked on the low mileage bikes that sat long term too...and it's always a gamble as to what went bad and what didn't.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree any more that going through and changing all fluids is a good plan, especially before the machine is brought back out to enjoy/beat on.
 
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