GM Bailout

[winlite]

Would the GM bailout mean taxpayers would fund all the retirement pensions of retired GM employees? Would it mean that the union would receive a portion of the bailout money? Most of us are not members of the union and many of don't know if we will ever even be able to retire. Many have seen what retirement they have shrink dramatically. The stranglehold of the union is one big reason GM is in trouble. Walmart employs almost seven times the personel that GM does. Would they be eligible for a bailout if they made stupid decisions like GM has?

[Dino]

Actually from what I have read, bail out money would fund GM to 2010. That would give them time to restructuer and allow the auto market to recover. It would fund pensions and health care for retirees but the Unions have agreed to take that over in 2010.

Check out CNN.com they have a couple good write-ups.

[thrasherfox]

Well I think the CEO's of course would have to give themselves a bonus for talking the feds into giving them funding until 2010. I mean heck they just saved the company!!! they would deserve the bonus right?....right?...

I think I am hearing crickets..

anyway. Yeah, where does the hand out stop!! oh wait!! I know this one. It stops just before it gets to you and me..

[Southside Playa]

Originally Posted by thrasherfox

Yeah, where does the hand out stop!! oh wait!! I know this one. It stops just before it gets to you and me..

+1,000

Dayum, why doe severything work like that?

You knwo now that all of the election hype is gone, I realize we (or at least most of us) all belong to the same party ................................... the party of those getting SCREWED.

[thrasherfox]

Originally Posted by Southside Playa

+1,000

Dayum, why doe severything work like that?

You knwo now that all of the election hype is gone, I realize we (or at least most of us) all belong to the same party ................................... the party of those getting SCREWED.

Yeah, dry and without the gratuitous reach around

[Dino]

Originally Posted by thrasherfox

Yeah, dry and without the gratuitous reach around

That made me throw-up a little...

[thrasherfox]

Originally Posted by sjcurrence

That made me throw-up a little...

I am starting to throw up everytime I hear about the bail out

[Dino]

Originally Posted by thrasherfox

I am starting to throw up everytime I hear about the bail out

Well that just makes me shart....

[DREW]

UAW workers get $71.00 hour including benefits. Let them bail GM out.

[UncleSteve]

swim or sink, GM has been screwing up for years, they have too many buttheads running the company.
A bailout would be a reward for crappy management and poor business practices.
Let them fix their own problems.
When does the taxpayer get a break?
Build vehicles people want to own and drive and the problem is solved.

[ozz]

i say no bail out for GM, its funny though how things work, walmart is vilified for being walmart yet they dont need any bailout, they make a profit and employe more folks than GM i understand. The market should bare out these losses not the taxpayers, and if that means GM gos down so be it

next other nations are going to line up with their hands out since pauleson has already applogizied to them, now they can say since you are guilty for our economic down turn we want compensation

[runeight]

Originally Posted by DREW

UAW workers get $71.00 hour including benefits. Let them bail GM out.

Close the doors.

r8

[runeight]

The bailout is for the UAW not the company.

Example? Sure.

Sales of GM products in China up 18.5%.

The Associated Press: GM shows 3 new models for China

r8

[FastLaneKen]

GM needs to to file for a BK

They do not have a working business model and they lose money on each car sold.

Why invest in a broken out dated business model

The airlines all went thru a BK and they are fine

Its a BIG wake up call that they need to get their ACT together

GM has more people on pension then on their payroll and the workers are some of the highest paid.

What happened to the idea that we pay people MORE MONEY if and when they make something of higher value.

GM cars have little resale value, yet they cost the most in labor to build - Duh!

What is wrong here is the basic business model is broken and needs to be fixed

[runeight]

Here is the Dems answer to your questions.

100 billion at this time. Can anyone say "Carter Years?"

r8

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/18/wa...ef=automobiles

[runeight]

And if that fails we will just stomp our feet like the "little brats" we are!

Senator Reid

Mr. Reid proposed a $100 billion economic stimulus plan that would include $25 billion in loans for the auto industry as well as $13.5 billion for roads, mass transit and other public infrastructure; money for financially ailing state governments; more jobless benefits; and added food stamp assistance.

If that plan stalls, as seems virtually certain since the White House and Congressional Republicans have resisted it in the past, Democrats say they will propose a separate program that would divert to the auto industry $25 billion of the $700 billion approved earlier for the financial industry.

[thrasherfox]

Survival of the fittest.

None of the auto manufactures have done anything really serious about getting away from your typical gas powered vehicles.

It is a changing world and they need to change with it.

If GM is failing it is because people are not wanting what they are selling. They need to change or go away and let another company step up that will provide what we need and want.

And yeah, I am sorry if anyone here is offended by my next statement, but come on $71.00 per hour just because you belong to a union?

[runeight]

We will not reduce contracts!

AP's Auto Bailout Coverage Nearly Ignores Excessive Labor Costs, Omits UAW's Concessions Refusal | NewsBusters.org

Total Compensation Per Hour, 2007-2008 (includes wages and all benefits):
Big Three automakers — $73.08
Toyota — $48.00
All workers — $28.48

The prospect of concessions from the union came up during a meeting involving executives of Detroit's Big Three auto makers and Democratic Congressional lawmakers on Capitol Hill Thursday. But UAW President Ron Gettelfinger made clear that concessions were out of the question, union lobbyist Alan Reuther said in an interview with Dow Jones Newswires Friday.

"Workers and retirees have already made significant sacrifices," said Reuther, paraphrasing remarks that Gettelfinger made to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D- Calif., and others in the meeting, including renegotiated contracts. "We feel we've already stepped up."

Translation: Taxpayers are just supposed to accept the UAW-imposed cost structure as it exists, even though those being bailed out earn $44.60 an hour more in wages and benefits than other working families.

What an outrage. The AP's failure to mention the UAW's stand is journalistically negligent. < Where have you been?


Close the doors.

r8

[Dino]

Originally Posted by runeight

We will not reduce contracts!

AP's Auto Bailout Coverage Nearly Ignores Excessive Labor Costs, Omits UAW's Concessions Refusal | NewsBusters.org

Total Compensation Per Hour, 2007-2008 (includes wages and all benefits):
Big Three automakers — $73.08
Toyota — $48.00
All workers — $28.48

The prospect of concessions from the union came up during a meeting involving executives of Detroit's Big Three auto makers and Democratic Congressional lawmakers on Capitol Hill Thursday. But UAW President Ron Gettelfinger made clear that concessions were out of the question, union lobbyist Alan Reuther said in an interview with Dow Jones Newswires Friday.

"Workers and retirees have already made significant sacrifices," said Reuther, paraphrasing remarks that Gettelfinger made to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D- Calif., and others in the meeting, including renegotiated contracts. "We feel we've already stepped up."

Translation: Taxpayers are just supposed to accept the UAW-imposed cost structure as it exists, even though those being bailed out earn $44.60 an hour more in wages and benefits than other working families.

What an outrage. The AP's failure to mention the UAW's stand is journalistically negligent. < Where have you been?


Close the doors.

r8

I tend to agree with you, but what if the UAW allows for a say 20.00/hour cut? That would still be way more than average, but wouldn't it crush the workers who have grow accoustomed to living on their income and have bills to pay based on that income?

I know, I know, It is better to have less income and a job rather than no job but at the end of the day the results for individuals may be the same.

It easy to say screw the unions but the union members are have to put food on the table just like you and me.

[Wag]

No, keep 'em running. I wanted to buy that new Camaro so they have to be bailed out.



--Wag--