Foot Anchors Review

[fallenarch]

I got my foot anchors today. Opened the box and found a well worked out package with left and right anchors, "footpegs" and bolts. The package even comes with the allen wrenches needed to install the anchors. Frankly, I would save the cost of the allen wrenches, as the install will take some real tools and a tube of lock tight. Still, nice to know they thought about installing the anchors in the packaging. The build quality is pretty impressive. I believe they are hand made, as the holes in the foot peg mounting plate work marks which you wouldn't get from a CNC machine. Still they look impressive and look to be quality parts. The Aluminum is quite heavy, I suppose they used a high tensile strength aluminum over a more brittle alloy. I'm thinking a more brittle, light Aluminum would be a better choice. The foot pegs appear to be milled from a single billet of aluminum, including the screw threads that attach it to the mounting plate - quite trick looking. I believe in a crash these would shear off, which is as it should be IMHO. But it might be nice to through bolt the peg to the mounting plate so that the peg is not destroyed in a minor crash. My only complaint is that the peg mounting plate has to be shimmed out from the bike with washers. I needed 4 washers to get the proper spacing on the left side. Not a bad setup but I would prefer a spacer that moves the plate to the position intended by the designers.

I put the left foot anchor on the bike in about 5-6 minutes. The install was easy with just a t-wrench. Everything fit perfectly with no hitches. Playing around with the bike on the stand the anchors didn't seem to be in the way even with no adjustment and my big size 13 foot. I was in street shoes but was able to get around the anchors with no problem, which I really didn't expect. I did have to try leaning off the right side of the bike and the anchors do feel interesting. It is easy to see where the idea for these came from and why people might like them. However I was surprised I had to lift my foot up and place my toe under the peg to hold it. If I'm being honest I'm not sure I have more holding power in my toe than in my knee against the tank. Anyway this felt very un-natural. I also felt my leg was sort of twisted trying to wedge the toe under the anchor. Oh well, the FA website does say that you have to adjust to the foot anchors and it is a different riding of style.

I'm not sure when I will be able to do a road test. The weather this weekend is not good, but I will get them installed and adjusted as best I can so when the weather breaks I'm ready to go. That's it for now - stay tuned.

 

[IG.]

Hey Arch, I am glad you got right on it. Trying to figure out the best way to proceed... One way, you figure things out by yourself, based on the installation instructions and the training+guide. Another way, you bring up whatever issues/concerns you have right in this thread, and I can provide specific answers. Or, we could use the combination of the two approaches. I could already comment on a few things, but let me know what would work best for you.

P.S. A bit concerned with the clearance on the right side with Vortex+rearsets. Curious to see how the right side install goes. Hope all those shots you sent me made a difference.

 

[fallenarch]

Well you nailed the left side. Feel free to comment. I will probably install the right side on Friday and Sat and do a few hours on the road Sunday provided weather is good. The install part is pretty straight forward, if you notice anything let me know.

 

[IG.]

Arch, I will try to provide brief comments for every small point you are bringing up. Keep in mind that almost everything I will be sharing can be found in installation instructions, the training-guide, and the website. I would encourage you to follow the training-guide, which may seem like a long road, but actually would save you time and aggravation as well as would prevent some missteps. BTW, please do not share the instructions and the guide with anyone. They are intended for the actual users of the product and not for general public.

Yes, the anchors/plates are handmade at this time, which may affect how "pretty" they look, but not the functionality. I can tell you one thing - when I showed a set to the owner of the machine shop, he was very impressed that this came out of my garage with cheapo Harbor Freight equipment. I didn't make much of it and wouldn't remember, however the next time we met he confessed he couldn't sleep the next night trying to comprehend how I managed to make it, and with such precision and quality. The truth is, the HF stuff is so out of spec and loose, so when it comes to machining it's impossible to use it in a "normal" way. I had to find ways to compensate. Half the times, I go by feel, and some of the work, particularly with anchors, is done under the magnifying glass. I had to improve one of the machines, and had to fix them myself a few times.

It takes about 12 hours of labor to make a kit for Hayabusa, and about 10 hours for other bikes. I thought a machine shop could make it for like $200. Boy was I wrong... I laughed at one guy who quoted me $1100, and I stopped laughing when I got a couple more quotes for $1300, and $1500. So, the only choice was to learn how to do it yourself. I love working with my hands, and actually enjoy it until I get tired. CNC machining becomes a viable option when making stuff in quantities.

Mounting plates are made of 6061-T6 aluminum which is pretty strong at 90 Brinell hardness, but allows for some flex. It's a popular material and most rearsets are made of it. Anchors are made of 7075-T6 aluminum which is a lot harder (and more brittle) at 150 Brinell - more than stainless steel (140 Brinell). There are a couple of reasons anchors use different material: to preserve the grooves, and to break off on impact. I periodically check the grooves on the anchor surface by hand, and they are as sharp as on day one. If softer aluminum was used, that wouldn't hold. Go to your bike and check your footpegs by hand, and compare the feel for the indentation on top and bottom of the footpeg. If you had your footpegs for a while, you may feel that the edges on the upper portion are duller than on the bottom portion. That is probably 6061 aluminum.

The hole inside the anchor goes slightly deeper than necessary. As a result, the area where the groves start is the weakest, and is meant to break off at that spot if the anchor hits the ground in a crash. So, a rider can unscrew the left over stub, and put a new anchor on - all in seconds. In another scenario, if the anchor gets ripped out of the hole, a rider can simply screw it back into adjacent position - not ideal, but good enough to get by temporarily.

Foot anchors add approximately 1.5 -2.0 lb to your bike's weight, which is less than the weight of a good meal, and is also around the weight of one riding boot. Without going into details, the benefits greatly outweigh the extra weight, which is BTW located very close to the bike's CG, making it easier for the bike to rotate vs. if it were farther away.

Washers are used as spacers at this time. It's virtually impossible to cover every bike/rearset combination, and this is one practical solution which makes the install a tad more involved, however does not impair the functionality.

Hint: write down anchor position as the hole coordinate (row; column) so you don't forget it. Or, mark with a marker. Otherwise, once you take it off, you won't remember, and would have to go through the trial process again in order to find most optimal position.

As I learned from experience, you can never get the anchor position right by just sitting on the bike. It will take some riding and feel for it. I simply carried 19 mm wrench with me on 1-2 rides until I figured out the most suitable position for either foot. A few times, I just pulled over, adjusted position, and a minute later was back on the road.

You had to lift your foot up possibly because anchor is installed too high. Keep in mind, your riding boots are thicker than your regular shoes, and you may be OK.

Yes, your outside foot is under the anchor and not sticking out. However, only half of your foot under the anchor is OK. To get the idea how well the anchor grabs, try pulling with your fingers. Just be careful. To see how easy the foot slides out, put on your riding boot, stick under the anchor, and then slide upward or back. You will feel virtually no resistance. So, your foot muscle controls whether the anchor holds you, or lets your foot to easily slide out. Keep in mind that in a crash situation, our natural reflex causes our muscles to let go, effectively letting your foot slide out easily from under the anchor.

In back-forward direction, the most optimal position is such that your foot is touching the anchor where your toes connect to your foot. I am a bit concerned with your foot size being 13 and seeing that you already put the anchor on the left side in its utmost forward position. Hope you don't have the need to move the anchor even more forward, otherwise you would need the longer mounting plate.

 

[E Zurcher]

I see an opportunity to address some folks concerns about having your foor trapped in a crash. You state the anchor itself is designed to be brittle and break away in a crash. Maybe you could design a mount similar to what is used on bicycles that has adjustable spring tension for that breakaway point. Think like a ball and socket design at the base of the peg with adjustable retention pressure. Adjust it tight enough that you cant break it away using force imparted in use but it will break away in other situations. That way your foot isn't retained by a binding device, just the peg is.

 

[IG.]

Great suggestion! Thank you! I think you and/or someone else mentioned that approach earlier in a different thread. This is definitely something to think about although I have some reservations. Sort of like on downhill ski bindings.

 

[fallenarch]

Got the right anchor on today but ran into a few problems. The top bolt on the plate is so tight to the rearset that the washers have to be placed behind the rearset. This makes the rearsets a bit more mushy. Also the plate is cut out very deeply so that the bolt can clear the rearsets. I suspect the plate may fail. Another potential issue is that the right FA is very tight to the engine case, looks like getting a size 13 foot in there will be a bit like threading a needle. Still, it's good enough for a test ride which is still looking like Sunday.

That's it for tonight.

 

[IG.]

Arch, if I understand correctly, you are referring the clearance issue with the rearset. Is the top bolt tight because the holes are slightly misaligned due to clearance issue? The washers/spacers have to be placed between the FA plate and the rearset plate. I included smaller washers/spacers just for that. Try those if you didn't. When you say 'mushy', do you mean something is not tight or misaligned, and moves around a little? If this is the case, that's not good. It's hard for me to tell without a close-up... Maybe, you could try 1-2 washer behind the rearset plate while 1-2 between the rearset plate and FA plate?

Don't worry about the cutout. This does not compromise safety. Structurally, the thin layer around the countersink is only for cosmetics. The thickness of the material inside the countersink is around 5 mm - the same thickness as in most rearsets if you measure. It's just when you see it without the cosmetics masking the depth of the countersink, it seems it's too thin. Also, keep in mind the direction of forces which are applied at that point when you hook your foot under the anchor - the forces are "trying" to mostly rotate the mounting plate and not pull it away from the bike.

To clarify, Arch has a unique situation where his rearset is very close to the upper hole, and he is unable to move it back because his pipe is in the way. Standard solution would be: it doesn't fit, so you can't use it. But, we both try our best to make it fit, and it seems this is a pretty close call.

Regarding the anchor position too close to the case... Set the initial position as described in the installation instructions, and then see how it feels when you ride. Maybe you went too far forward. Curious to know if your right foot rubs against the case when you press on the rear brake pedal. If it doesn't, then you should be good.

Another suggestion is to make foot anchor(s) longer by about 5 mm (see installation instructions). Your foot can still be partially outward, and even in the utmost forward position you will barely clear the case while reliably hooking under the anchor. I should've known... size 13 is trouble, LOL.

Before you go riding, there is a lot of fine tuning that you could/should do on a stationary bike (see installation instructions and the training-guide).

 

[RedBusarider]

Looking forward to the report after riding with them.

Lucky you - get to ride in January.
98% chance I will not ride the Busa till mid to late April.

 

[fallenarch]

It's off and on here in Dec and Jan. we get 3-4 goodays a month. My wife's family lives in Mi. I actually love it there but winter is a B#$%h! I think I am a go for Sunday. Supposed to be 50 so that's warm enough to lean a bit.

 

[fallenarch]

Well I got to go out and ride with the Foot Anchors today. The route I used is through the Pungo Area of Virginia Beach; a back road with a pretty decent amount of medium speed left and right turns. Some of the turns are flat, others banked that you can blast through at 100+ mph. There is also a sweeping left hander that you can easily get a knee down on with little drama. There are 2 turns that cannot be made safely at any faster than 30 mph or so. It's a favorite for local sportbikers.

I rode the route in one direction with the FA pegs removed, so the bike was basically normal with the rearsets. I didn’t wear my cold weather gear because I wanted to be able to move – it was pretty cold even at 52 degrees! I had a GoPro Hero 4 setup for the front looking back at the feet. When I went out to suit up, the Hero did not charge because I forgot to turn the power block on at my charge station. I also had my Sony Action camera on the rear looking forward at the feet and it was charged but for some reason it only took one still shot when I turned it on. Oh well probably not good to video the first try anyway.

I stopped before the half way point as I was getting cold. I put the FA pegs on and rode around a parking lot for a while. I moved the pegs to their extreme positions and then rode around the lot a few times in each position. I think I like them in the higher position, the first one I tried actually. In this position my feet have plenty of room. My feet can find the shifter, brake pedals and FA pegs fairly intuitively. However on the right side my foot feels a little limited by the engine case. Still, not so alien in feel – so far so good. I also feel that my fear of getting my foot caught in the anchors was a lot less after my ride. Your boot is much less confined than you might think and while it is possible to get your foot caught up in the additional foot peg, I think it much harder to do than one would think.

I need to start by explaining how I usually turn (Tuff will correct me I’m sure). First I always ride fast (fast for me anyway) on the balls of my feet. When I want to turn left, I move over so the right butt cheek is on the left edge of the seat. At that point, I am holding onto the bike with the inside of my right knee, the cheek on the seat, and most of my weight is on the ball of my left foot. Having the foot on the left peg I am pushing that peg down, which helps cornering, and I do the rest with counter steering. Basically when you are in the proper position the bike will reach a point of equilibrium, and you increase the turn radius by adding throttle and reduce it with less throttle.

With the FAs, you slide off the seat the same way and your weight transfers to the inside foot, but the outside foot shifts forward and up so the peg is across the top of the foot just behind the toes. This does in fact feel like you are more attached to the bike. But for the first time out it felt like I was twisting my leg to keep the toe under the anchor peg. If you stand up and look down at your feet (assuming your gut isn’t in the way, Lol) they stick straight out. When you slide off the seat your leg runs diagonally across the bike and your toe turns outward. So I found myself sort of twisting against my leg to keep the toe in place under the anchor. This was actually reducing my lean, as I was not able to extend the foot as I do when only the ball of the foot was on the peg.

I had a minor incident on the way out (riding with feet in the normal position). I rolled through a little sand and the rear stepped out a bit. Nothing dramatic, but I noticed my outside foot went out from the bike, not up. That means it would probably have slipped out away from the FA peg too. That either validates that the FAs won’t catch your foot in a crash or shows they won’t stop you from falling off the bike depending on your point of view. Another thing you have to get used to is repositioning the foot to catch the FA. On a couple turns I found myself pushing the knee into the tank as I forgot to move to the anchor. IG do you recommend riding with the heel on the pegs so the toes are always in a position to catch the FAs?

If I’m being totally honest, I was not an FA believer when I took IG up on his offer to let me try them at a reduced cost. But having ridden with them they do give you a different feel on the bike. It is up to the rider whether this feeling is an increased control or a feeling of being constrained. If you adjust the anchors so they don't confine your boot, the foot work gets a bit fussy going into turns. I only rode about 50 minutes with the anchor and probably 15 minutes of that was on roads without challenging turns, so I’ll give it a couple more rides and hopefully if the weather allows I can go out to a road we call the Superbike Highway. This road is essentially a track from a layout standpoint and there are some real corners that can be taking at track speeds.

If you ride the bike correctly, you don’t need to get added lean angle unless you are racing. As a big guy, I lean into turns mainly just to get my torso weight as low and forward as possible. I’m not sure why I would need more lean as I am already at the limits of what you should be doing on the street. Further it is arguable that the FAs provide more lean because of the way you have to turn the leg to keep the foot under the peg. But there is no doubt in my mind that some will feel more confidence holding on to the FA peg than pushing their leg into the tank. But until some talented pro figures out a new style of riding, I don't see FAs as a game changer technology. So those are my first impressions. I’ll talk to IG and see if I was doing something wrong or if he has anything to recommend. Next time I’m hoping to ride with the FAs all day on better roads to test on. I’ll also get the cameras setup right!

 

[IG.]

Arch, very nice write-up! Probably more detailed than could be derived from the camera. For others, who are reading, this is work in progress of something very new, so please be patient.

Arch, don't try to go as fast as you are used to. Take it a few notches down, and try to focus on adjusting your riding technique with anchors until you feel it's working for you. Then, gradually increase speed.

Yes, you always ride on the balls of your feet, however in turns where you use anchors, you need to stick your outside foot under.

Another important point is that it is only the anchor which holds you in turn while your upper body on the other side pulls you down. This creates an upward pressure on the anchor which in turn holds your foot in place.

You are absolutely right that you don't point your outside foot outward, at least not to a degree like you used to. You don't have to have your entire foot under the anchor - about 2/3 of your foot is good enough. It will hold you. This would allow you to slightly turn your foot outward. With the foot size 13, it is more challenging, therefore I would recommend to extend the length of foot anchors unless they excessively rub against your boots/pants while at the stop and both feet are on the ground.

For a left-hand turn, the sequence should be the following (adjust to fine tune for personal preference)... Going straight with both feet on the balls, braking, right foot under anchor, shift your butt to the left, counter steer and drop your upper body to the inside in one smooth movement... at this point, anchor is the only thing which holds you in turn... your foot muscle is the only one which is contracted while all other muscles of your body are relaxed. No need to press the knee against the tank which is actually mutually exclusive with the use of anchors. Exiting the turn, the outside foot under anchor can help you to pull your upper body back on the seat without the use of hands, thus minimizing unwanted steering input. Once back on the seat, the foot is back on the balls.

Notice, when counter steering with anchors in a left-hand turn - your left arm, torso, and left leg form a spring-like structure helping you to push the left handlebar. Because your upper body is dropping to the left at the same time, your right hand is naturally pulling the right handlebar.

It's hard to suggest how to position your upper body, but the general approach is to just let it drop to the inside and see what makes it a most comfortable position. It may naturally rotate slightly forward (left side in case of a left-hand turn) which is OK.

Try to abandon the notion that your eyes have to be in line with the horizon. Try tilting your head to the inside along with your upper body. It will feel strange at first, but you will get used to it. This will completely eliminate strain on your neck. Actually, it is the desire to keep eyes with the line of the horizon which forces most riders to cross over their upper body back over the tank.

I am really surprised you could quickly adapt with your foot work. It took me a few rides to get used to it.

I have a feeling you might have adjusted anchors a tad too high. This may prevent you from (or make it difficult) applying upward pressure when you hook your foot under, thus not holding you well.

Remember, the main objective is to put more of your upper body weight on the inside in order to go faster or tighten a line. If you don't, there is no benefit.

When you say you hang off enough, what does this mean? Think about it... if in any turn you hang off more, you reduce the lean angle of the bike. This means at any point you have more traction for braking/acceleration should the circumstances arise requiring one or the other. With anchors, you can just move your head an inch or a few farther to the inside and your upper body will follow, thus tightening a line. You can move your upper body in such a way quickly and effortlessly, and farther away than without anchors. And that's when you don't have to be concerned whether your outside foot may slip and go up in the air.

Although it depends on individual body size/figure, in general, you would reach the maximum effect with anchors when your body position in turn is on the inside and as low as possible. There are a couple of indicators such body position was achieved - your face would be up against the inside mirror or even lower, and your outside arm would be almost straight and is laying comfortably on the tank. Based on your avatar, you seem to hang off to the side really well, but not down low.

Another indicator you are relying only on foot anchors can easily be checked in a right-hand turn. If you can easily open the palm of your left hand so that it's not holding the left handlebar, but rather rests on it comfortably, then you are. As a matter of fact, if you encounter or anticipate any kind of instability (like a bumpy road) in such turn, you simply press more on the left handlebar (to push the bike away) while at the same time moving your head more to the inside. This action slightly straightens the bike, but does not change the line because your upper body is more on the inside. Again, you can do so quickly and effortlessly, and not being concerned that your outside leg would slip out and up in the air.

I think you don't yet trust anchors to hold you which is understandable, however trusting anchors is key. Again, this technique is mutually exclusive with knee pressing against the tank. Frankly, if you think about it, trying to anchor yourself to the bike in turn by pressing on the outside peg and knee against the tank - is really a "best under circumstances" solution as there is nothing else available to better anchor yourself to the bike.

Think about these guys hanging upside down, and trusting their feet to hold their entire weight...

I think that overall you are on the right track, and are going through the process some other riders went through. At a certain point, everything clicks together and starts making sense.

 

[fallenarch]

IG I'm just not sure that anchoring is even the issue. I think if you ride the bike properly (or at least in the current definition of properly) the rider is sort of flying through the air with the bike (as opposed to anchored to it), influencing it as necessary by adjusting their body position to achieve the desired results. It could be argued that if you are afraid of falling off the bike while hanging off, you need to get some rider training at a track. Remember the big idea in a first track day is to experience just how far you can really lean a bike - most are amazed. Further, the forces of cornering are pushing you onto the bike, not off of it. I think even an average club racer will tell you that they could circle the track all day without incident, they just can't do it at a 150% pace. So the question is are you solving a problem people don't actually have? Yes people fall off bikes all the time but I am willing to bet that most of those crashes are due to improper body positioning or pushing past the limits of the environment. On a pro level, these types of crashes are almost always due to over riding the limits. Remember pro riders now leave traction to the electronics and so do things they just would not attempt on a regular motorcycle.

As I have said, FAs do make you feel more connected to the bike. Also I don't think they are as dangerous as I once thought. Further, I commend your spirit and inventiveness. But this feels like an Idea that's good but need a compelling reason for people to buy it. I don't think the road racer wanna be's are going to go for it unless a pro racer uses them to lap the field. The average guy who feels their oats occasionally doesn't need more lean. In my 15 years of street riding I have never fallen, or felt like I was going to fall off the bike in a corner (now in a parking lot, well that's another story. Lol!).

I think you have to get these to a track and do some direct comparisons with a decent track rider, maybe get some video and testimonials. I'm not going to poo poo these as some have because there is definitely something going on here. But I will say I don't know what specific advantage they give me or how to use it. Also I rode with these for 50 minutes - hardly time to evaluate something like this. So I'll keep riding with them for a while to see if their advantages get more apparent.

EDIT: BTW I will make some of the adjustments in your post above and ride some more. I also would like to say IG is a good dude. I offered to let him review these comments before I post them and he said no post them, we'll talk through them in public. So he does believe in his product - it's not just a money making scam for him.

 

[Don Hardcastle]

I just wanted to say that you guys are awesome.... It's refreshing to read a real review and conversation the stays civil... Ride hard guys and keep it going.

 

[notright]

well, it looks like quality craftsmanship any way I look at it.

 

[Tufbusa]

I would encourage you to follow the training-guide, BTW, please do not share the instructions and the guide with anyone.

You are on a campaign to sell your invention to the general motorcycle public while keeping the instructions top secret, not to be shared with anyone until after they have parted ways with their cash? Can you expect anyone to buy into this new innovation when the instructions are purposely withheld from view? Reminds me of Nancy Pelosi who told us the Affordable Care Act (Obama Care) had to be passed before we could learn what's in it! What a treat that turned out to be, eh?

 

[Tufbusa]

Arch, I commend you for a good honest opinion.

From your description of how you hang off your bike, you are doing a grand job. The farther you hang off your bike the less control you have of the bike. Street guys don't need to doing the Marquez hang off nor do track day riders for the most part. You and I should be concentrating on bike control more than how far we are hanging off.

Great job on your Thread, Arch!

 

[jellyrug]

Arch, you are a good guy, I hope good karma comes your way.

Hope some of the folks here learn from you as an example, but that is probably a bit naive.

 

[fallenarch]

You are on a campaign to sell your invention to the general motorcycle public while keeping the instructions top secret, not to be shared with anyone until after they have parted ways with their cash? Can you expect anyone to buy into this new innovation when the instructions are purposely withheld from view? Reminds me of Nancy Pelosi who told us the Affordable Care Act (Obama Care) had to be passed before we could learn what's in it! What a treat that turned out to be, eh?

Well maybe Tuff but IG willingly submitted his FAs to this thread. Again I think IG seriously believes in what he is selling and I respect that.

 

[RedBusarider]

Hey Fallenarch - If you keep those on your bike it looks like your going to need a powder coat job.
Then they would blend in and most people might not even notice you have them.

What I appear to be hearing is that if you are a track rider on a regular basis then these are/might be worth it, however if
you are only a street rider, it's still up in the air as to how much of a benefit these would provide.

50 minutes in cool weather is probably not anywhere near enough time to make a decision on there usefulness.
Maybe 50 minutes on a track in 80° temps might be enough to give a better opinion, but that is probably a few months out or more for most of us even you Arch.

Thanks for the honest write up.