My conclusions about "Hayabusa can't corner" and the track riding poll

[IG.]

So, as of October 30, 2009, the poll says that around 10% of riders ride in advanced group or race, while about 90% of riders corner at slower pace. We all agree that at slower speeds - street riding, track beginner group, and intermediate group - mighty 'Busa's cornering is not an issue at all.

So, for 90% of the riders "Hayabusa can't corner" slogan doesn't hold water. This is very consistent with my personal feel. I am the limiting factor on how quickly I can flick the bike. OK, there is one set of pretty tight S-turns in upstate NY where I feel the bike is holding me, but I can live with that. Everyhwere else street or track, I don't have this problem.

Now, keep in mind that many street riders didn't vote because they don't do track days and shy away from voting. So, the more accurate numbers increase the majority of non-superfast riders from 90% to at least 95% in my opinion.

So, for most of us this is the bike that does well so many things including cornering.

Case closed. Next time we argue, let's keep this in mind.

Peace out.

[dadofthree]

[Tufbusa]

I think your point is: The busa can corner better than 95% of the owners? This is very true and actually the number should be more like 99.5% IMO. If you have never had a race number, you are not capable of milking the busa's capabilities IMO. And most guys that race have no interest in the busa even as a street bike. However, just because you have or have had a race number does not necessarily qualify you to spank the big girls butt!

I think the better analogy is, the busa will limit the ability of the average guy and extend the learning curve due to her limited cornering capabilities.

[IG.]

Originally Posted by Tufbusa

I think your point is: The busa can corner better than 95% of the owners? This is very true and actually the number should be more like 99.5% IMO. If you have never had a race number, you are not capable of milking the busa's capabilities IMO. And most guys that race have no interest in the busa even as a street bike. However, just because you have or have had a race number does not necessarily qualify you to spank the big girls butt!

I think the better analogy is, the busa will limit the ability of the average guy and extend the learning curve due to her limited cornering capabilities.

Completely agree with the first paragraph.

Disagree with the second one. An average guy (like me) will not get to the level where the Busa's cornering ability becomes a limiting factor. Hence, the Busa won't limit/extend the ability or the learning curve of the average guy.

And if one puts the word "DOCTOR" on their pants (the butt side) - they are unbeatable.

On the side note, there is a known Busa's benefit which is not mentioned often, and probably comes from that extra weight. It is rock solid in turns. I mean your are just sitting there cranked over, and thinking to yourself, all right, not much is going on, just hanging in there, waiting for the exit.

[WarBirdII]

I agree with tuffbusa! 90% of us here dont ride pass the busa curve when cornering! That last 10% of us have another bike for that last piece. I have riden my stock busa to its ragged egde and still think its a good all round bike. I agree with you that the added weight helps make the bike more stable in and out of corners as well as its wheel base. Just have to be careful not to miss judge it.... because that weight does work the tire harder, and the cushion of error is very little! And dont forget the engine is wider too, which can hurt you if you go to far over!

[Mr Bogus]

This thread should be pinned....

Props guys!!

(working my way in to that .5% group myself)

[Matso]

In my opinion its not allways about what the busa COULD do it about how comfortable riders feel doing so.
We can all agree that lighter sportbikes are easier to corner with and it feels easier to do so with them, at least i do,

So to be "just as fast" as a average rider on a sportbike you need a bit more effort and that is propably what keeps most away from the advanced group.
But it can be done and like you guys allready stated 99% of the talk that the busa wouldnt be ABLE to corner is just crap, it just needs a bit more balls and effort.

A whole other story is ofc. exiting the corner wich is just as important as leaning the bike in...here i personally feel most handicapped on the bus since the busa has an INSANE amount of grunt and topend power to deliver wich makes it a bit unstable for me to pull hard out of the corners.
It was fun though on the track with the falcon no doubt about it.

[IG.]

Am I the only one who works out? She can be turned in whatever and however you want her to be. Just show her who is the man (or a woman).

[IG.]

Originally Posted by Matso

In my opinion its not allways about what the busa COULD do it about how comfortable riders feel doing so.
We can all agree that lighter sportbikes are easier to corner with and it feels easier to do so with them, at least i do,

So to be "just as fast" as a average rider on a sportbike you need a bit more effort and that is propably what keeps most away from the advanced group.
But it can be done and like you guys allready stated 99% of the talk that the busa wouldnt be ABLE to corner is just crap, it just needs a bit more balls and effort.

A whole other story is ofc. exiting the corner wich is just as important as leaning the bike in...here i personally feel most handicapped on the bus since the busa has an INSANE amount of grunt and topend power to deliver wich makes it a bit unstable for me to pull hard out of the corners.
It was fun though on the track with the falcon no doubt about it.

Try staying in the next taller gear. She will purr like a kitten on the exit, and just as you straighten a tiger will emerge.

[Tufbusa]

Originally Posted by IG.

Try staying in the next taller gear. She will purr like a kitten on the exit, and just as you straighten a tiger will emerge.

That statement tells me you are afraid of the throttle! The reason I say that is you have yet to highside on a corner exit. If you want to control wheel spin on corner exits, keep the beast in the top 25% of the RPM range.

Most highsides on corner exits are due in part because the rider was in a gear to tall for the corner. I'd guess four out of five (Maybe more) bikes we pickup after a corner exit highside is one gear up from the gear they should have been in for the corner.

The busa with tons of low end power and pushing an additional 100 pounds of weight compounds the chance of a highside when a taller gear than necessary is selected.

[sixpack577]

The pipes on the 08, 09's really suck, they drag the road when u lean it over! So if u try ta push it any further, you're askin for a lowside. When they're off, u can chew off the edge of the rear tire's sidewall. The Busa corners and handles awesome.

[fastblackblur]

Originally Posted by Tufbusa

I think the better analogy is, the busa will limit the ability of the average guy and extend the learning curve due to her limited cornering capabilities.

Put very well.

[Mr Bogus]

Originally Posted by Tufbusa

That statement tells me you are afraid of the throttle! The reason I say that is you have yet to highside on a corner exit. If you want to control wheel spin on corner exits, keep the beast in the top 25% of the RPM range.

.

you know I have watched a few videos of guys doing track time and I was surprised how slow the motor was turning..

I do keep the bike in the upper RPM ranges.. in fact so much so that the throttle tends to be a good portion of my braking on corner entry..

I would bet I maintain no less than about 7500 rpm and usually above 8K..

I have also not had much trouble with wheel spin.. the bike has a controlled drift that is fun however.. (leaves nice blackies)

[BA BUSA]

Gee...you can spin a Busa engine AND have more control entering and exiting corners...who would have thunk that
Posted via Mobile Device

[IG.]

Originally Posted by Tufbusa

That statement tells me you are afraid of the throttle! The reason I say that is you have yet to highside on a corner exit. If you want to control wheel spin on corner exits, keep the beast in the top 25% of the RPM range.

Most highsides on corner exits are due in part because the rider was in a gear to tall for the corner. I'd guess four out of five (Maybe more) bikes we pickup after a corner exit highside is one gear up from the gear they should have been in for the corner.

The busa with tons of low end power and pushing an additional 100 pounds of weight compounds the chance of a highside when a taller gear than necessary is selected.

Man, I don't know what are you talking about. I don't want to control a wheel spin on corner exits. I am not at that level.

It's the same confusion as in the other thread about the 'Busa cornering. People on different levels argue about different experiences.

On the side note, I do appreciate your insight. The reason I pick a taller gear is that when I go slow, let's say while learning a new track, that same taller gear becomes "just the right" gear as my speed increases.

I do agree with you 100%, that spinningthe rear at the lower torque range will make the tire to hook up too abruptly. I am aware of all that. Just not at that level, yet, if ever.

I also think that most people highside because they scare themselves when the rear starts spinning, and chop the throttle. As a matter of fact, I've done visual (mental) practicing of various scenarious which are hard/dangerous to encounter or practice in real riding, including the rear wheel spin, and in this particular case I re-programmed my reflexes to never back off the throttle, but rather hold it steady.

[raydog]

I disagree with everyone.

[IG.]

And I disagree with you, everyone else, and with the guy I see in the mirror. Finally, we all disagree on something.

[djsin]

my race number is 138 but with 77 you get ate(8) more then 69 with that number and 138 gives you twice as much

[Tufbusa]

Originally Posted by IG.

Man, I don't know what are you talking about.

This doesn't surprise me.


I don't want to control a wheel spin on corner exits. I am not at that level.

I'll try to give a quick explaination as to why, even though you are an entry level rider, you should be concerned about controling wheel spin.

Throttle control is the most important aspect of cornering. Without throttle control you are destine to coast around corners at very slow speed or crash. Motorcycles don't like coasting through corners. You need to add throttle to transfer some weight from the front wheel onto the rear. How much weight you transfer depends entirely on how much throttle you apply.

Here is where you should be concerned about managing your mighty busa through the corners. Your bike has tons of torque. Torque is what spins the wheel, not HP. With all this wheel spinning power available in your right hand it's extremely important to manage it properly.

You are all leaned over in a corner to the point you must add throttle to keep from overwhelming the front tire and barking up your new leather suit. At this point, "THE DIFFERENCE IN A GOOD CORNER DRIVE AND A VICIOUS HIGH SIDE is about an eighth of an inch of throttle.

Let's pretend you are in your favorite taller gear because you like the way it pulls so smoothly on corner exits at 4K rpm. Now you add some throttle and the engine begins to give you that soft purr of power. If you just happen to give the beast to much throttle, and it's very difficult to tell at low rpm just how much throttle you are applying, this time you actually applied that extra eighth inch of throttle. The rear spins up, you are still leaned over and the rpm instantly goes from 4K to 10K. When this happens the rear don't step out, it violently pitches out to a full broad side at which time the rear regains traction. You get yourself a very expensive superman launch that is apt to break bones. Your mighty busa will also become airborne and go tumbling and bouncing to a stop. You'll need a box to pick up the pieces.

Now, if you had been at 9K rpm when the tire lost traction the beast would have spun up slower and been manageable. Even if you were WOT it would only gain 2K rpm before hitting the revlimiter. A manageable situation.

I heard Valentino Rossi once say, you must be in the top 25% of the rpm in order to manage wheel spin on corner exits. But then who the hell is Valentino to be telling us how to manage wheel spin?

I can assure you one thing, you will either continue to be slower than the second coming of Christ or you will encounter wheel spin at some point. You'd be wise to educate yourself on how to manage it rather than waiting for the crash and end up with that startled look of a deer in the headlights saying "WTF happened"!

[PaceMaster]

Raydog... I laughed so hard i almost spit coffee.
Those of you that don't know Raydog.... This senior citizen KNOWS HOW to RIDE a Busa too it's limit.....I learned alot from him this summer following close on some of the tightest turns ever.. he would just drop turn that thing in at 25 down to the pegs and exit HARD and always with the revs up. Cool thing seeing him do it i got brave and was doing the same thing. Is was just shaking at the break we took right after that.
Now for the flip side ... yes we are heavy.. compared to 600's and liter bikes.....BUT if the smaller bikes have expert riders we could be in trouble....On the other hand if those on smaller bikes have limited experiance....different outcome.
Ps early in our ride we were going around a high speed sweeper, me right behind him and i could see his rear tire making a beautiful black smear on the road... prolly 95 mph at max lean...WooHoo