French K7 Busa in trouble (Clutch problems) :(

K

Kahiros

Registered
Hello Guys,
once again i'm back for asking your help.
In fact i hope to find someone that has expiremented the same troubles than me.
Impossible to find answers with my french collegues, neither on french boards.

The point is that i have no more progressivity while releasing the clutch lever.
I start releasing, the bike start moving and suddently the clutch grip hard (like if i've released the lever suddently).
It happended on all gears but it's the most obvious in 1st

So the bike is a 2007, it has 20 000 km.
The 12 000 first km were without problems, but since 1 year the problem has appeared.

I've already replaced all clutch disques including the flat and the elastic ring, including also the pressure springs => absolutely nothing change.

I've also tried a new master cylinder and inspected the slave cylinder => no change, the same problem.

I've probably missed something but don't know where to look. I can change the clutch itself or the nut but afraid to burn Euros without any effect :banghead:

For specialists find some pictures and videos i've made in case you see something wrong:

The old discs

One last thing, i would like to show you the Dual Tips adapated on a busa.
I've asked your help in order to try to find them last year but i've finaly decided to do an adapt by myself


Thanks for your help, :bowdown:
Kahiros

13122011.jpg

13122010.jpg

13122012.jpg
 
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What type of engine oil are you using, and did you replace the steels along with the fibers?

If it were me I would start with bleeding the clutch hydraulics.
Flush some new brake fluid through the system again and see what that does.
Good Luck!

I like the look of the cans! :thumbsup:
 
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Normally when the clutch basket wears, you will get harsh engagements and it will be difficult to modulate with the lever. However your basket doesn't look that bad, some signs of rubbing and a very slight groove but I've seen much worse.

Does the slave cylinder pushrod move freely?

I'd guess it's either the slave cylinder or the clutch basket, but from your picture the clutch basket doesn't look terrible.

Unrelated, the dual tips look excellent on your bike!
 
Thanks guys for your answers and happy you like these cans.
By the way if someone wants the plans for the mid pipes i'll be able to send them ;)

- About the fluid i've completely changed it after checking the slave cylinder
- About the oil it's a 10w50 full synthesis, the brand is MOTUL
- About the pushrod, yes it move freely, now i'll maybe take a look to the second pushrod (number 20 on the schema)

i suppose testing a new oil could be a good thing too even if i've used that kind of oil before without problems

I have something else to try to describe you about the clutch.

When the bike is cold, imagine i'm stopped.
- I first add gaz to 4000 rpm
- I release slightly the lever
- I feel a big vibration in the clutch and the bike start moving "jerky" (chattering) until i completly release the lever
Then the more the oil temperature rise the less i feel it, until it completly disappears

Not sure i've well described it :rofl: Can't find the most appropriate words sorry :whistle:

Maybe the causes are the same, or i'm definitely unlucky and i have to find two causes ???

;) Thanks again :bowdown:
 
Did it first do this on it's own, or were you doing something to it, and then it started?
I am assuming the first time you tore the clutch down was to fix this, or were you doing something then it started?
Just trying to narrow it down.
 
And the clutch slave cylinder checked out okay? No groves in cylinder wall, o-rings in good shape, piston moves freely without catching, lubed cylinder wall & o-rings with fluid when re-assembled?
 
No, the first time was to change the discs in order to fix that.
Because of 1 or 2 wheeling by day i was sure to be responsible of the problem and the discs were the most obvious.

About the slave cylinder, i've completly disassambled it, the cylinder wall were scratch free, the o-ring like a new one.

First of all i'll maybe try a different oil 10W40 from another brand ?

Kahiros
 
My guess would have been the master cylinder or slave cylinder but since those are new and the basket checks out. My only other guess would be the back torque limiter (#5) in the pic.

How does that look and have you switched to the 1-piece mod yet?
 
Mike, thanks for these links.
But by memory i've well rplaced them, by the way after replacement absolutely nothing change, so the problem being 100% the same i suppose it's ok

Got-Busa, it's the first time someone ask me about this part, what it is exactly ?
Honestly i'm not sure of it, i've not particularly inspected it
Where could i found a 1-piece version and what are the benefits ?

Thanks again and again :beerchug:
 
That mod is from Brocks, the second link I posted above.
http://www.brocksperformance.com/Instructions/Hayabusa/S13-CM-ULTRA.doc
I did it and it did stop chatter under hard take off's.
It also tightened up the drive train, and made my clutch like the Suzuki clutches of the past that I love.
You can lock up the rear wheel with a high speed dpwnshift if you make that mistake.
If it were me I would try it.
Gives you a chance to check in there one more time too.
 
Ok, it's really a new light in the darkness for me.
I'm actually completing the built of my homemade Bike LIFT
After that i'll open it again and send you additional pics.

Thanks a lot guys ! :bowdown:
 
Hi Kahiros,

it's definetly #5 shown on your schema.

This little unit "releases" the clutch a bit in case the rear wheel drives the engine too hard (i.e. high rpm, gearing down and closing the throttle). Without the torque delimiter your rear wheel could "stamp".
The racers in former times released the clutch manualy to prevent the rear wheel from stamping.

Now your (and many of my Busa friends) problem is the wastage of that item. Even though you release the clutch lever it still remains locked. So the bike won't start to roll and you release the lever a bit more to get it running. Still it locks.
On some time it unlocks and the clutch "grabs" all the amount of place you have given too much by releasing the lever and the bike jerks up and away. (It's like you have filled up "kangaroo gas" :laugh:)


Now you have two opportunities:
1) Buy a new part #5
2) Decomission part #5. You can order a kit to have it done. See KOJAKS Turbo Hayabusa POWER SHOP -- Turbo Hayabusa Umbau Zubehör Teile

In case you have probs with the german language, you can ask B-12 here on the bord, he lives in Saarbrücken (Germany) near the french frontier. He knows what I mean and he can talk in french with you... :-)
Just tell him you have probs with the antihopping...


Go one of the two ways and your prob is solved.

Ciao
D1
 
Hallo
a Paris , tu ne connais pas Castor ?
Je pense quil peut t aider acec ca.
Autrefois on peut t aider d allemagne. J peus tenvoier quelque fotos comme faire the clutch-mod.

:welcome:
 
Schleiffe, thanks for your confirmation and for such description, can't wait to open it again and check that!!!
By the way, not sure what to do (replace or upgrade), that kind of mod is completly unknown in France ??? And the price is nearly the same

B-12 = Bandit 1200 i guess ?
Yes i know Castor, in fact my first attempt to fix this was in accordance with him.
But nobody (garages included) never told me about #5

B-12 it would be great if you can share some picks of the mode! :thumbsup:


Thanks, Milosh :cheerleader:
 
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